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Destiny

Discuss all things Destiny.
Edited by Phantom139: 10/24/2014 6:47:51 PM
373

Why you SHOULD consider buying the Destiny DLC.

So by now, most of you have seen some people come onto these forums and make fools of themselves with these wild theories and post their silly "messiah's" video as their only proof to these theories, and I've honestly been having a cakewalk of laughter here in terms of this, and then they attacked me with words, so now it's time to take the gloves off here and punish them with the truth. They cite a video of why you shouldn't buy the DLC, so it's only fitting that you read my post on why you should buy the DLC packs. So let's get to it. First off, that introduction you read there will be the only bashing I do in this post, I'm done with long rant filled posts that usually catch the attention of some people as pure negativity. This post will have absolutely none of that, I'm only going to present the facts, and discuss them and I'll let common sense take over from there. Personally, I would have done better with my own counter-video, but to be honest, most of you I believe are tired of seeing go to 'x' Youtube page, watch, like & subscribe, so no, I don't want you to do that, just give this a good read. :) So most of you have at least seen a few of my posts or have read them, and some of you may not know everything about me. I run my own independent game development company. I have numerous years of programming experience, as well as experience in design and implementation from some small projects I have worked on or with, so you can trust me when I say that I know how games "work" internally. So, let's start with breaking down the most "shot at" point, which is Destiny's currently lacking story. Some of you know, and others don't know, that the lead writer of the story for Destiny left Bungie shortly after the first E3 trip that Bungie took, where they revealed a video of gameplay and talked about some mechanics in the game. Why he left is unknown to us, but what we do know is that during that time, and the time of the alpha/beta, the story as well as numerous game mechanics were changed. This is something that happens all too much in video games, let's not all forget the days of Halo 2 where we had a trailer of an awesome mission, and that wasn't in the final game. Content and mechanics get cut due to all sorts of reasons. Mechanics such as Trading, Gambling, and others were cut from the final product. The reasons, can only be told to you by Bungie, so I cannot provide it to you, just know that they may have been present before, but are gone now. As for the "amount" of story content in the game, this is where some frustration comes into play by people, but you need to also realize that Bungie had to change the story in about a Year's time, so they may have been running out of said time to get everything they wanted done, this is also something that can happen when you have big name titles, so the developer will polish up as much as they can to release to you. This is where the DLC packs enter the picture. How this works is when a game is nearing completion, the team behind the design will start working on the DLC packs for the game, this is how it always works, and sometimes this content may be put on the game's disk as a placeholder or a template to upcoming content (See DestinyTracker for info), in fact, many of you have already found some of this placeholder content, but if you've actually looked carefully, you'll notice it's not done yet. I think the best example I can provide is the upcoming "awesome" new gun Necrochasm, which is a reward for completing Crota's End on Hard. Have a look [url=http://db.destinytracker.com/inventory/item/2809229973]at this beauty[/url], but if you look closely, you'll see the noted [b]Cursebringer[/b] perk has a template icon in it's place, and there is no 3D model present for this gun. This tells us that the concept design and base stats were placed in the game prior to it going gold, but the actual implementation isn't actually done yet, IE: It's being worked on, sound familiar? [quote]People are working on this content right now at Bungie. It's not finished.[/quote] Also, if you personally haven't actually explored some of these areas that have been found, please do so, and tell me what you actually find in there. You'll find a lot of glitches, non-working elements, and even placeholder or template art which is obviously not finalized, so again, as DeeJ best said, the content is being worked on. So all of these threads and hate messages about "Disk Locked Content" are not valid my friends, all MMO style games use the tactic of prior implementation to cut on the design work of the developers, IE: They're making it easier to deliver the content to you, sooner. This isn't to scare you, or some corporate bullcrap, these "pre-designed" areas are in place to get the content to you much quicker. WoW uses this tactic for every expansion they make, and that game is still going strong, and the people don't complain about those areas. So, why are you community, doing the same to Bungie, when they're using this tactic to [b]HELP YOU[/b], the player? It just doesn't make sense to me. The last thing I'd like to address here is something very cool, the fact that those are "placeholders" in the DB of the game files tells me that there's definitely a lot of cool new stuff actually coming to the game. I believe fully, that the "leak" or "rumor" of the third subclass and the content of Crota's End from the anonymous tester is 100% true, in fact, if Bungie was dispatching their Ninja's to "delete it or face a ban", then it kind of points to the fact that it's probably true. So people please, chill out. This is a MMO-Style game that is very early in it's life. We need to be helping Bungie give us the experience we want to enjoy here. They don't want to read hundreds of rant posts and hate all day, they want honest feedback to help bring the experience to you. Bungie employees are also Guardians, they want to have the exciting journey that you're taking part in. Don't take in these hate filled videos with silly theories as truth. Unless the information is directly confirmed as truth by means of Bungie telling us that it is, or by means of us actually seeing it for ourselves, it is nothing more than a personal opinion, which is not true information, which is why we finally reach the end of my discussion, and why I think you'd be missing out on an awesome experience to let one 30 minute video ruin what would be a wonderful expansion to your game. Game on Guardians, and I'll see you in Crota's End in December! [b]Edit: My note on the upcoming content part has been clarified ash55, the post/thread was deleted due to it breaking the rules of the forum, genuine leak or not[/b] [b]Edit 2:[/b] [b]Too Long Didn't Read[/b] People who are posting videos on youtube attacking your decision to buy the DLC are not legitimate because there is no solid proof to what they are providing you with, IE: they're lying to you, or pushing an agenda of their own. You should at least consider buying the DLC's due to the cool stuff we've already seen some templates for in the game's database, and finally, the DLC isn't done yet, it's being worked on right now, so these threads and theories suggesting otherwise are wrong. [b]To All:[/b] I do appreciate the select individuals who have provided constructive comments, however the most of you are obviously too hooked on negativity to resort to attacks on me and anyone who disagrees with you, which is honestly an attack on your own credibility. Your "Self-Entitlement" behavior will not be tolerated any more in this thread, if you have nothing constructive to provide, don't bother posting as you will simply be ignored. Opinions the other way will be completely ignored without a solid piece of evidence to back up your claim (Posting a youtube video will not be treated as such). Finally, in no way or form am I required to post a video to make my own point, if you're too lazy to read or at least form a reasonable opinion based on facts, then don't bother posting either. Finally, to anyone who thinks attacking my credibility is a good idea, I guarantee you that it will only hurt you when I press that shiny report button for misinformation, I have provided my credentials many times before, so I don't need to do so again.

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  • TLDR make a video pl0x

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  • It will likely be a re skinned grind so no not buying the DLC

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  • Nice try deej...

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  • [quote]As for the "amount" of story content in the game, this is where some frustration comes into play by people, but you need to also realize that Bungie had to change the story in about a Year's time[/quote] It's not the amount of story, it's the storytelling, the delivery. Change the story? Why? If Bungie lost their lead writer, they should have hired a new one that could write. Cinematics in Bungie's prior game are a time when I shush anybody in the room, even if I watched them a thousand time. Destiny cinematic is the time I go get a glass of milk... [quote]This is a MMO-Style game that is very early in it's life. We need to be helping Bungie give us the experience we want to enjoy here. [/quote] The game wasn't advertised as an MMO, but as using some of the gamestyle elements, I don't play MMO. I've never felt the need to help Bungie give me the experience I liked or wanted. They delivered it. They seem happy with their latest game and a lot of people are enjoying it the way it is, I don't foresee many drastic changes in the future. Will play for what I enjoy, the visuals, the music and rewarding game mechanics. The story? Too late for that, the tone has been set in this introduction to our adventures, my narrative is Marty's music. "Not by words alone". Thankfully.

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  • Very positive post. My biggest fear is that the DLC will just be 4-8 missions, all the exact same as what we have already played. Go to x planet, murder hundreds of its inhabitants (which you don't know anything about except that we are not supposed to like them) get your ghost to do something, protect him, kill boss or repeat protecting him again. This is why I am not excite for the DLC or hopeful that it will help.

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  • 0
    My brother also does some programming and he has said largely the same thing about the "glitch rooms" so I see your point there. Here's where I disagree though (although I still like the game and have already bought the DLC so no BFD) I manage a manufacturing company and inevitably when you make just about anything you have a tolerance; in my case it's measured by fractions of an inch. So if one of my customers wants something to be say 1 inch it can be slightly bigger than that or slightly smaller. and lets say the customer needs 1000 of them each one can be slightly bigger or slightly smaller. Well managing employees is a real pain alot of the time everyone has issues and excuses some legit (I need to get my kid from school) some less than legit "I drank a fifth of whiskey last night because it was wednesday and I'm hung over". So days you get great performance sometimes not so much. If all goes well you get a couple "widgets" a little out of spec. But than you get that time when every part is technically in spec but when you compare each and every one of the them they look like complete trash and I really don't want to send this junk out to my customers it's so half-a**ed. That is my impression here there isn't anything that is "TECHNICALLY" out of spec but really we should be throwing about 1/3 to 1/2 this Trash away and make new ones, because if we don't our customers (that'd be us the destiny community) just might go out and find a new supplier. We'll see if the DLC makes up for the barley in spec game that i've been playing and yes I do play it but the story is junk and the gameplay is good but it is contently in need of updating and tweeking would you be cool if every week you had to send in your car for repairs for 30 min even if you didn't have to pay for it? HELL NO. DON'T GIVE BUNGIE A PASS HOLD THEIR FEET TO THE FIRE AND MAKE THEM COMMIT TO HIGH STANDARDS THAT'S WHAT WERE SAYING.

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  • Seriously considering leaving Destiny cuz of the connection issues. Starting to get really silly and frustrating. DLC or not.

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  • Finally someone who talks some sense

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  • A: Prove you're a professional game developer (which means you have a business filed within the state which you reside and pay business taxes). B: I'm still not buying it.

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  • I'm sure I will get it but I am also pretty sure it isn't going to be double the size of borderlands dlcs making it worth $20. With what we know they include so far they are pretty small, unless they actually introduce a new area each the new missions they introduce in existing areas are not a lot of content

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  • Im buying it regardless of what anyone else says.

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  • Calling this game an MMO, completely invalidated your entire arguement.. it is nothing but a First person shooter, look on the box it even says that..GG

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    4 Replies
    • Pretty goddam tired of all you idiots telling people what they should and shouldn't buy. It's like personal opinion doesn't even exist anymore.

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      • I got the Limited Edition, because flaws or not, the game's plenty fun and I look forward to new stuff in it. As for DLC whiners, well, kids just don't know how nice it is to download some DLC in minutes or less, instead of having to wait for expansions that you have to wait years for. Recall Lord of Destruction? Brood War? To name a few.

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        • Good effort but I'm no more convinced that I should buy it than I am that I should never buy it. I almost never watch the YouTube videos unless they're intended to be comedic takes on Destiny. Maybe I'll buy the DLCs when they regroup that at a more reasonable price like all of them at the end of 2015 for the price of Destiny at release. That seems more like the thing I should do.

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        • I'm sold! Go team BUY DLC!!!!

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          • I agree with you. Great thread.

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          • Would have read but then I realized it was an essay.

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          • Eat a dick

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            • No

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            • Bought it anyw- Oh wait! It's not just another one of *those* threads, is it? Bought it anyway - looking forward to it! :)

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            • I approve!

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            • Edited by cyrus f51618: 10/24/2014 7:57:09 AM
              First kudos for a well formulated argument on the subject. I will now address the points I agree and disagree on. Agreed the locked content is not ready. Yes there are templates in place. Yes the story of the game is an issue. Is it the biggest? No. But more on that later. You said the writer left after the e3. Fine. But was this guy the only writer on earth to provide a meaningful story? No. I agree on the unfinished release and polishing-part. That doesn't make it right though! [b]If the game isnt ready then dont release it!!! Im not a paid pre-alpha tester[/b]. I bought the game at full price. The least I can expect is a decent product. Imho Destiny's biggest issue is not its story. Otherwise no one would be playing it anymore. The biggest issue of the game is design. But before I start here first the things I actually like about the game: Great gameplay mechanics Superfluid movement Gunfights feel good Guns feel also great Great looks and art design The closest thing you get to a shooter MMO that doesn’t look like from the 90s (ie defiance). Good focus on teamplay and coop Now the design issues of the game that are the reason for me to stop and wait. [b] Loot:[/b] They copied a lot of borderlands like having characters being all able to wield the same weapons but with different specials. But they didn’t copy the loot system. Instead they implemented a sad excuse for loot. Im currently 28 and I get green items 90% of my time. I found 2 legendaries in like over 100 hours. thats ridiculous. [b]Repetitive Mission Design:[/b] Wait at x while dinklebot is scanning z. Wow awesome. Defend. Rinse repeat [b]No end game content[/b] ok apart of the raid otherwise we repeat endless story missions we already played. [b]No skippable cutscenes![/b] [b]The raid[/b] yeah great stuff. played the last one 4 hours without any reward at all Bugs prevented completion [b]No interesting NPCs[/b] A game can get away with average story but without interesting characters its only a grind fest [b]no strikelist above 24[/b] [b]no proximity chat[/b] [b]no switchable weapon sets[/b] [b]no quick function for ammo synthesis[/b] [b] why can’t i switch armor without losing its light?[/b] If I get a new exotic armor I can spend another 30+ hours in levelling it up? No. don’t think so. [b]PvP changes destroy the PvE[/b] PvP… ah don’t get me started on this one. So yeah[b] these are the reasons for not buying the DLC[/b]. I also recommend to wait and see if Bungie does anything about the broken game. So far all we get is “we are listening”. Yeah. “I’m listening”, too.

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              • [quote]I run my own independent game development company. I have numerous years of programming experience, as well as experience in design and implementation from some small projects I have worked on or with, so you can trust me when I say that I know how games "work" internally.[/quote]You mean [url=http://www.phantomdev.net/]Phantom Games Development?[/url] I won't deny that you are in fact an indie dev but I'd say you're more of a hobbyist learning the ropes than you are a tenured programmer with years of experience. Which there's no shame in of course, but even the most well established indie company can't claim to know the challenges of making a AAA pusedo-MMO with a $500 million dollar budget and 400+ staff with your composer and lead writer leaving mid way through the project. I'm sure several developers can come in here with similar claims, but either way their input hardly contains any "hidden background information non-developers would know about" in most cases, it's just an argument to authority. Hell I could claim to be an indie game dev with my own unsurfaced company too without lying, that doesn't make my claims any more valuable. [quote]This is something that happens all too much in video games, let's not all forget the days of Halo 2 where we had a trailer of an awesome mission, and that wasn't in the final game.[/quote]Except that was an E3 demo specifically designed to show off game mechanics at E3 and it was obvious that was it's only purpose. People aren't complaining that we don't have a boss battle within the first five minutes in the game you need legendaries to finish, which is what happened in the E3 Destiny demo, people are complaining about advertised content still in the game. Not to mention HALO 2 is literally the worst example of a well developed console game you could probably think of. Halo 2 was so buggy and hack and slashed together that it's OBVIOUS the game isn't what it was supposed to be. In fact Bungie commonly cite Halo 2 as an unbearable development hell that achieved no where near what was originally planned for it. They also add on that the campaign and every feature of Halo 3 in it's entirety was originally planned for Halo 2 but they were being crunched down so hard they had to cut out all those features. And you're using that as your example for a well developed game? The claims aren't even that the story has changed, it's that it was shredded down into something that pales in comparison to it's original creation and given how much thought they put into the GDC presentation it's not hard to believe that a far more deep and interesting plot was originally planned for the game. Hell I could probably make up a more interesting plot dealing with just one of the enemy factions than they have made for the full game. [quote]How this works is when a game is nearing completion, the team behind the design will start working on the DLC packs for the game, this is how it always works, and sometimes this content may be put on the game's disk as a placeholder or a template to upcoming content[/quote]Except there's a difference between "starting work on new content" and "finishing a whole DLC and putting it on the disc before the game even goes gold". These levels they're not "works in progress" they're not "unfinished buggy messes" the only thing that prevents them from being fully functioning working levels are AIs and kill barriers, which are menial in their implementation. Esspecially given how we KNOW they can easily just shove in some kill barriers the same way we could in Halo: Reach Forge, it wouldn't make sense for them to suddenly remove them and rebuild them from scratch when making a new game. [quote]all MMO style games use the tactic of prior implementation to cut on the design work of the developers[/quote]You mean MMOs where you don't actually have to pay for the expansions? Or games like say Eve Online who have released 4 expansions in the last year? 100mb updates every couple of days makes it excusable, MMOs update constantly, but Destiny is only getting 2 updates in it's life cycle, everything else will be minor bugfixes. Either way though the locked in content has more things other than simply the level to do than Destiny does, you're not holding it back because you don't know what to make the vendor sell or what they'll say, you're not doing it to test out random AI spawns in the wild, everything they need to "finish" these areas are already on the disc, hell the fact that a lot of them are already functional and have props put in place proves that fact. You're just making excuses based off optimal conditions and a warped viewpoint rather than looking at the facts.

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                • Edited by R McKenna: 10/24/2014 8:37:30 AM
                  way to long, but unless they include space battles and some fresh ides dlc aint worth shit

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                • the key thing people are saying here is dont reward bad time management if you think destiny is a great (like i do) but feel its just lacking in content and not 10 years worth of content as in the usual £50 worth of content at release then you feel abit annoyed they rushed destiny but these thing happen now if you add that dlc content is already on the disk it means pre release development time was being pulled away from the vanilla game to build dlc which would lead to less content at launch (just to clarify the time between a game going gold and release is fine to build dlc then but not prior) ultimately destiny seems to be taking the role of a anti-halo combat evolved halo combat evolved set how high the standard for FPS should be destiny is trying to set how low the standard for dlc should be if the dlc proves to double the content in the game then i will admit i was wrong but still blame bungie for a rough start if the leak was accurate..... cheers for teaching me never to buy season passes

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