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Destiny

Discuss all things Destiny.
9/17/2014 9:02:38 PM
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Cerith

An Open Letter to Bungie: Many of us Understand.

Dear Bungie, With Destiny's launch, there has been a tumultuous storm of opinions and thoughts flying around across the internet. Everybody seems to have an opinion, more often than not a complaint, or an idea of what needs to happen. Arguably poor review scores from many publications feed an ever increasing loop of groupthink and lead to unfair conclusions and accusations about what, from a real perspective, has the potential to turn into a masterpiece. With the forums ablaze with topics lambasting the game you've made, I wouldn't be surprised if, on your part, there is at the least confusion, at most dismay at the exact nature of the friction. I've read the complaints. However, I feel very strongly that everything in Destiny has been meticulously thought out, planned, and implemented. In simpler terms, [b]there is nothing about this game that doesn't feel intentional[/b]. It feels to me that every aspect of Destiny as it exists now aligns with your vision, and that you have made the game exactly as you wanted to make it. Those of us who have long time experience with similar games, and really want to see the industry evolve, recognize that Destiny could very well be the beginning of a masterpiece, a revolution in how games are experienced and how stories are told. We play it religiously, and we trust you to develop its universe into something really special. It already has established itself as one of the most memorable gaming experiences I've had, and I'm sure that rings true for those like me. But the adherence to your vision is the cornerstone of positivity for this experience. Destiny is going to be a long road, and vocal members of the community that don't truly grasp Destiny's scope and potential will continue to complain. Likely, it will be relentless. I've already seen people go from complaining that they had too easy of a time getting to the level cap, to complaining that the raids are too hard over 3 DAYS. In fact, Destiny seems to have had 3 years worth of complaining cycles crammed into the 1 week it has been available. We have our journey over Destiny's lifetime, and you, Bungie, have yours. I urge you, remember this: [b]You must unflinchingly adhere to your vision.[/b] If anything can be said about the game industry, particularly in MMO type games, it's that "The Customer is Usually Wrong". You can't please everyone, and large scale change will rarely please most. But if every game released is going to strive only to please the most customers, we end up with bland and repetitive titles that rarely venture outside of the status quo. To you I say that you will need to heed this forum's tagline more than any of the users: [b]Be Brave[/b]. Don't buckle to the complaints, and don't stray from making what you see because of the outcry of those who don't agree on its beauty. Sincerely, A Fan.
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#Destiny

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  • I've said it before. Bungie wants you to think big and the game's scope reflects that. They want you to think bigger then you usually do. And I will always say that naysayers never think big enough. Stop being scared and let your feet come off the ground.

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    Dear Bungie, Now that this guy is done slobbering over you like its amateur hour at IGN.... heres the fact. You created a sub par release by doing SIX major things wrong that you know you should not have. And it all in the end boils down to working on ONE project for far to long and not stepping back to pay attention to the details it feels like. 1. A horrible prologue to your franchise story that was short, lacked substance, had no character arch, lacked a hero, friends, or even any interesting points save possibly the trip to the awoken; and also had no sub plots or occurances of interest to hold the player to his new world you created. 2. You released with no in game support for clans. Serioulsy... like none.... its damn embarassing in a gaming world where EVERY game has something to socialize and organize a player base for raids and grouping. 3. You created a world that is 7 years to late and is completely non intereactive, nor random, nor living. It is always the same and gets very boring after 20 hours. There is no variation, and no interesting random moments outside a repetitive 4 types of public events. Hell, even Guidwars had better public events. 4. You pigeon holed your player base into farming for items and points to get items; and then limited the amount of points to trade for items to LESS than is required for ONE item each WEEK!! All instead of allowing us to get into creating items merging items, or otherwise bringing diversity to a level and stat based game. 5. You made a game so repetitive you can literally watch movies or be on the phone while playing because every time your Ghost stops to scan, here come the waves.... There is absolutely no skill in the PVE of this game at all. 6. You have the power of Next Gen consoles at your finger tips and half a BILLION dollar franchise budget and you pushed ABSOLUTELY NO GAMEPLAY ENVELOPES. Nothing new we havent seen 1000 times in other shooters and HALO.... PS Your PVP is fun but you need the ability to take down vehicles. PSS Way to come out the gate with your new flagship tip toeing through the doorway instead of coming out strong like a company that has put one of the defining franchises into the world before.... right now you are the equivilent of the Speaker in your game.... completely useless, timid and taking credit as a leader for doing nothing but existing. Your players demand a game of quality.. not HALO in a different package with less story. Thanks for very little overall. Here is hoping my faith and the faith of other gamers is actually well placed in you still. This was disappointing. Sincerely, The writer who could have given you a better, longer story, for cheaper.

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    • You're just slobbering away at Bungie's dick like there's no tomorrow but there's more to it than that. You're typing so much that you're hands are busy and you're obviously ignoring the taint and balls, cup those things and reach a finger around back to help finish the job.

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      • i'll give you a Fallen-cookie personally dude! (its indeed a fallen cookie, it just fall from my hands really) your post its full with fan's true love for games. but i have to agree with the other guy post (im sorry i just lose it) Destiny is not perfect (yet) but we(who thing like that) are forgetting something, there are 2 expansions to come. i have played bungie's games for a while (since marathon 2) and they always made it great! I do love this game. and i know this is only the beginning!! anyways your post its just great and i'll put that tiny star on it. :)

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      • I really can't bear to wade through most of the drivel that follows below, but in case no one has said it yet, that is a very well-worded letter. I'd just like to say that I'm in the camp that thinks Destiny is a wonderful game, filled with potential and containing some highly addictive gameplay. Yes, there are things I could criticize, but none of them are gamebreaking. Besides, Bungie has left all indications that they are going to set new standards in post-release support, and I am enthusiastic about seeing where they go with with it. Honestly, most of the people who drone on endlessly with nothing but negativity pouring from their sewers are not the people who will make up your fan base. They're like locusts who move on every thirty days to the newest flavor of the month. You won't hear from most of them again. But those who remain will do so because they trust in the concepts you've put forth, and in your ability to shape them and let them evolve over time. That, to me, is refreshing.

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        • Thanks so much to everyone for the replies! I still feel this way, a month after posting it. I love the game.

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        • Edited by ROBERTO jh: 9/19/2014 4:43:13 AM
          Look this game is loads of fun and I am chomping at the bit to get back to it this weekend and prepare some more for the Raid with friends, but this [quote] To you I say that you will need to heed this forum's tagline more than any of the users: Be Brave. Don't buckle to the complaints, and don't stray from making what you see because of the outcry of those who don't agree on its beauty. [/quote] is a dangerous mentality to have. This game is not perfect by any stretch of the imagination, but it can be fixed. At what cost is (literally) up to the publishers, but the universe has potential to make something truly wondrous. What Bungie [i]should[/i] be doing is listening to the criticism and taking it to heart so they can learn from it. Simply going on just as planned when you have so many disappointed fans is how developers go out of business, and that's why it is dangerous to have a mentality advocating such action. I want Bungie to [i]succeed[/i] and to do that they need to fix the game. Difference is no one (who has any brain cells) is saying that it is impossible to be fixed, or that Bungie can't do it. They [i]can[/i] and we as the community can help them figure out how. That's the whole point of a forum. At the moment, Destiny [i]is[/i] bland and repetitive, that's the whole point of everyone's complaints, and saying that this is what you are afraid we will end up with simply shows that maybe you are blind to the valid criticisms people have regarding the game. But we stick with it not to bash it, but because we see a lot of untapped potential, a very solid premise that simply failed to go anywhere, and in terms of gameplay, a good first outing. But that's all it is, just good. Nothing else, just good. Should [i]Bungie[/i] of all studios settle for just "good?" No, they're Bungie, the developers of Halo, they should aspire for greatness. They should aspire to become legend.

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          • Bully good sir, your ability to wordsmith and convey your honesty about this game is above reproach. +1 rep to you

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          • I want to be able to talk to people I don't know. I want to be able to play the PVP with a pub and communicate with the psnetwork. Bungie, did you know that EVERY PS4 COMES WITH A HEADSET? DO YOU WANT ME TO TELL ALL MY FRIENDS TO BUY THE GAME? IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE UP TO? I hate you, I'm level 25, and I murder the pvp on a regular basis. I can't even talk to anyone and tell them how good it feels to be so good. I can't communicate with my team and tell them which control spot to take over. I have more conversations with my cat. I know space is a big and lonely space...... but really? I'd rather play Dota 2 and learn how to speak spanish.

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            • I will admit to having been critical on several points. I do not post critical information to simply be critical, nor do I have a deep dislike of the game. if I disliked the game I would have less than the 20-30 hours logged in playing that I do currently. Instead, I post in the forum with the intent of giving Bungie feedback. That is what the forum is for, in one respect. They need to see where their vision has succeeded and where it isn't translating as well. Holding coarse in rough waters is only a good idea so long as it doesn't lead you deeper into the storm. So, let's look at some of my own thoughts on the game; Game mechanics, player characters, and gear - I have no complaints at all with any of this. There is sufficient gear options to give you a lot to work with, and while I can't say everything is inspirational an unique, I also can't say that this is a bad thing. These aspects of the game were very well done, and I totally congratulate Bungie on them. Story and NPC characters - here, the first installment of Destiny is lacking. We meet the Speaker twice, at the beginning and ending of the story, yet he serves no other purpose. Why? He should have been a more involved character in our story (assuming we, as players, are intended to be the focus 'hero' of that story). This was a missed opportunity. The Queen of the Reef, her brother, and the mysterious exo all served their purposes well, and I have no complaints on their writing or their use. Good job! But... in our journey you have 4 background characters? And the story itself, so far, is extremely short. Bungie had a very long time to work on this game, yet the story could have been thrown together in a matter of months. This is sub-par. Yes, I did enjoy what there was of the story, but that story should have been far deeper. I understand that further story arcs will be released (or at least one more story arc. I simply assume there will be more after), and perhaps this will flesh out what was presented originally. PvP/PvE balance - in this area, I feel that the balance is horribly off. Destiny is a game that is 'balanced' (one might even say over-balanced) to favor PvP. If Bungie's intent was to create a PvP game, they have succeeded. If their intent was to attract a broad and varied audience, however, then in my eyes while they have not failed, they also have not succeeded. "The game starts at level 20". This has been said very often. Very well, let us examine. Every single Exotic bounty features a very heavy Crucible requirement. For level 20+ legendary gear, there is only one PvE vendor, but 4 PvP vendors. It is far faster and easier to level up in the Crucible, gaining reputation and marks, than it is for the Vanguard (this is not simply my opinion, other people have said the same). Again, if Bungie wanted to make a PvP game, they have succeeded and they need do nothing more. If, however, they want to attract and keep PvE people, then there needs to be another, less PvP focused way to earn what you need for upgrades. (For those who point to Vanguard Strikes, remember this - a strike takes around 20-30 minutes. At level 20, you can get 2 Vanguard Marks for that 20-30 minute investment. In Crucible you can get 2-3 marks per game. That means a Vanguard player can get 2 marks and a Crucible player can get 4-9 marks in the same time period, depending on the player's level of skill) So yes, I do want to see Destiny succeed. And yes, I do enjoy most of the game. It is, however, not perfect, and if Bungie wishes to retain at the very least me as a player, then some of these things should be addressed in some manner at some point in time. Otherwise there are other games which will be releasing soon (Borderlands) that will draw me away, and it will then be up to Bungie to prove that there is any reason why I should return.

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              • I really love the game. There are just some minus points. -The activity rewards on crucible, how come i get none with my, over 2.0 K/D, when a guy, who has 2 kills and 10 deaths gets an exotic weapon? -No ingame communication between friends or clans. I am lvl 26 and haven't had a single chance on raid or nightfall, since my real life friends don't play this game. Now I need to scout the forums and maybe, if I am lucky enough, I find someone to do a weekly with me... -a little repetitive, but I am sure it will be corrected soon. All in all, the best shooter/MMO I have played on a console, 8,5/10 points.

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                • I totally agree with this the game is amazing absolutely love it. Can't stop playing. And actually I like the story and look forward to more content. Cheers

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                • The story, as it is, is bad. It's empty and poorly-told, no matter how much attention you pay to it or how many grimoire cards you read, that doesn't change. The future will not change the story we have now unless they rewrite it.

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                • Bungie, just bring the cannons. When ya'll shoot the score and bring the thunder, the complaining will look foolish as hell.

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                • I've played the game and enjoyed it, but never felt overly aware of the story. We saved the traveler, but was that a big deal? The last boss fight was pretty simple. The traveler and the speaker were minor characters. There were no epic vehicle battles other than a strike on Mars. I wish there was some variety to the missions rather than "go here, beat this group, go there, beat that group, go get a reward while never interacting with anyone". I would love a mission involving boarding and bombing an alien ship. Something with high energy. The Scarab fights from Halo 3, the warthog escape from Halo 1, something like that. The fighting on foot is well done, very enjoyable. I kept waiting for the moment when everything would get taken up a notch, but it didn't happen. I was surprised to find out that I had beat the story. I enjoyed the game and am still playing, but I feel there is so much more interesting levels that can be made for future instalments if developers continue to use their imaginations. What do you think?

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                  • Edited by typhoonkicks: 9/20/2014 6:42:35 AM
                    Bumped and liked i have faith in u bungie. the Clan Light Unknown would also like u guys to know we support u fully in this decade quest to glory.

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                  • I agree with the OP entirely. Each time I wander through the Grimoire, I am reminded on just how big Destiny really is. This has a foundation to be built upon - and that takes a long, long, long time. Don't stop Bungie, but by all means, get to it. Although, I'd bet a bajillion people would stop complaining about the "lack of a story" if you included all of the grimoire information in-game somehow. Literally, all of the story is in there.

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                    • Edited by ThunderFenrir: 9/18/2014 12:59:15 PM
                      Okay, a few things to all the people commenting. And read the whole thing before replying please. First, my negative thoughts: 1- Yes, as someone who has played WoW, Diablo, and more over the years, the vanilla campaign is kind of short for this TYPE of game. Don't go comparing it saying that it's story is longer than CoD or Halo, because that would be like comparing Farcry 3 or Fallout to like Duke Nukem or Wolfenstein. Just because it has guns doesn't mean it's the same. 2- The loot system is a little ****ed. Yes, I know that loot should be hard to get, but I shouldn't be playing strikes I'm level for and be consistently getting gear that's WORSE than what I have except for the 15th time I've done a strike. Except for my rocket launcher, everyone of my exotics or legendaries, EVERY ONE, I've had to buy from a vendor. There's a difference between low drop rates and stuff just NOT dropping. 3- The fact that people were able to find a bottomless clip exploit in the Crucible with a week of the game coming out. 4- Why, just WHY is there no map when you're planetside? I don't care if it's in the start menu or something (lots of games do that), but I get annoyed sometimes of not knowing where I am on a planet. Even areas I've played forever I still get lost in sometimes. 5- The absolutely HORRIBLE mic support. 6- My last negative point,and probably my biggest one, is that there's now queue's for raids or weekly strikes. This wouldn't be a big deal, except combined with my last point, it's near impossible to get a good group together for a raid or something ON SYSTEM. The fact that people are having to go to the forums to find groups speaks a lot for how bad the grouping mechanics can be here. My positive points: 1- I like that there's very limited slots for armor and weapons (which if you expected more coming from Bungie than you don't know Bungie). You have to pay A LOT more attention to the stats of your gear, ESPECIALLY when you start getting legendaries, because you need to make sure that your gear actually helps your playstyle. If your just running around looking for gear based SOLEY on the armor or light level, then you're not gearing your character right. 2- I absolutely LOVE the fact that on the map screen when selecting where to go it tells you what areas your friends are currently in. Great way to find out if any of your friends are playing where you want to go and group up. 3- The emotes. It's kind of refreshing to see a console heavy and more shooter based game have emotes. I just wish there were more though. Not WoW levels, cause WoW levels of ANYTHING would be unrealistic expectations in a game like this, but only 4 is not much. 4- The AI actually using tactics for once. I can't tell you how many times I've gotten pissed off at a wizard ducking behind troops to use them as cannon fodder while he regenerates his shield, or getting bumrushed by Fallen majors while I'm trying to regenerate my shields, and so forth. (sub-point: Those complaining that bosses are just bullet sponges, go play some modern WoW or Diablo 3 and tell me those bosses aren't "bullet" sponges) 5- Bounties. I love trying to clear the bounty board and getting all sorts of rep rewards and stuff for it. (Already Vanguard level 3 largely because of this) 6- The light level thing. Though I wish the actual true level cap was a bit higher, gearing up for raids and high level strikes actually gets me pumped for said raids and strikes. It's along the same lines as trying to increase your iLevel in WoW to unlock new raids. 7- The weapons feel, well, right. I don't know exactly how to word it, but the way the weapons handle, and how each one even in the same class or type of weapon can handle completely differently just feels natural. 8- The classes (IF PLAYED CORRECTLY) all play and feel different, even more so if you divide them up by subclass, and it's fun to see this play out in strikes and team based crucible matches. And just like in other games that have been mentioned, you can tell when a person isn't using their class right. I can't tell you how many times I've seen someone get owned because they're trying to use a bladedancer hunter as a tank, or use a Titan solely as a long range sniper/rocketeer who gets constantly snuck up on and beat down. 9- It's well, it's just FUN. Only a couple times have I even started to get bored and I've been playing constantly and have been level 20 within like 3 or 4 days. Even though it can be repetitive and somewhat samey, I've only ever felt once like I was doing chores while grinding (and said moment was grinding Crucible rep). There are more positive points, but I'm gonna stop there. Overall I'm not overly disappointed in what Destiny turned out to be. It does have it's flaws as any new release will yes, and it was overhyped (though mostly by the FANS and not Bungie themselves *cough cough*), but it's a fun game and has kept my attention longer than a lot of other big box office games have (I'm looking at you new Tomb Raider and Thief 4). I know several people including myself who have gotten the game, and everyone i know has had their reaction ranging from overall pleased to in love. It's a good game that has it's problems, but people are acting like the positive doesn't exist and are having tunnel vision like those problems are the entire game. EVERY new release has bugs and problems. Just look at Skyrim! If you're going into Destiny expecting an mmo you're gonna be disappointed because it's not an mmo, and was never called so by Bungie. You're also going to be disappointed if you're expecting the same thing as Halo, because, like I pointed out earlier, though they're both technically shooters, they're not the same type of game. Go into the Destiny expecting what it is- a more than decent dungeon crawler FPS, and you may realize you're actually having a lot of fun. I know I am. PS- To those pointing to gaming reviews in magazines and on websites and stuff, CoD Ghosts, easily the WORST CoD game ever and one of the worst modern shooters in YEARS, got RAVE reviews and high number ratings all across the board. I don't trust professional reviews on anything, not just games, as far as I can throw them.

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                      • Dear Bungie, I've never played a multiplayer where I wait until the countdown after a death like I do with Destiny because how badly I don't want to be in the crucible due to how poorly crafted the concept is. I for the life of me can't fathom as to why overpowered weaponry (shotguns, pulse rifles and launchers) are the foundation to your games weapon system. Why do you hate rushers and gunners so much? you actually get penalized for moving around the map by your position being given away on the enemy radar every step you make but if you're stationary you are difficult to spot , that's some backwards ideology that empowers camping. Maybe thats why I enjoy the story mode, not so much the story line but the fact you get to cover large terrain and have more adequate gun battles. There should be 1 standard super that everybody uses, if any, splittiing it with different character types is a poorly thought out decision. I could go on and even in deeper detail why the crucible is so horrible but I'm just gonna chalk it up to 1 final statement. Destiny is Titanfall in the sense of replay value, I really tried to like this game but the more you forced me into the crucible to get those crucible marks, ascendant shards etc. the more I've come to realize this is not a competent game. I wish I could sell it and get money back from it, but digital download and all don't allow that.

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                        • i think what this games requires most more than anything is time...both in gameplay and grinding as well as the evolution of the game itself...i have a very strong feeling the game will come into its own come a year or two after release....take a look at dcuo....for w.e reason i get the same feeling from this game...like its just sorta confused about what it is, its new, young...give it time.

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                        • Also to note, there seems to be more people complaining then not because, frankly, WE are still in game. When people take the time to complain here it saves us from having to play with them. I like this open letter.

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                        • Concur 100% with original post

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                        • 1
                          +1 this. Bungie I have faith. So far you have not disappointed me. This game is amazing and I've been losing sleep over it. Please only consider what people are pitching and bitching to you. Don't try to please the peons. Just keep true to your vision. I for one can't wait for the Iron Banner and the Queen's Wrath. I'll be with you guys till next year for sure. Can't wait to see where this crazy ride takes us all.

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                        • Complaining < Creating

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                        • Edited by Lancat: 9/19/2014 2:35:31 PM
                          Let me rephrase. The game is beautiful, the gameplay is fantastic. The story is catchy and fun. Grimoirs are great I wanna catch em' all. Only negative comment; The loot tables suck, most people agree. It just rewards people based on RNG and I've never had a single good experiance from randomization. I want a clear, obvious weekily routine that garentees me a legendary every week. If people get lucky cool for them, I want to be rewarded for time spent. I literally cannot say enough about how unrewarding and unhappy it makes me to spent hours on a 24+ raid only to get nothing, to cash in 7 legendary engrams and get green gear and class items. To find out that I farmed for Strange tokens all week to not even get 13 of them, yet for a short window this morning they were available from Xur for glimmer. I'm pretty pissed at the loot system, it should be re-worked a bit. Random drops off mobs are cool, no purple gear by the end of the week while people just get lucky every day from cryptarch or coins, not awesome. Besides that, I'm still on, I still wanna clear content and have fun playing the game. It's been a good experiance overall, it'd just be an epic one of I actually got some damn gear :|

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                          • So, you vision a off balance second week between classes? Giving Hunters and Titan's exotics for both their spec lines and only giving the same item to warlocks? Okay, well I can't wait to see what I don't get next week. Or maybe what I do that gives me some kind of bonus to void. After all, it does seem left out and like it's greatness is being kept till other classes are able to withstand the uberness that is the Void Warlock. Bwhahahaha, trolling...

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