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I ain't reading all that i'm happy for u tho or sorry that happened

Look, if I get killed by a weapon or ability, then that weapon or ability is OP. End of discussion.

Sorry. Not reading that. You got a summary?

That’s the destiny nerf community for you

“Look at the bigger picture” he said. Nerfs won’t make you good

I miss combined arms could you imagine how cool it would have been to have the drakes drop on the map.

Could you not have just said, "I want game-to-game lobbies, map veto, and combined arms back. Outside of competitive modes, balance be damned." I read your whole post and that was all I could ascertain, everything else is so vague and seemingly misplaced grievance with certain communities.

That’s a lot of words, too bad I ain’t readin’ em.

Please stop confusing what players ask for vs reality. The “comment” section is where we all pretend we have a voice. The reality are the graphs fed to bungie being that this game is digital and everything is looked at for quality of life or game balancing scenarios. The window of time it takes to incorporate a balance gives the illusions that bungie is listening to said feedback but in reality, it takes time for said actions to be incorporated via debugging, programming etc.. that all comes from going over information. It is NOT the community causing any balance changes other than abusing said things and thus bringing them into bungies reports and then researched. It will NEVER be due to the comment sections of a forum… said forums only educate other players who are looking to take advantage in any way with either pve or PvP.

Nerf controller aim assist in PC lobbies like Apex just did. When amazing MnK players are switching to controllers well then there's a problem.

[quote]I know there are going to be some that say no, “get good” or whatever toxic nonsense that holds no sustenance, so get it out of your system for your own sake of not receiving attention from a significant other or being held as a child. Back on subject, however, the track record has shown that asking for nerfs in this sense has seemed to always lead to a minimal correction within the game. There is always a replacement. There is always a worse variable or variant. It really wasn’t as OP as you believe. It is counter-able. It isn’t a problem for me. These are the usual answers you see when addressing such nerf topics especially if it is demeaning somebody’s singular playstyle or loadout option. However, why don’t players scream or ask for changes to/for map design, map selections, map voting or anything substantial that can truly flip the sandbox for PVP. Do you know that anytime a change is made from a nerfing perspective for PVP, it usually has a negative affect on PVP and PVE as whole which negates our Power Level structure even further?? Think about if we took the logical approach of addressing the first component of entertaining PVP versus the one we are using. We all have a choice in weapons, armor, exotics, playlists and modes. We don’t have a choice in the maps catered to each archetype, map selection, ability to vote against/for a map nor access to the components used in PVE for PVP ie Banshees, Pikes, Turrets and other vehicles. We used to have Combined Arms and I do not recall players complaining about special weapons or subclasses because each player focus was different during the match. It didn’t feel competitive and it felt fun. There were players fighting over the turrets, vehicles and players playing the game in a fashion that fit their playstyle. There were a variety of players with different avenues and agenda of play. Now each player plays the same exact way regardless if you are a new, experienced or a sweaty player. I didn’t mention anything about the 3v3 playlist because it works as intended with the exception for the rewards, lobby balancing and matchmaking system which is a problem in the standard 6v6 genre of the game anyways. Bungie, change how you handle the sandbox based off how you view the playerbase’s opinions on the state of PVP and how you handle them from a developer perspective. There are far too many components that make up the concept of PVP for the same thing or the minimalist effort applied to fix or balance the sandbox. For the players who think Combined Arms was such a slow playlist in D1, it was because you wanted a competitive scene of play in which Bungie move should have been to introduce COMP like we have in D2 but in D1. If Bungie would have simply took the time to comb over what they had that was working versus not working, the implementation of D2 reverting to a double primary state probably wouldn’t have happened. Players with such a mindset has 2 options for competitive play while players with no interest in the competitive scene but enjoy build crafting and testing out builds, have a 1/2 of a playlist 6V6 wise because everybody plays exactly how they would play in Trials or Comp. All team shooting and no actual skill quality to entertain a singular gunfight on the own while entertaining the easiest of loadouts Bungie has purposely created with unbalance sandbox changes to appease to a competitive scene. Players are split into 2 categories for the most part: Build-crafters and Fanatics Of The High Stats. So players of the nerf everything community, if you desire real change for the game, you should search your soul on what made D1 feel better than the current state of D2 and list those instead because nerfs or changes should only happen when something is extremely oppressive, broken or creates boredom.[/quote] Your first sentence negates your whole diatribe.

I am confused about this post? Are you asking for Combined Arms back, explaining that nerfs are inherently bad(not like as a blanket all the time but generally), or wanting more diversity in builds? This isn't meant to come off as irritated, I am just genuinely confused by the point(s) that you are trying to make? [spoiler]I think I agree but just need some clarification.[/spoiler]

I’ve definitely seen both sides at fault before but some people really need to calm down about these things.

I do agree. One eye mask has a counter if people stopped getting everything nerfed. Wormhusk in its prime, stompees are always a counter but every hunter was trying to shotgun rush the one eye mask. And they couldn’t get the advantage so they cried. Contravers holds would of also been a good counter as well as the mask of backris in its prime. I know I would not of been upset as much about shatterdive if I had something like one eye mask in its prime. Everything would of eventually been counterable but since everyone knows Bungie will nerf something when enough people complain, they continue to do it

Anytime a change is made via nerfs it has a negative impact on the game….. you’re very wrong there People didn’t complain about convinced arms because people basically only played it when it was new or the odd time it came around in rotation so it’s problems didn’t fester and grow in people’s minds Combined arms was slower, it isn’t an opinion either. They were larger maps and it wasn’t uncommon for people to sit back and snipe or lane. Vehicles are also never fun to fight against in a game that revolves around its guns You didn’t have to teamshot but people have always done it, it isn’t unique to destiny either. Often times I’d flank back in the vanilla d2 days and get the first pick in trials, just took some brain cells in that sandbox since ttk wasn’t as fast Build crafting typically does one thing in this games pvp, find some obnoxious way to get easy kills. I am yet to see a build based around some skillful play. I see far more talk about stats coming from Bad players then I do “fanatics of the high stats” and that’s been the case for years. Again d1 didn’t feel better, it felt new at the time. You go back to it now for a full week or two and I guarantee you’ll remember everything that made it frustrating. Honestly your post brought up one thing of value, map veto which this game should have ffs.

Now...is it possible that Bungie just so happens to over-nerf things or release things that are a tad too hot because they just suck at tweaking a few things? Perhaps the people asking for nerfs and buffs aren't to blame...but Bungie themselves for cranking the dial too far in either direction?

No. Nerf melees.

I wish I had enough time in my day to write a 673 word essay about why people shouldn’t complain on a video game forum

That first part was basically my post a few minutes ago but glad someone thinks the same

THIS. So much this exactly!