HIF are good leave HIF alone in PvE do what you like in PvP... ban the flipping things and let the shotgun apes have their day in the sun, who cares?

So glad this post won’t die😂 Oh boy.

Someone posted on another article how 50% of all fusion rifle kills, in crucible, are with Erentil. That's very telling. Jotuun should be in the heavy slot, imo. This is for PvE And PvP. Note: I don't shotgun either. I hate those damn things in crucible, I never see them coming lol

The game is already statistically overpopulated with Shotguns and Snipers. It's obvious the people who want Fusions nerfed only want to play games in which everyone is spamming Shotguns or sitting in the back of the map with a Sniper. The people who want Fusions nerfed because they think it will "indirectly buff Primary weapons" will be surprised once they see 6 Shotgun Apes rushing them from all angles 😂

Fusions are fine. Backup plan is not.

I agree. I still see way more shotguns and even snipers than i do fusions. Personally i think the frustration with fusions comes from the fact that there is a larger skill gap between a good player with a fusion and an average player with a fusion VS shotguns which have a much smaller skill gap and have a higher ease of use making them more preferable for casual players. As an additional side note, I think part of the problem is that fusions have a kill range that is on par with hand cannons, autos, and pulse rife range and most of the maps are designed around this range (about 25-35meters)

Fusions are the only mainstream special weapon that is countered the same way you would counter a power weapon (not surprising since they are also the only special weapon that wasn’t nerfed upon leaving the power slot) You can easily flinch a sniper You can easily out range a shotgun Your best bet with a fusion? Hoping they miss (using a hit scan weapon that doesn’t require precision and has a gratuitous hitbox and insane aim assist) There is almost no situation in which a primary can directly deal with erentil, Example: 35m away, well outside of the range of hand cannons, sidearms, SMGs, etc let’s say you are using a horrors least, arguably the best primary at that range. You can shoot me first and I can whip out my back up plan fusion and win 9/10 times unless I choke. Nothing you can do, even with the best possible primary for that range can change that. Even though you can be hitting me in the head and I just need to aim around your knees. Same situation but I have a shotty? I’m hosed because I’m easily out ranged. Same situation but I have a sniper? I’m hosed because I’m flinched. Fusion? Candy because you made the mistake of using a primary weapon. I’m sure I will see a lot or comments in here complaining about shotguns.... So here’s some comparative math: God roll Mindbenders max OHK range: 9m Guardian movement speed with max mobility and a sprint bonus: 9.5m/s Back up plan erentil charge time: 0.43 seconds In that 0.43 seconds the mindbender player can cover approximately 4 meters by sprinting, or maybe 6 meters with jumps/slides Mindbenders effective range then? 15 meters maximum. Erentil effective range in the same time span? 40m See the difference? Now, you might argue that shotguns/snipers are more popular because they are better.... Here is my opinion on that, Snipers and shotguns have a lower barrier to entry than fusions, simply by merit of being an instant kill. Bad players can brainlessly straight line with a shotgun or camp with a sniper and have relative success. Fusions take a bit more game awareness to be able to use. At the high tiers of matchmaking, snipers can more effectively counter fusions, and can really punish them in small team engagements. HOWEVER because of fusions, the game quickly devolves into a battle of special weapons. Why? Because fusions beat all primary weapons... EASILY with no primary counter (unlike shotguns or snipers) which means having your primary out against a team with a fusion is a liability.... So what happens? Players immediately avoid using a primary and just snipe or just shotgun or just fusion..... And that ruins the meta. If fusions were removed from the game (not suggesting that). You would almost imediately see more primary play. If I had to use primary only I would 100% prefer to play against a shotgun or sniper player rather than a fusion that I have 0 chance of beating. Sincerely somebody who abuses a back up plan firmly planted erentil when needed and has 4k + back up plan fusion kills.

I don’t understand all the fusion complaints. I see maybe 1 fusion in 20 games of comp. [spoiler]that sole fusion user is me lmao[/spoiler]but I see mindbender in EVERY comp match I play.

The whole tradeoff with fusions is a charge up time in exchange for some pretty nasty range. Backup Plan removes the negative side of that tradeoff, and unbalances the entire archetype. If Backup Plan remains, then a perk needs to be added for shotgun that greatly increases range immediately after swapping to it, and snipers need a variable zoom that can swap between high and low zoom.

I think they are fine. That quickdraw Mindbenders tho, not so much.

Fusion rifles need to be left alone, I don’t use them much and it requires technique to use anyhow. Why does everyone cry so much about the wrong stuff. The problems with this game are....no dedicated server

There will be even more shotguns in PvP once it happens ! traveller help us all .

As a group they are. Erentil probably has to have its perk tree adjusted so that you can rein in some of the possible god rolls. Cool Guy gave a half-baked analysis in his video about it. But it did do some things that were very valuable: [i]It showed what a talented fusion rifle player could do with the weapon when you are able to stack perks on top of one another that maximize range, stability, and accuracy.[/i] He also gave a good analysis of the skills needs to use these weapons well, and basically told those who want to dismiss them as a skilless crutch to basically STFU. However, frequency with which he was pulling off shots on Xbox that looked like linear fusion shots were a bit silly, and it’s reasonable for pvp players to object to that. It also showed a way forward to rein in those shots without breaking fusion rifles as a class, and preserving its role in the sandbox. 1. Firmly Planted needs to go. It’s the strongest perk in the tree...and it Bungie’s efforts to pressure people into using a mechanic that has little value in pve and is just obnoxious in pvp. 2. There are too many range/stability perks in the Erentil tree compared to other high impacts. Reduce the number of them. That way those god-rolled weapons become less frequent and less of an outlier in performance. You also increase the trade off required to run one with back up plan. As well as eliminating the pvp troll build of one with both Firmly planted and Backup Plan. So I’m hopeful—much more than before—-that Bungie can tweak this particular weapon with breaking the weapon class or its legitimate place in the sandbox.

Erentil fr4 can kill from sniper rifle ranges and requires little to no aiming ability since only a few bolts need to hit to kill. The perk backup plan negates the one draw back of fusions: a charge time. They are not 'fine.' If your argument is "oh, but I never see them in MY games!" You can go ahead and take your garbage opinion to the door. I don't see ddosers in my games either but that doesn't mean they aren't an issue.

Yeah I’m doing my part, getting Hatemail from Erentil Users from using Le Monarque 😂