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5/21/2022 11:14:23 PM
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Why does endgame content generally feel unrewarding?

Seriously why is that things like master campaign missions, master/legendary lost sectors, master dungeons/raids feel so unrewarding. Sure I suppose this could be bungies way of balancing core players with more casual players who generally to play endgame content on a regular basis. Outside of GMs, I feel like most endgame content feels like a punch to the face since there is heavy amounts of RNG to get decent stuff and most commonly you'll get legendary gear that's some times slightly better than normal gear. Examples: completing weekly master campaign missions has the highest drop chance of ascendant alloy, but it's possible to get multiple clears without it dropping and it's possible to get clears and only get glimmer. Master/legendary lost sector are similar, most of the time you'll only get glimmer. Master raids only give you 1 chance at an adept weapon and the rest of the raid is just armor with high stats. Would it really be so wrong to make things like ascendant alloys, enhancement cores, prisms, and ascendant shards drop more regularly in endgame content. Like master campaign should have a 100% drop chance for AAs and there should be 2x rewards on certain weeks. Master/legendary lost sector should always reward 5k glimmer + enhancement cores as a base reward. Master raids/dungeons should drop ascendant alloy/shards from each encounter as a base reward.

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  • Im noticing the endgame in Destiny is similar to Warframes. As in its really underwhelming and mediocre. Endgame needs to be the next big focus area after pvp gets fixed.

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    • Bungie has always been really crappy at rewards. They want you to climb that mountain for a peanut. Why?, I guess if you’re having fun and get what you want that you may not play? Me personally, the more fun i have, the more i play and feel about the game. Some players like to run the same activity 25/100 times. For me, by that time that carrot is moldy and nasty

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      • This is not an end game problem this is an entire game problem. Not much is worth grinding for and everything is handed out

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        • Because the amount of difficulty versus the quality of loot versus drop rates are out of balance. Players feel they have to work too damn hard for what the game gives back in rewards.

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          • Because it is

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          • Every time something really strong and rewarding is locked behind difficult content, people complain about it. Now everything is pretty much obtainable by everyone or it isn’t much better than the stuff that is obtainable by everyone.

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          • Not just end game.

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          • Grinding content for bad rolls just gets kinda taxing. More so if your luck is particularly bad. I’ve got over a hundred clears of prophecy, not counting checkpoint farming at the cube and the phalanx echo. I don’t have a single thing to show for it.

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          • Because its not.

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          • Combination of poor RNG, lack of bad luck protection, and being unable to farm certain activities.

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          • I didn't even bother with the exotic glaives let alone grinding up to endgame activities. There's no motivation for this season. The new memento's aren't appealing to me and I have the weapons and armor that are available.

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          • To me it’s just another source for specific drops. If the loot isn’t good, I don’t care about getting it. I also don’t really like the current adept raid loot system because the challenges are just…. dumb. It’s usually some arbitrary, arduous hinderance that’s counter to the goal of surviving and completing the encounter yet instead of being an actual test of proficiency/efficiency of the encounter. It’s even worse with Vow because they aren’t craftable and there isn’t a dedicated source for any given weapon since they all drop from all encounters.

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          • 由AppleSoda編輯: 5/23/2022 3:37:58 PM
            You pointed it out already. Bungie doesn’t want the casual player base to be at a severe disadvantage so Bungie gives everyone “handouts” that are good enough for basically everything. Nothing in this game is hard enough to justify getting a perfect 5/5 god roll on a weapon that will only be marginally better than all of the loot you have and so it feels unrewarding. PvP is really the only exception, and even there, it only really matters to a certain point—your skill as a player matters much more, especially since many high performance weapons are exotics and or easy to get (Felwinters, Ace, Thorn, Lorentz, DMT, Adored, etc.). Sure there are great alternatives but most of the basic handout arsenal is good enough or just straight up the best. For players like me and many other players who play a lot, the game is just min/max-ing for… nothing? A flex? I just like collecting and feeling prepared but I can admit that most of the stuff I have is completely unnecessary even though it is fun to feel marginally more powerful.

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          • [quote]Seriously why is that things like master campaign missions, master/legendary lost sectors, master dungeons/raids feel so unrewarding. Sure I suppose this could be bungies way of balancing core players with more casual players who generally to play endgame content on a regular basis. Outside of GMs, I feel like most endgame content feels like a punch to the face since there is heavy amounts of RNG to get decent stuff and most commonly you'll get legendary gear that's some times slightly better than normal gear. Examples: completing weekly master campaign missions has the highest drop chance of ascendant alloy, but it's possible to get multiple clears without it dropping and it's possible to get clears and only get glimmer. Master/legendary lost sector are similar, most of the time you'll only get glimmer. Master raids only give you 1 chance at an adept weapon and the rest of the raid is just armor with high stats. Would it really be so wrong to make things like ascendant alloys, enhancement cores, prisms, and ascendant shards drop more regularly in endgame content. Like master campaign should have a 100% drop chance for AAs and there should be 2x rewards on certain weeks. Master/legendary lost sector should always reward 5k glimmer + enhancement cores as a base reward. Master raids/dungeons should drop ascendant alloy/shards from each encounter as a base reward.[/quote] That’s because it really is unrewarding

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          • [quote]Seriously why is that things like master campaign missions, master/legendary lost sectors, master dungeons/raids feel so unrewarding.[/quote] If you think Destiny 2 endgame is worse, you should stay away from World of Warcraft. There a Mythic+ dungeon (basically nightfall tiers in D2) can even reward nothing at the end. In Raids you can get like 1-2 item drops across the entire raid. In raids and dungoens, bosses even don't drop 100% an item after defeating them. You can basically sit there 2 months, trying to get an item at all if you have really bad luck and no-one willing to trade loot.

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          • Because Bungie decided the rewards weren’t fair to the people that can’t/won’t run the harder content. It’s all watered down now.

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            • I’m telling you if this game had outriders mods with the end game activities -blam!- would be worth it but i assume now it’s boring because we can get whatever we want an craft our god rollls

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            • 由Quiet_Bushi編輯: 5/23/2022 9:01:51 AM
              1
              Quiet_Bushi
              Quiet_Bushi

              Main Titan / PvE / I don't play PvP -

              [quote]Master/legendary lost sector are similar, most of the time you'll only get glimmer.[/quote] This happened to me a couple of times this week even if I endend up having a Platinum Score. I really struggle to understand how the reward system works in this cases... [b]POST-EDIT:[/b] also, I got like 3.700 Glimmer lol I mean, at least gave us something like 10.000 or so.

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            • For me it’s when they put RNG at the end of raids for the exotic weapons. It’s hard enough to get a raid team together , let alone a competent one at that. Plus having to do the raid maybe 30 or 40 times or even more given how crap your RNG is. This puts me off raiding altogether , the best way they done this was when you got the cabal heavy shotgun for completing the leviathan raid and had to do certain things to get it to full strength. I would certainly do the raids over and over again knowing that I’m actually working towards something instead of a maybe.

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              • Because destiny is all journey and no destination. Destiny is not a game... It's a time waster. Like one of those clicker games on mobile. Actual games have some kind of a goal in mind that they want their players to experience. Destiny has no purpose, no message, no morals. It just [b] exists [/b]

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                • I would say the entire game generally feels unrewarding most of the time. That’s why you feel it up in the endgame too. Cause it’s felt everywhere else as well. I don’t think Bungie sees endgame as special. I think they see a small portion of people who can live there and so they have decided you all will feel the same pain and dissatisfaction as the rest of players anywhere else in the game too, because the entire game is just about repetition. I mean, the GG lists the NF weapon as a common drop, and yet I can complete 10 in a row without a single drop. So we are all experiencing the same thing, but just at different parts of the game. Bungie have leaned too far into mindless repetition in all parts of the game and it’s just not worth investing the same amount of time anymore. This game feels very unrewarding all around lately. But maybe it’s because there’s just too much so nothing feels unique anymore. Dunno.

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                • This is why i do not play raids. Inside Huge RGN pool you lost yourself. So chaotic if you do not have a well trained team members.i am a pve player but i play trials sometimes because of the targetgettable item which you want.

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                • 由Sohsuh編輯: 5/22/2022 6:55:20 PM
                  Because Bungie wants you running content without actually getting what you want. They have the opposite philosophy on loot from what Blizzard had with Diablo 3 to make Diablo 3 successful. Blizzard released Diablo 3 with terrible RNG and low drop rates, and they found that the population was decreasing and people were barely playing. So they then went the other route, and increased droprates by a large amount, and they found the population grew and players instead of chasing an item, were now chasing specific rolls on the item. So they were showered with loot, but trying to get the perfect roll, which feels good and keeps players playing. Bungie on the other hand, doesn't want you to get anything at all. They want you to completely waste your time. Think about the GM situation right now. They got rid of being able to choose your own GM. Why? Because they don't want you to ever be able to have an easier time farming an item you want. Palindrome is being taken out of the game next season, so what does Bungie do? They pair it with Plug One and put it on Scarlet Keep, which can take you 20-30 minutes depending on the group. Under 20 if you're in a great group. So you can run this for 25 mins or so and get a plug one. They know you want Palindrome. They could have just put Palindrome on it's own. They could have made it Arms Dealer. They could have made it double drops. But they didn't do ANY of that. They want you spending 20-30 minutes and not getting what you want. They want you playing over and over and receiving nothing so you keep playing hoping to get what you want. It's a shitty feeling, and it really needs to change. There's nothing wrong with giving the players what they want. It's not like we're going to quit the game if we get more loot. I'd play it even more than I do now. One big reason that I stop playing is because of how terrible the droprates are in this game. If they had Palindrome dropping on it's own this week on Arms Dealer, I guarantee the player numbers running GM's would have skyrocketed. Scarlet Keep is easy, but it's long and annoying. Running it over and over is miserable. When you run this long, miserable GM and you receive a plug one, it just makes you want to stop playing. I am not sure why Bungie would rather have the players feeling like they want to stop playing opposed to feeling happy and enjoying their experience.

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                  • Easy answer. The content you are referring to is catered towards a tiny minority of players. Mostly content creators and a small amount of REALLY dedicated players. You probably surround yourself with such people which makes it feel like theres a lot of people engaging with that type of content. Truth is, there aren't. My estimate would be that only 0,1-0,8 percent of players regularly play that stuff. Bungie knows that this tiny, dedicated audience will keep playing that more difficult content until they get what they want. That's why. They milk playtime out of those players cause they know they are addicted anyways and will just eat it up until they have their desired loot. That's why i personally stopped playing this game "hardcore". Not worth my valuable time.

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                    • You are leaving out lacking in fun as well. Content in general in not fun to replay. Gm's are horrible. Bungie is trying so hard to make things hard that they miss the fact that it is fun to be able to grind things with friends. None of the new stuff is fun, rewarding or worth farming with friends.

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                    • Because the first set is usually -blam!- for stats forcing you to farm again, and that most of it is now more and more becoming tailored for content creators, streamers, and YouTubers only.

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