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8/10/2014 5:07:17 PM
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For everyone saying 'just don't use the match making for raids. It won't hurt you if they add it.'
I'm sorry but then the forums will be rife with 'Nerf Vault of Glass' threads instead. And the they'll make the Vault of Glass easier to make the same people happy that wanted the match making system.
If finding 5 other people to play with is too difficult for you, why do you want to play the hardest thing in the game?
[b][i]The developer is trying to prevent you from getting discouraged by forcing you to be prepared for the difficulty of the challenge they've created and half the people are whining that it'll be too difficult to find people to play with.
Seriously.
If it'll be difficult for you to find people to Raid with, then the first step for preparing for the Raid is to find people to Raid with.
[/i][/b]
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Edited by CheckForAPulse: 8/11/2014 12:37:25 PMIt will still be full of them regardless, I can almost guarantee it. Just because people will add 5 randoms and they will have a go with their over inflated egos, which will make it no different to having matchmade lobbies of randoms too. Either way, you end up with the same result, a bunch of randoms thrown together. There will be no avoiding it
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"There will be no avoiding it." ...Yet, there already is...hundreds of people in the Clan topic are waiting to help out with Raids.
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Edited by CheckForAPulse: 8/11/2014 9:37:13 PMI meant no avoiding the complaints post release about the difficulty. Not the ability to source people to play it with. 6 people who found each other on a forum and are bad are no different to 6 bad randoms, so either way this will happen.
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Ah...yes, you are correct. There will always be complainers. :-)
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[quote]If it'll be difficult for you to find people to Raid with, then the first step for preparing for the Raid is to find people to Raid with. [/quote] If the bungie forums had a signature option, I would have just found mine. *slow clap*
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No one else seems to see this as the logical next step. Thank you. Haha.
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I agree 100%.
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Yeah let's go on the forums and find RANDOM people. The thing that pisses me off is the lack of in game communication.
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Or avoid "Randoms" altogether...visit the "Clans" topic and find hundreds of people waiting to help with Raids.
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There isn't though. Add them to your fireteam, and boom...as long as everyone involved has a mic, you have communication. You don't need to friend them in order to invite them to a fireteam, either.
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and people who go through the effort and waste of time getting six people together to only fail again and again wont cry nerf even more? raids will be able to get away with a higher difficulty if it has a low iteration time (how till long you can jump back in and try again) Matchmaking would allow guardians to jump right back into a raid the more chances to raid a guardian gets the less they will care about a bad raid players will still be able to search on the forums/clans if they want to attempt a run with more selective guardians the link above gives a very good explanation how to make an epically challenging game with out making people rage quit
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Iteration is not about when you play again, I where check point is Why raids are challenging and not punishing? Because they are a puzzle with solution you need to train for. You need to master what to do and what to watch for. Do it with ppl new every time will make it punishing since you will do the same sequence over and over and over each time you make a new group since you will have new ppl that have yet to learn that. If you make a static instead once your static learn how to overcome that you can consistently overcome it and train next one. You won't beat a raid in FPS mentality (I play when I want with who is online) but you need raid mentality (I plan when next static train day is)
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true but i still think the point stands for those who can only get a full raid once a week are gonna be more likely to rage than those who can just try again tomorrow night and im sure we can both agree on this a good raid boss should be something that takes a few attempts to learn how to take down properly and not something you blast through on first attempt for something like that to be fun you need to people able to verse it often so you have the chance to learn and see where you are your team went wrong otherwise people will cry nerf which again I think we can both agree we don't want [quote]If you make a static instead once your static learn how to overcome that you can consistently overcome it and train next one[/quote]True and when people raid with their usual raid partners they will probably consistently get at least half way through each time but when its not a raid night and you choose to play with randoms if you don't mind not getting as far as you usually do you could still be on mic and teach those who don't know how to get past the bit they are stuck on and some other players might show you a way your team didn't know playing with 5 friends will be better hands down but playing with randoms will still be fun enough to deserve an option to do so
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Problem is that 80% o community have FPS mentality not raid mentality. You can't leave MM and hope they don't think they can beat it with MM. This community need to be forced in raid mentality
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agreed but i believe difficulty and challenge should convince the 80% to change their mindset rather than just being told to I like discussing this topic with people like you LetBloodline cause even though we disagree on the details both our arguments stem from wanting raids to be the best and most challenging part of Destiny with a reward at the end that means something when you wear it or at least that's the impression i get when discussing with you =)
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Have you ever saw how bad a community can be? Sadly I saw something =/ if all ppl where like you MM could be added as choice but... Maybe I have low trust on medium player but while I know that SOME will get it by them selfs I fear that MANY will either leave/get frustrated and start hating newbie/rant on the forums. Worst part is that rant would have a point. Make raids doable in MM. You can answer that MM is there for those who don't want to complete but do a random try. Let's see what answer you get from a FPS player that is failing that ride for 2 weeks straight. Point is that since raid is doable in MM it should be beatable in MM and it's not the case =/ that is not a whine you can just brush off, it has a point. You said to put it in for ppl that want a random run but it would be used 99% of time hoping in a win it will never come. That's why bungie must wait to put MM until community is used to it. I'd bet that when they release second raid first one will be put on MM and watered down (also remove weekly lockout if present)
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considering the "debate" Ive had just below this very thread my faith in the bungie community is dwindling and the thought being expected to play with people like MAS73R N1NJA for potentially 3 hrs is horrifying to the point where I think I'd just quit and send an invite to the other 4 players I'm willing to concede to you most of my points are speculative and we wont know til after Destiny is out if they are right or not to your last paragraph I hope you are right (except with the watered down part) that would be a very clever way to alter the communities mindset on raids while still implementing matchmaking raids plus it would only need to be included if bungie bet on the wrong horse and lack of MM raids is meaning only a small percentage is able to access raids im still against the watering down/nerfing of normal raids but I would be for adding an "easy raid mode" but the loot is capped at exotic or even uncommon lets keep the legendary gear for those who prove they deserve it even if that doesn't include me just like with recon ;-)
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When they add a new raid and new gear that let you reach higher lvl all raid party will still have a new challenge at hand but you don't want that someone that start as new player will find himself stuck at old raids only because he have trouble finding a static that still run old raids. The challenge is the new raid, old raids became just a step stone and so they get treated
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we shall see I am curious if bungie will just up the level cap with each expansion or try to find another way to keep people playing/buying more content but im guessing you've had more experience with MMOs so you have done this sorta thing before
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Well they can increase lvl given by weapons if they add enough content with each expansion. New story new map new strike new nightfall and new raid. And I sure hope they will be. Strike will became old quickly as nightfall, raids are what keep player engaged. But not forever. They need new raids on regular basis and new raid mean new equip to raid for
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ye im just thinking what they will name the rarity of the equipment above legendary agreed with the strikes and nightfall they will help but wont be what keeps people coming back even when they get new game that will be the job of raids and any other endgame content they may come up with I reckon they could do alot with playing about with the themes of raids like 1 could be more vehicle heavy and open space so you always want some people sniping while another more indoors and tight corners not knowing what you will see in next room where you want shotguns up front leading the pack even just having the raids based on different enemy factions will shake them up a lot and give different experiences
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That sound interesting. They definitely have a bunch of things to play with. On the item side I don't thin they'll add more than legendary. Legendary seems to refer more to the number of special skills that weapon have. We will just get various lvl of each rarity
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Your dumb, it's set up like a mission so if you fail just start over. Matchmaking hinders social skills in making friends and team mates. Your trying to justify something that doesn't work for this game type. Raids are not meant to be trolled the -blam!- out. They are end game challenges, sooooo that means ...... For the end of the -blam!-ing game. If you can't find five friends to run with then get over it the game will probably be too hard for you in the first place. Then you'll probably sell it within the first month and go get the new cod so you can have your matchmaking back from a game that just wants your money so you can run around in circles shooting one another. How sad.....
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and for a game that is hoped to keep people playing for years what will people play more of the mid game content? or endgame content? [quote]Your trying to justify something that doesn't work for this game type[/quote]halo firefight/spartan ops, Gears of war horde modes, mass effect 3 multiplayer, left 4 dead, Evolved etc..... plenty of action games have coop gametypes that require teamwork to even hope to complete and all of them have as you would put it -blam!-ing matchmaking and it does -blam!-ing work I must have missed the part where having friends who aren't into gaming or have more important things to spend money on than a next gen console means im a crap player I used to be I used to not be able to play legendary but then I started playing online games thanks to??? you guessed it matchmaking =D and that challenge forced me into becoming a better player so that now on legendary I don't even need to take it seriously last thing I never sell my games, I dont play COD (its a good game but every year its the -blam!-ing same game and not worth my money) and may favorite games are a mix of PvP like titanfall, story like dragon age and coop ones like mass effect and destiny was set to become my go to coop game based on what I play of the beta
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Lol and what happen to those games.... No one plays them anymore. Great examples.... The bungie version of firefight didn't have matchmaking smart one. Like I said it doesn't work for that game type. Go play cod if you want it so bad. PVP is where you'll spend most of your time because guess what that's the only game type with matchmaking so your post is void.
