Summoner and Gnawing Hunger, the bane of my existence in crucible lately, literally feels like you're dead the second someone looks at you with one of those guns..

I agree with a small range nerf on autos, but nothing drastic. The bigger problem is how slower-firing primary weapons are in a bad place right now. They're beat at mid range by fast-firing weapons and they get destroyed at long range because they can't flinch snipers effectively.

*Jotunn enters the chat* This is the way......

Yep. Hand cannons on all three characters. That’s why I don’t remember you here claiming that HCs needed to be nerfed during the two years the dominated the meta and the year that LH and NF terrorized Quickplay. But my, let us have an AR meta for more than a month...,,

I get they're a bit overpowered, but there HAS to be some way casual players can get through crucible without losing their minds. We get it. Youre super awesome aiming a Hand Canon and we're not, but if we're gonna randomly get matched with you because Bungie is strongly encouraging us to play their pvp for whatever - Power drops, certain quests, Solstice...i get it, Im OK with it but it needs to be fun for us. Getting smacked by dudes with NF endlessly is not fun. I love that I can still just go in with Jotunn. I enjoy disrespecting crucible whenever I can personally lol.

The way I see it is that the most people that are complaining are those who ran hand cannons for that year+ meta. And now that it has switched to a weapon that is not a hand cannon they are complaining.

600 autos average range is 25-26 meters and a max of 30 without scopes. They don't map people at all. But gnawing hunger being the highest statted auto in the game allows it to hit that 29-30 meters easily. But a lot of other 600 autos experience much more drastic damage fall off and have a lower damage range because of how impactful the range stat is. You can probably cap the range to like...28 on non-scope options for balance, but just know that any more and its gonna hurt especially since it only takes about 1.5 damage to turn it back into a .80 ttk weapon. 600s are in a very tricky place to balance..they are either god or trash unless they spend actual effort balancing them, which they never do. I told everybody this change would make them stupid, but I'm not going to deny that previously they had no place in either pve or pvp because 150 handcannons were just better in every way and so were pulse rifles. 360 autos are just too recoil heavy, 720s are good but have no range, 450 autos are ass and 600s do everything good that every other auto archetype can't do. Don't nerf their damage fall off, tweak the damage to be less forgiving but hit that .70 if they are accurate, then see where to go from there.

Pretty ridiculous to buff 600 RPM autos as much as they did after putting severe range caps on their natural counters, hand cannons. Just goes to show Bungie is more concerned with shifting the meta rather than bringing the gap between meta and non-meta. Autos can be meta for all I care, but the gap between #1 and #2 is the largest it has been on console since the Luna's and NF meta. That's just a fact, and it's ridiculous.

I'm usually against nerfs, but Autos are statistically a big problem in pvp right now: In terms of %kills: (guardian.gg) Autos ≈ 33% HC's ≈ 18% Sidearms ≈ 5% Pulse ≈ 4% Scouts ≈ 3% Smgs ≈ 1% Bows ≈ 1% The meta is currently completely polarized in favor of Auto Rifles to the point the number of kills they get is 33 times more than the least used primaries, which is ridiculous.

When the considered least skillful weapon type, specifically the most forgiving archetype of said weapon type, is the best in the game you know you've failed to properly balance your PvP environment. The easiest/most forgiving weapon should NEVER be the best option to use in a FPS. It just completely destroys the skill floor.

Nope. They are finally balanced. Most whiners are people who used only handcannons for 2+ years and are upset another weapon is on even playing field.

Sure let’s nerf them . But 150 HC’s will also need to be nerfed at the same time . They are the two most used archetype’s .

[url=https://guardian.gg/2/weapon-stats/2/37/0/2020-07-19/2020-08-19]Here[/url] is the weapon usage stats for console. Please people, do tell how this is fine.

[quote]Literally they melt as fast as prenerfed recluse from the range of a scout rifle.[/quote] 0.7 isnt even close to 0.44. And 25-30 meters before falloff isn't "scout range." [quote]Edit: those of you that need a 600 just to spray together shows how little you actually want a real balance.[/quote] Or we don't want ARs to go back to meme tier, like how they've been for the majority of the past half decade. [quote]"Autos are finally good stop asking for nerfs" What I'm asking for is a balance it's what majority of people want to go in with any weapon and have it feel viable.[/quote] And that's how things are right now, at least where you're not handicapped by forced controller usage (even among controllers, the aiming on it is horrible). [quote]Why use a 360 auto when you can use a 600 and do it better?[/quote] Why not ask for 360s to be buffed? They don't really [i]do[/i] anything, same with 450s, which is the overall worst primary archetype in the game. [quote]You dont care about balance you just want things to be easy and require little to no skill.[/quote] Hence why I don't want 150s with base [b][i][u]93[/u][/i][/b] aim assist to be the only viable options. Face it, Destiny's gunplay in general is really easy. [quote]Just point in general direction and hold r2.[/quote] I'm throwing the challenge flag on that play. Doing that gets you killed and makes you lose. Only pre-nerf Recluse was a truly viable spray and pray gun, and that was only when it's perk was up. You have summoned me.

Make 150 and 140 hand cannons One head and two body and improve scouts and no need to nerf 600 autos.

I can see a small nerf being necessary, but most auto rifles are actually still trash. Have you tried using a high impact auto rifle lately? Still absolute garbage tier.

They don't need to Nerf 600s they need to bring other weapons up.