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Destiny

Discuss all things Destiny.
Edited by Jurgen Blitz: 10/6/2014 11:15:08 AM
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Bungie, let´s discuss Trading openly and politely

Dear Bungie, We know you guys got a lot of frak recently and bad rep, even among your own community. Granted, a lot of things in this game are badly designed. But, I believe that you want to make things better. Even if it goes step by step. Things like the weapon correction coming soon and the fix of the Cryptarch system are small but welcome steps, and it goes to show that you, in fact, liste to the community (even if you never answer). So let´s discuss trading openly and politely, like gentlemen. I don´t know if trading was taken away by command of Activision. Obviously, if that was the case, you wouldn´t say it outloud or have much power over the matter, so I´ll let it be. But let´s assume for a second that you really thought that the game would be better off without it. Bungie, let me put this in the simplest way possible: Implement trading, because [b]EVERYONE is going to win[/b] and be happier with the game. [b]Especially you guys[/b], because our happiness will give you a better reputation and gives us incentives to stay in the game. [b]1) It will make players less frustrated with the RNG loot/decoding system[/b] Last time that Xur came around, I got an exotic helmet engram, thinking that, since I have a Warlock and a Titan, I had good chances of getting something I could actually use. And what are the odds: I got the Mask of the Third Man, a [u]Hunter[/u] piece. I have it saved on my bank/vault for now, in case something changes, but my face when that helmet popped out… There are a lot of Hunter users out there who wanted this exact helmet. Now my only chances to find a use for it would be to a) create a Hunter (can´t be bothered to bring another char to 20, don´t have the time) or b) to dismantle it and get shards (which would be a pity for such a unique and beautiful helmet). But what if I could give it away? What if a Hunter had got the, for example, Helm of Inmost Light, and we could trade it and both get what we want? And the same goes for some Sapphire Wire that I have: there´s no use that I can make out of it, but others could. [b]EDIT:[/b] so as some have suggested.... yeah, bad example, because having exotics going around like candy would have been a bad idea. But I also got a legendary helmet for Warlocks and legendary gloves for Hunters. Items with that rarity could still be traded, although with some kind of temporal or numerical limitation to avoid breaking the balance. [b]2) It will make the Tower actually be “social”, and give players new ways to interact[/b] Right now we just go to the Tower to get rewards, bounties, and then head back to orbit. But there´s nothing truly [u]SOCIAL[/u] that we can do there, except play football and dance. If trading was implemented, players would gather there to trade, make deals, etc. The Tower will actually become a meeting spot, instead of just being a transitional point between instance and instance. In MMO´s, in-game economies that allow players to trade materials between one another using different “currencies” (instead of a bidirectional model between player and game with one single economy, like the model we have now) are a mechanic that allow people to socialize and even form new bonds as players. In other games I played, I would end up having “regular traders” with which I talked sometimes, teamed up to play, etc. [b]3) Players will now have a reason to explore the vast maps you have created.[/b] Out of boredom I once went to old Russia to explore unseen routes. And man, you guys have created BEAUTIFUL maps and worlds. Outstanding. But that´s the thing: most players [i]don’t have any valid reason to go anywhere[/i] except the usual routes “A to B and C”. Yes, there are patrol missions, but they are also set on restricted routes. However, stuff like Spirit Bloom, Relic Iron, Spin Metal and Helium Filaments are pretty much all over the place, and so are chests. With trading, some people would devote some time to farm these R&D materials, exploring the world in the meantime and finding some of the little hidden areas and gems out there. [b]4) It will provide us with a legitimate shortcut to avoid some of the grind and repetition[/b] Yes, we are meant to climb our way to the top via hard work. But when you finish an instance and all you get is a blue engram, how are you meant to progress? Doing it five more times? If your answer is “yes, that´s how it´s meant to be”, then Bungie, please be aware that people can get tired of repetition, and it is usually a main reason for many people to quit games. With trading, if I need that final Ascendant Shard to upgrade my armor, instead of repeating a strike or raid that I have already done that day, I can check my vault and see if I can offer something to a fellow player. And if I don´t, perhaps I can gather some stuff that he/she needs. But as of now, our only option is to repeat stuff over and over and[i] zzzZZZZZzzz[/i]…. -------------------------- Now, if you think trading is not a good idea, here´s three arguments that I can picture: two of them that you have already stated, and one that could be the real reason: [b]- We want players to earn their gear, and feel like each piece was the outcome of a great victory![/b] Which would be a great argument, if the game didn´t have a RNG loot system that sometimes even seems to penalize performing great, as seen on [url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gzopWRXK_r4]this video[/url] or as many of us have seen when the worst guy in our Crucible team gets a Legendary. And hey, I was that guy once. Now I got better, but I was “that guy”. And I was happy about it, but it felt incredibly unfair [b]EVEN TO ME.[/b] If that is your main reason, then change the loot system, because right now the actual in-game effort, performance and teamwork mean very little when it´s time to collect rewards. Or why did you think that people exploited The Cave? [b]- We want to avoid having gold spammers![/b] Then how about this: restrict trading to ITEMS only, and no buying stuff from one another through Glimmer. And if you want to make it even more secure, enable a code system that lets the game know what items were bought from vendors, and which ones came from loot, and restrict the trade only to items that were collected (like Spinmetal, Blooms, etc) or drops. This would prevent people with higher faction levels to simply buy stuff from vendors and use that for trade against players that haven´t stacked that many rep. And taking Glimmer out of the picture for trading is also a good idea, because the Glimmer yield can be artificially increase by use of Ether Seeds, Black Wax Idols etc. and therefore give an edge to players that use them and have them, over those who don´t. Bungie, if this is the main reason, there are ways to prevent malpractices in trading. Sure, the “rotten apples” are crafty and could find ways but, as we say in Spain, right now “the righteous are being punished because of the sinners”. And[i] this feels bad[/i], man. [b]- We want people to grind over and over for stuff, spending more time in our game.[/b] Hey, you won´t say it out loud but THIS could be another reason for you guys. In that case, and as I said before, don´t underestimate your own players. People can get very tired of repetition and limitation. And a lot of players including myself are already wearing tired of the little variation of the game, and it´s not even month 2 of a game that allegedly has a 10-year plan. In short, Bungie… I believe in the phrase that says “better late than never”. Some things have gone wrong, but I believe you guys have the power and willingness to make some of them right again. As a closing line, there´s something that you have to consider. These next 2 months are going to be crucial for you, because that is how much time there´s left until the first expansion comes out. Whatever happens to the game until that, in terms of right vs wrong changes, will determine [i]how many people actually stick around and give the upcoming content a chance[/i]. If people get bored to death before that, chances are that they will leave the game altogether and never even consider getting those expansions. And every player wants trade to be implemented. Give us this, and you make us happy. Give us this, and you give us freedom. Keep it away… and what we get is boredom and lack of interest. [i]To everyone that has made it this far: sorry if there are mistakes or incoherent lines, English is not my native tongue and it can get hard to express some stuff at times.[/i]

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  • Good points destiny really needs a trading system

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  • I'd hate to see this game absolutely destroyed by a trading system. It would also promote sweatshop farming. The last thing my country needs is another way to give China money for non-tangible goods. It's already having a big effect on the economy.

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  • I would like to see trading but it would be hard to make it work without people taking advantage of the system. For example, I don't like shotguns, just not my style of play. I did a nightfall a few weeks ago with a friend who loves shotguns and uses nothing but them in PVP. I get universal remote, he gets hard light.

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  • Wont support trading.

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  • I actual believe trading would just ruin it. People spamming everyone with messages that they want to sell stuff for money. People in third world countries farming for hours just for the sake of selling digital goods for real money. Sorry but I don't think the perks justify how it would ruin the game.

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    • No trading. It will ruin the game.JUST NO

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      • Edited by Roughneck: 10/6/2014 3:26:14 PM
        Trading needs to stay out of the game. Can you imagine how much worse the uproar over the loot cave would have been had trading been in the game? Account rollbacks and bans would have hit players hard. The game is great without trading. Trading introduces an in game economy and those always turn out bad.

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      • Add trading and day one you will see selling vexmythocast for $100. Theres no way of restricting this other then no trading

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        • I got $40 on 250 shards!!!! OvO

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        • Edited by Prod: 10/6/2014 4:38:03 PM
          Trading will break this game Edit: Not that it isn't already broken :)

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        • Edited by GandalfTheBald: 10/6/2014 4:11:17 PM
          Trading would be stupid. There's literally no reason to have it. There's no professions, the money in the game is close to useless, and there's only like 6 exotic armor pieces total for each class and like 10 weapons. There's not NEARLY enough stuff in this game yet to make trading worth it. There's not enough vanity items, not enough resources to do anything with besides upgrade a few measly things. There's not not enough items in the game and the way items are designed as of now to warrant trading. All trading would end up doing is letting scrubs get raid gear they're not good enough to get. And nobody wants that. Except for the scrubs.

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          • Player driven economies are terrible.

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          • There should definitely be trading. Just do the right way. You can only trade between the same rarity like a legendary for another legendary.

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          • I absolutely love this post and agree with you 100%. People think gold farmers will ruin it but if bungie implemented a system in which a trade required two items of equal value (ex: red death for hardlight or shadow price for the devil you know) then it could work out great because then it would be too much of a hassle for gold farmers to try and trade someone an exotic for an exotic or legendary for a legendary. Besides since glimmer barely has any use and is easy to acquire plus it has a 25k cap no gold farmer will farm glimmer to try and sell to people. In fact bungie can make it so that you can't trade any type of currency at all only gear and materials.

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          • I don't know how or what would be the trading mechanic but from a social point of view i support trading. It's human behavior since the dawn of time! It's in us. We need to trade, exchange, sell, buy. I don't know what would be the best way to add this feature but in fact, in reality..it need to be done. This is supposed to be a social game... Of course there will always be others who think that it's a totally bad idea. But you know there is a flaw when you got a certain piece of equipment that you don't need and your best friend beside you got a piece of gear that he can't use but you could and yet you are both stuck with it. It's like in real life trading...you know that someone at one point will cheat or steal. But you can't remove the trading system in real life because of a few cheaters. What you have to do is limit the damage. But for now, not having a trade system on the long run is pure damage. It limit normal human desire and behavior. Peace!

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          • No

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          • Yeah I don't have a warlock but I seriously have like a full set of armor of legendary and exotic for one! I'm very tempered just to make one for peats sake so these pieces aren't collecting dust in my vault!

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          • Edited by zelorian74: 10/6/2014 10:42:44 AM
            Maybe an auction house like in wow. Post helm for ascendant shards/energy or any other material your after.

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            • Nice, well composed thought out answer. Worth the evaluation. Bumping this so Bungie can see.

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            • I couldn't have written it better myself!!

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            • Trading sounds nice, if certain things like fully upgraded exotics are account bound, I'm all for it. Very well written btw Jurgen :D

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              • Your English seems pretty strong to me. Anyway, I sort of agree to a trading system but with an important caveat. No trades on Exotic items, and a hard limit of one trade per week.

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                • My big, and realistically only issue with trading is duplication bugs. They are rampant on mom's with a trading system, and my fear is that they'll ruin the game here. On the other hand...a buddy of mine is going to be starting up the game towards the end of he month. If I had the ability to throw him some gear to help him along the way? Sure. Can I? Lol.

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                  • If they wanted it to be an "Earn you gear" thing they could introduce a trading tariff. Basically it costs X amount of Strange Coins/Motes/whatever(As long as it's rare enough you only have a few) to do a trade. The game just takes the coins. Basically it'd be treating it as if the other player was a vendor (Like Xur). Except nobody would recieve the strange coins on either end. They would just disappear. Leaving both players to receive whatever armor they traded for. I understand they don't want going from 24 to 28 to be as easy as "My buddy through some gear my way". So this is just an idea that means players will have to work for the gear still. As for duping. Yeah, any method would have to be dupe-proof.

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                  • Oh. By the way, your English is very well written. Better, at least, than a lot of the trash you'll see floating around here on the forums. I used to play dungeons and dragons online with a static group of polish speakers.. We all understood the game, and it was generally understood that I would be listening to music and if I was needed, they would type in chat. I digress. Your English is good. I understand the need for a disclaimer, but Meh...its the internet. If people are going to get on your case for grammar and spelling, they'll nitpick until they find something. Just let it go, bro.

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