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由Spawn編輯: 9/30/2020 12:34:14 PM
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IMO, it makes sense for them to keep it as-is for when Season 12 and Beyond Light launch, at 1060 power. You have to remember, [i]not everyone will own Beyond Light.[/i] There will be Guardians that jump into the Free starting point without any purchase, and Guardians that only own Forsaken + Shadowkeep. Keeping Y2 and Y3 content at 1060 power allows these players that don't have the latest content to still play the content with these older licenses. If Bungie were to increase "Moon" activities to 1360 as an example, that doesn't make any sense for players who don't own Beyond Light and there is no in-game advantage to doing so when they don't own Beyond Light or the Season Pass. All the content there doesn't require an increase in power level anyways and you can complete the content at a 1060 cap. While Bungie mentions that the Raids (Last Wish and Garden of Salvation) are exemptions to this rule ([url=https://www.bungie.net/en/Explore/Detail/News/49027]see here for an exact quote[/url]), the Core content from those DLC's, the story, triumphs, seals, adventures, exotic quests, etc are still available at their own respective power levels. For Guardians like you and me -- that have already completed all that content -- sure most of the activities in those destinations probably won't get a ton of time from us, cause we'll be spending time in the new Beyond Light endgame, with all the new weapons, gear, and activities. Personally, I don't want to keep grinding Moon activities, Garden of Salvation, Master Nightmare Hunts for pinnacle drops -- we've already done that for a year. I want to earn my pinnacle drops in newer content. We saw the same transition when Forsaken was the latest content and moved into Shadowkeep, the pinnacle and power sources all changed. I'd expect to see the same thing for Beyond Light. The system that Bungie is setting up here with power levels sets them up to rotate for future roadmaps and game licenses to still retain some older "legacy" content to stick around for newer Guardians. You can bet that whenever Forsaken content gets vaulted, so will the ability to purchase a Forsaken License, same with Shadowkeep -- just like how right now, you can't buy D2 Vanilla, Curse of Osiris, Warmind, etc. This entry point will be curated and change over time. If they adjust the power levels of older content, I'll eat my words and you can say you told me so. But as is, there is no advantage to them changing these levels for Y2 and Y3 content, it will only cause [i]even more[/i] confusion than you're describing to newer players.
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  • We should out level content then. That's the only way this works, and it's been discussed since D1 Y1.

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  • Well, said. I was about to make my own post, but you covered everything I was going to say. People forget that Activision is no longer running the show, so people are no longer forced to buy every scrap of content in order to play. So there are TIERS to the game, and not everything in it is going to be made with the most dedicated players in mind. Also these older locations aren't relevant right now. Like you I want to play the NEW stuff, and get my gear from the NEW stuff. One of the things that makes me HATE the Milestone system so much is that it FORCES you to play old content and engage with parts of the game you don't like....simply to level up your character. But I agree. I dont' see them making major changes to the Moon., Tangled Shore or Dreaming City. If Bungie expects to turn the FTP players into paying customers, there has to be content that is worth their time and effort to engage with.

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  • 由lCHARLIEoMOPPSl編輯: 10/1/2020 12:41:52 PM
    They are taking away several planets worth of content, I see no reason to assume they won’t make existing stuff like the moon unplayable too for people that don’t have beyond light

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  • So sun setting is bullshit.

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  • 由bjw編輯: 10/1/2020 11:45:26 AM
    1
    Not sure if this was brought up but I’m sure everyone that plays Destiny might have game pass now (maybe not) but if you’re on Xbox. You get to play day one Isn’t BL going to be on the game pass nov 10?

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  • It will. But not everyone plays on Xbox. You have to BUY Beyond Light if you want to play it on the other platforms.

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  • You’re right, that doesn’t make any sense and seems entirely pointless. Don’t even see why light exists anymore.

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  • 由kellygreen2編輯: 10/1/2020 2:24:10 PM
    To provide a sense of progression, and to gate access to content. Same reason that leveling exists in every RPG. People are just getting frustrated with it in THIS game because there has been no power to chase after in this game for the past year....and the progression system for the last two and a half years is an absolute travesty. You don't invest your time to progress. You gamble with it and hope to win something that will progress your character.

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  • 由Mono-Pop編輯: 10/1/2020 2:30:15 PM
    Except other games don’t have to provide a [i]sense[/i] of progression. Because they have actual progression.

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  • Every progression game gives a sense of progression. More experienced RPG devs just do a better job of hiding the wires and the smoke and mirrors. ...and they don't make their progression systems so obnoxious, manipulative, and disrespectful to the player's time as this game does. Leveling isn't bad. Light isn't bad. This game simply has one of the worst, and most abusive progression systems I've ever seen. Its almost like it was added to the game in order to PUNISH us for not playing vanilla D2 in the way the devs wanted. ....and people are starting to get sick of it. Which is why Bungie needs to get rid of it....or dial the impact of RNG WAAAAAAYYYYYY back if they don't want to see a mass exodus from the game by burned out players. People are losing their tolerance for the Milestone and Pinnacle systems...and Bungie will keep pushing this on us at their own peril.

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  • To counter all your somehow valid arguments with a single line: Why should non-relevant locations drop non-relevant gear/guns for people who HAVE the most relevant DLC drop?

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  • [quote]Why should non-relevant locations drop non-relevant gear/guns for people who HAVE the most relevant DLC drop?[/quote] Because its not for you. Its for those people in the FTP tier and for new players levelling up. Which is why Xur mainly has exotics you already have. The main reason Xur exists isn't to provide exotics to hardcore players. Its to act as a backstop against BAD LUCK for more casual and newer players.

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  • 由Spidey編輯: 10/2/2020 3:55:16 AM
    My question still stands and you basically repeat what the dude said. It doesn't matter if it is "not for you" or not. A whole space or spaces in general becoming pointless for a majorit of players, is, from a design PoV, just as pointless. They could have deleted all planets then, only leaving the cosmodrome for a tutorial area for new players then and block Beyond Light players completely out of anything but Europa. But heh, that sounds stupid right? But the current way of design and mentality of the devs with unjustified reasons isn't far from here as well. The game should recognize if you own certain recent contents and as a result should consider rewards droping for such players as well in non relevant areas.

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  • 由kellygreen2編輯: 10/2/2020 11:28:13 AM
    [quote]My question still stands and you basically repeat what the dude said[/quote] [b]Because that's the answer. Its just not the answer you WANT. [/b] Like many gamers of this generation, you seem to think the developer owes you a personally customized experience. Where everything in the game is tailored to your individual preferences. But the REALITY is that this is a form of mass media entertainment....and your preferences are just one voice in a CHOIR of millions of other voices. One set of preferences in a player base of MILLIONS of players, all playing for different reasons, in different ways with different goals. [b]So YES, it does matter that it isn't for you. [/b] Because sometimes Bungie has to do things that serve the needs of gamers who pay the same amount of money (or even more) to play this game....WHO AREN'T YOU....and have different wants and needs from than you do. Which means that the game sometimes turns in ways that don't serve your **short-term** wants or needs....and in ways you don't like. Bungie has to HAVE a path for people to ENTER into this game, or to play its FTP aspects that is WORTH their TIME AND EFFORT. It allows the game to add new players to replace those players who get bored or burned out....and leave. If they don't, those players will not invest in the game....and they won't become regular players....or even new hardcore players. Which means, over time, the game will slowly wither and die. So it is in your LONG term interests that they do this because it keeps player numbers high, matchmaking times short.....and making the game PROFITABLE. So Bungie can afford to keep making CONTENT for you to play.

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  • 由Spidey編輯: 10/3/2020 1:27:34 PM
    They don't owe me anything. I play videgames since the very early 90s. And with +30 years of gaming, I know how devs always look for excuses. This wouldn't be the first time. I stopped licking the boots of entitled studios and learned to question certain decisions. In the long run it pays of and games like Star Wars Battlefront 2 showed how game studios are focused on a less player based and more on a profit based experience, or is that something you would deny? Thx god people have open minds and sometimes don't take that nonsense. Shouldn't it be the other way around? A more player based experience? Personalized doesn't happen, and I know that. Yet, even from a player PoV studios start to distance themselfes. And therefore your arguments barely hold any ground....and with it my question still stands. I could tell you anything and say "this is the answer". Yet, it doesn't answer anything. It just leaves questions.

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  • 由kellygreen2編輯: 10/3/2020 3:08:17 PM
    [quote]They don't owe me anything. I play videgames since the very early 90s. And with +30 years of gaming[/quote] Then you're old enough to know better. 1. There are no perfect games. 2. Modern AAA video games are expensive to make with razor-thin profit margins. 3. You've been paying the same $60 for video games for those 30 years, despite inflation and the cost of EVERYTHING ELSE going up. That $60 you were paying in 1990 for a video game is now worth $120 in 2020 US dollars. 4. At this stage of your life, you should have learned how **shared spaces** work, and just because you pay to be a part of a shared space doesn't give you CONTROL over it. Everyone else who shares that space also has a say in whats done with it, and sometimes YOU get outvoted. 5. The only person who is behaving in an entitled manner here. IS. YOU.

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  • Other products and games (not all of them for sure) show you can treat your player base differently, especially whem it comes to MMOs. So don't act like a smart ass over here. Your "reputation" is well know here...

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  • 由kellygreen2編輯: 10/3/2020 3:22:32 PM
    Because MMO players understand the bargain that they are making, and the experience that they are paying for. If they don't like or want that bargain or experience....THEY MOVE ON AND GO PLAY SOMETHING ELSE. They don't hang around and try to turn that MMO into a game from a compeletly different GENRE like Destiny players constantly do. The problem is that THIS game is a hybrid game and has attracted shooter gamers, MMO gamers, Loot-based RPG gamers, and traditional RGP gamers. None of whom are willing to compromise their expectations, or used to having to get along with one another in a single game community, and ALL of whom think Bungie owes them the experience they got from their "single-genre" games. Which is an UNREASONABLE expectation and has led to the "identity crisis" this game has endured. https://youtu.be/IOoYsPHtVso This video should be required viewing before anyone is allowed to come here and start making "requests" for how the game should change. Athough I strenuously disagree with CCs suggestions for how to fix the game (his bias is that of a PVP-oriented player) his diagnosis of the problem that has plagued this game is right on point. My "reputation" isn't being a smart ass. My reputation is for shooting arguments full of holes when they make unreasonable demands upon the game. And it is an UNREASONABLE demand you are making. EVERY MMO that is long-standing has to take steps to keep the barrier-to-entry for new players low. So that the game can attract NEW players to replace the OLD ones they lose to attrition over the years. But those new players will not invest in the game if the developers do not give them a path into the game, and an experience worth playing that is WORTH their time. [b]YOUR wants got outvoted by the needs of those new players...and the experiences you are complaining about IS. NOT. FOR. YOU. [/b] [b]You are not the target audience.[/b] Just like Xur is not going to have any new exotics to offer to people who play 20 hours a week. Xur is just a source of random rolls on exotic armor pieces that I already have. Xur's primary reason for existing is to act as a guard against BAD LUCK for more casual and for NEWER players. His presence in the game is NOT. FOR. ME. .

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  • 由Spidey編輯: 10/3/2020 3:27:36 PM
    Your arguments are Bungies statements and some peoples videos. I don't care about that. Most of the time I see you posting here you literally do that withoht having an opinion, always making me questioning your posts in the first place. My question still stands.

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  • 由kellygreen2編輯: 10/3/2020 3:35:05 PM
    No. My statements are based on almost 45 years of gaming experience....and a quarter century of business experience. I posted the video from CC because it goes into a level of detail about the conflict AMONG THE PLAYER BASE over what kind of game Destiny is and what kind of game it should be that this environment won't allow.... ...but it at the heart of your complaints. And most of the player unhappiness this past year as the player base is forced to align itself with the "Unified Vision" that Smiths leadership is bringing to the game. I said a year ago that a LOT of people were going to be unhappy with the way that the game was going to change. But very few people listened.....and now, here we are. I have PLENTY of opinions about the game. The difference between you and I is that I understand that thsi game is a shared space, and that my personal preferences are just one voice in a very big choir. Unless Bungie is doing something that is liable to break the game, I make my preference known once...maybe twice....and then I let it go. If part of teh game changes in ways that I don't like, I STOP PLAYING. The fat that I'm part of the 150K+ players who no longer play Crucible every day since CBMM was forced on the player base....speaks VERY loudly. The fact that I don't play Iron Banner or Trials of Osiris which only had 76K players last Monday....speaks VERY loudly. I complain about the game frequently. The diffrence is that I don't COMPLAIN....and then continue to play AND complain. I complain....and then if things about what I'm complaining about don't change.....I stop engaging with that part of the game. Just that simple. But then my goal is my own happiness. Not trying to make Bungie do what I want.

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  • You can complain AND play a game, regardless of your thoughts or own stance to a game. Just because you don't play pvp, trials or IB (like me, never played ToO since it was introduced in D2) doesn't mean you are not allowed to voice an opinion. While some complain and you maybe see it as blind hate, others see a small core of truth in these posts (even if they don't agree with the OPs choice of words) because fact is: your customer wouldn't complain if most things and choices were fine and, most importantly, justified. Bungie, despite their own promises, isn't transparent enough with its community. Bungie, despite stating reasons for sunsetting, for example, always doing the weirdest things, not explaining in a satisfying way and leaving more questions than answer. Stuff like weapons, who got power limits, yet are suddenly back in S11 with literally no difference (Nightwatch etc). But it's another topic actually. Your actions in the game meaning NOTHING, as long the statistics Bungie is looking at, say otherwise. Therefore stating your (loud) opinion on reddit, in forums etx can do so much more than just "accepting" all the nonsense studios these days come up with. You have foreseen Luke Smith's Vision? Bet, everyone did when D2's sudden change in the microtransaction cosmos happened and Bungie partly shut leakers and insiders so the community doesn't go crazy and produces negative media in advance. Just blaming Smith alone is foolish though because he is just a small fish in this huge industry, ruled by greed, when games are made for the purses, not the player or out of passion of the devs to design videogames and see them as art, like EA did when there were once small AND motivated to revolutionize the industry in the early 90s. A videogame is a much more personal thing as you might think, touching the ones who play it and also the ones who created it.

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  • You can complain AND play a game, regardless of your thoughts or own stance to a game. Just because you don't play pvp, trials or IB (like me, never played ToO since it was introduced in D2) doesn't mean you are not allowed to voice an opinion. While some complain and you maybe see it as blind hate, others see a small core of truth in these posts (even if they don't agree with the OPs choice of words) because fact is: your customer wouldn't complain if most things and choices were fine and, most importantly, justified. Bungie, despite their own promises, isn't transparent enough with its community. Bungie, despite stating reasons for sunsetting, for example, always doing the weirdest things, not explaining in a satisfying way and leaving more questions than answer. Stuff like weapons, who got power limits, yet are suddenly back in S11 with literally no difference (Nightwatch etc). But it's another topic actually. Your actions in the game meaning NOTHING, as long the statistics Bungie is looking at, say otherwise. Therefore stating your (loud) opinion on reddit, in forums etx can do so much more than just "accepting" all the nonsense studios these days come up with. You have foreseen Luke Smith's Vision? Bet, everyone did when D2's sudden change in the microtransaction cosmos happened and Bungie partly shut leakers and insiders so the community doesn't go crazy and produces negative media in advance. Just blaming Smith alone is foolish though because he is just a small fish in this huge industry, ruled by greed, when games are made for the purses, not the player or out of passion of the devs to design videogames and see them as art, like EA did when there were once small AND motivated to revolutionize the industry in the early 90s. A videogame is a much more personal thing as you might think, touching the ones who play it and also the ones who created it.

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  • Oh, you can do anything you want...as long as you’re willing to live with the outcome. Which in this case is teaching Bungie to ignore you. Because if you’re going to continue to complain and STAY? Why should they listen to you when you’re showing them that there are no consequences to ignoring you.

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  • Why are you assuming that I dislike the game so much?

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  • I'm not. I'm responding to the apparent disregard that you have for other people in the community....and your **irritation** at Bungie chanding the game to meet their needs.

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