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論壇

9/29/2021 2:37:34 PM
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<I wish we could've told him ourselves. Savathun showed him in like the worst way possible all because we didn't have a voice despite us literally being BFFs with Crow in the lore. Either way, Savathun deserves death.>
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  • EXACTLY!!! even our ghost could’ve told him for us but nope… anyway can’t wait to kill you savathun!

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  • Why do you say that? I’m curious because it seems like she is the only one being real and showing him compassion Everyone else is acting in their own self interests at the cost of Crow’s psychological anguish

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  • <1 - worst way possible: We could've- SHOULD'VE just told him. It got kinda of ridiculous. Plus, viewing everything the way he did also included FEELING everything. We could've told him everything about Uldren as we knew him without having to make him feel the gun shot or getting vored by the Voice of Riven. 2 - Savathun has gleefully participated in the collective deaths of trillions of people. Though she has doubted the Sword Logic, she continues to do -blam!- with no remorse whatsoever. She murdered the good will out of her brother, and now tries everything in her power to effectively erase him from history, manipulating other broods into getting ideas they never really had just to get them to die off faster. She started ALL of the problems she "fixed", and now doesn't even care about the Dreaming City curse, making its existence absolutely pointless. So now the suffering of the Awoken is layered on top of itself with the addition of meaning nothing. She's been the antagonist of this game for the past four straight years.>

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  • 1) There’s something else that resembles this point-addiction and relapse. There’s a diff between detox and rehabilitation. You have to feel the pain to learn from it. Sure, you can be put to sleep for 3days and have the physical system purged. But not the mind;the underlying issues. The psychological. To be able to look back after months or years of withdrawal and pain and say to yourself “Not going thru all that again.” To learn coping skills. 2) You’re right. But I’ve been talking about Crow being shown his past and what he was. He had to feel it and see it for himself. Which is exactly what she did for him. My whole point is that only now can his storyline truly begin whether it’s redemption or relapse and no matter what, it’s all on him and the choices he makes going forward. “Uldren” was never dead to begin with. Only Crow can kill him

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  • You've obviously never dealt with politicians or someone who knows how to manipulate others through words. Hers are honeyed poison, just enough truth thrown in to persuade and dig in under the emotional armor. She's a sly one, Savathun...but she's not as clever as she thinks she is.

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  • Regardless of her intentions, she was the only one that did the right thing for him imo. Even before, he was just used and manipulated by his sister. He was being used and manipulated by the Vanguard. It’s more like faith in that regard. Believing in a god because you’re told to believe is vastly diff that actual belief thru self discovery, so to speak He has agency over himself for the first time ever. It’s his path to choose. Not someone else’s

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  • 由KannibalKlown編輯: 9/29/2021 6:04:48 PM
    Intentions and motives matter. Particularly if the person making the moves is known for manipulating people for their own dark ends. This isn’t some random stranger who caught you while falling, this is a person that has been manipulating you and likely just using this as yet another manipulation. But let’s take the whole semi immortal demigod of darkness out of the equation and look at more realistic scenario. Your house is on fire. You are outside but your wife and 16 year old daughter are trapped inside. Your neighbor runs in and saves them. You are ecstatic and idolize him. But wait… What if you find out he did it so he could sleep with your young daughter. Ummmm no thank you. Stay away from us What if you find out he arranged to have the fire started so he could be proclaimed a hero in the press. And maybe sleep with your wife as the cherry on top. Sure in both motivations, he saves your family. But in one the motive is dark and him hoping for an illegal consequence. In the other, he played a hand in the fire itself. We had Savathun manipulating Lakshmi AND THE CITIZENS to attack the refugee Fallen. People were hurt and scared as a result. Sure she goes on about how she forced out a problematic Lakshmi but ignores that she infected citizens with her mind worm song and caused the mini civil war. She says she saved a distraught Osiris, but did she just return him to us as an act of good faith? No she wore his body like a trench coat so she could manipulate us further and research the cabal anti light tech. She claims she saved us from talking to the voice in the dark. But was it to save us or for us to be in her debt. She says she brought Crow to the city and hid his identity. Ok fine but was that to help crow or to gain an ally against Mara?

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  • 由RopeAdope編輯: 9/29/2021 6:35:11 PM
    First off, ew. Second, we can reenact “The Princess Bride” all day and it’ll get us nowhere. Third, my answer to all that is, my first and foremost reaction would be glad my fam is alive. Bad ppl can do good things;good ppl can do bad things Crow deserved to know his past so he can choose a better path forward. Everything else (regarding this specific viewpoint) is peripheral imho and the cliche “we’ll cross that bridge when we come to it” Then again, I also think the Traveler is a sociopath but that’s another topic Edit: More clichés “The road to hell is paved with good intentions” “The ends justify the means” “It for your own good” Every tyrant in history used these exact excuses to justify genocide. And ‘mandates’……. ;-/

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  • When did the Vanguard "use" him?

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  • 由RopeAdope編輯: 9/29/2021 5:31:55 PM
    The entire time he’s been brought back? Didn’t the “Speaker” say he speaks FOR the Traveler but the Traveler didn’t speak to him? So who made up these “rules”? Keeping him ignorant is their way of manipulating and controlling ppl. They don’t even offer a choice Edit: Now THAT sounds exactly like a politician

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  • You didn't offer any specific examples for the Vanguard. Also Guardians are not "forbidden " from looking into their past, just discouraged because they might be horrified at what they find. Would you really want to know that centuries ago you might have been responsible in whole or in part for the Collapse? Me I'd rather not, that life is over and there isn't anything to be done about it. Sometimes it's just best to let the past be the past and focus on the present. Plus that search can also become an obsession like with Ana Bray, and if not careful that obsession can consume a person.

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  • “Why, oh why didn’t I take the blue pill?” Abraham Lincoln 1492

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  • I would absolutely want to know. How else would anybody learn or grow? Pretending like it never happened doesn’t make it so. Acknowledgment and repentance are powerful ideologies Keeping him ignorant is pretty specific, especially when the entire story revolves around him and his sister, because they don’t know what would happen if he learned. It isn’t their choice to make or their place to dictate Just as the “Darkness and Light ” are tools, neither inherently good or evil, so is knowledge. Which they withheld to suit their own purposes

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