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작성자: Wes
2/7/2019 1:39:07 AM
309
Not Forgotten and Luna's Howl are a Problem
So before anyone throws a fit, I have Not Forgotten. I got a group, I practiced, I succeeded and died succeeded and died over and over again, got good as a team and got it.
Not Forgotten and Luna's Howl are way too forgiving and dominate the game.
The gun does nothing except discourage players from playing PvP, even in quickplay. I get it. Pinnacle weapons need to be strong and PvP players needed something to grind for, but these guns have gone too far in the right direction. Pinnacle weapons should be fun and powerful in the right hands, and 180 RPM hand cannons have a very low skill requirement due to their high stability and recoil direction. This normally results in a slow TTK, but LH and NF negate this entirely with 2 headshots and a body. Ace of Spades even requires 3 headshots to kill. This results in people winning engagements because they have the better gun, rather than the better movement and aim.
As for a solution to these guns, I have no idea. Nerfing them, removing then from QP, or altering them will be met with a bunch of anger and lashing out. My best ideas (not perfect by far) are:
1. Make them exotics. Maybe then people will have a harder time choosing them and their choice will matter more.
2. Make Magnificent Howl activate after three precision hits, making it a 4 shot kill on the first target and a 3 shot kill on the next, as long as you continuously hit crits.
3. Nerf the perk so it takes 3 consecutive headshots to kill. That way the gun isn't as forgiving and requires a larger amount of skill to use appropriately.
4. Make them kinetic weapons. The best primary shouldn't be able to he pairs with the best shotgun in the game honestly. (Precision shotguns need a rework. Dust Rock Blues has very few downsides compared the aggressive frame shotguns.)
5. Decrease their stability and recoil direction significantly. The guns can honestly be spammed and be affective due to the flinch the cause and their stability and recoil direction and still be very, very effective. This is especially true in team engagements, but is also true for 1v1 engagements.
6. Combinations of those above.
I hope the guns aren't nerfed into the ground, but some adjustments are necessary. I don't even use mine.
Edit: The other solution to this issue is one I completely forgot to mention. Buff other hand cannons. 140s should kill in 2 crit 1 body. Balance the others from there. 180s should probably stay the same or have more recoil.
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Another idea is to just disable them in quick play (QP) but allow them in all of the other Competitive modes since they are really “Competitive” guns (of course they would be unlocked in all PVE modes). This would also even out the level for obtaining these guns over time since the difficulty for getting these types of weapons actually increases over time as more and more of these guns are acquired over time.
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2 답변I just think other hand cannons should get a slight buff since they aren't spammable like 180s. I have lunas and think it is fine where it is at, but other hand cannon archetypes should be more competitive. (I'm on Xbox)
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The main problem with Luna and nf are that they are 180 rpm hc which we all know are incredibly forgiving and user friendly. The best thing to do imo would be to make them a 140 or 150 rpm gun which would essentially make them a d2 version of eysluna or palindrome from d1. That way your not messing with the main perk and your making it harder to hit headshots, plus getting a 3 tap would be far more rewarding
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13 답변[quote]So before anyone throws a fit, I have Not Forgotten. I got a group, I practiced, I succeeded and died succeeded and died over and over again, got good as a team and got it. Not Forgotten and Luna's Howl are way too forgiving and dominate the game. The gun does nothing except discourage players from playing PvP, even in quickplay. I get it. Pinnacle weapons need to be strong and PvP players needed something to grind for, but these guns have gone too far in the right direction. Pinnacle weapons should be fun and powerful in the right hands, and 180 RPM hand cannons have a very low skill requirement due to their high stability and recoil direction. This normally results in a slow TTK, but LH and NF negate this entirely with 2 headshots and a body. Ace of Spades even requires 3 headshots to kill. This results in people winning engagements because they have the better gun, rather than the better movement and aim. As for a solution to these guns, I have no idea. Nerfing them, removing then from QP, or altering them will be met with a bunch of anger and lashing out. My best ideas (not perfect by far) are: 1. Make them exotics. Maybe then people will have a harder time choosing them and their choice will matter more. 2. Make Magnificent Howl activate after three precision hits, making it a 4 shot kill on the first target and a 3 shot kill on the next, as long as you continuously hit crits. 3. Nerf the perk so it takes 3 consecutive headshots to kill. That way the gun isn't as forgiving and requires a larger amount of skill to use appropriately. 4. Make them kinetic weapons. The best primary shouldn't be able to he pairs with the best shotgun in the game honestly. (Precision shotguns need a rework.) 5. Decrease their stability and recoil direction significantly. The guns can honestly be spammed and be affective due to the flinch the cause and their stability and recoil direction and still be very, very effective. This is especially true in team engagements, but is also true for 1v1 engagements. 6. Combinations of those above. I hope the guns aren't nerfed into the ground, but some adjustments are necessary. I don't even use mine.[/quote] They should just remove the the part of the screen notifying them how they died. Similar to what Bungie did to everyone’s connection status bar.
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I dunno, I've beaten plenty of people that have Not Forgotten. The key is map awareness and flinch. Understand the gun's strengths and weaknesses, and play against those. In Quickplay, if you're getting "sweaty" and rocking NF + LW or Dust Rock - get a life. And when that happens, I get sweaty too and even out the playing field.
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8 답변I’m crap at pvp, I love Mahem however. For me them guns are fine they take skill and a lot of effort to get, if people put the effort in they should be rewarded. My issue is auto rifles are still shite
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1. Make them exotics. Maybe then people will have a harder time choosing them and their choice will matter more. Imo, an alright suggestion it would lessen the use a bit and those who use it wouldn’t be able to pair it with other exotics so that’s a huge plus. 2. Make Magnificent Howl activate after three precision hits, making it a 4 shot kill on the first target and a 3 shot kill on the next, as long as you continuously hit crits. This would completely ruin the perk as it would be the same as a rampage trust and there would be no reason even get these guns. 3. Nerf the perk so it takes 3 consecutive headshots to kill. That way the gun isn't as forgiving and requires a larger amount of skill to use. This is the best course of action and rewards a skilled hand, this would increase the skill gap.
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2 답변작성자: FrenetiCreature 2/6/2019 5:19:10 PMWait... "Precision shotguns need reworked?" What exactly do you mean, that they're weak? Have you played against someone that knows how to use one well? Holy cow, those things are snipers. I've never used them, because I didn't think I'd be good enough to get the crit shots, while trying to go fast with one. But the few times that I've played against people that were pretty good at using them - Whoa! I was shocked at the ranges from which they could get a ohk. I just thank my lucky stars that they are a little more difficult to use, and that they are few and far between. If they were made so that more people used them, I feel like they'd become a pretty significant problem. I've never asked for a nerf to anything. I'm actually a proponent for 'buffs only', but I feel like the P-shotguns are potentially one buff away from being the literal, physical iteration of what people exaggerated Felwinter's to be. Edit - Oh wait, nevermind. I just thought about it, and I bet you meant to nerf the Dust Rock Blues archetype, and probably not buff the Good Bone Structure type shotguns, right? If so, just disregard this. Lol Edit 2 - Also, if Thorn were to come back as it was during the Skolas era, I don't think LH and NF would bother anyone anymore. I know it won't happen, but... Just saying.
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1 답변
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1 답변I completely agree. I never lose a gun fight with not forgotten. It’s made the game so easy and boring. Hopefully they do something about this to make hand cannons fun like in D1 with eyasluna and palindrome where you actually felt rewarded for winning a gun fight
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1 답변
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2 답변IMHO bring back Trials. It will filter out everyone who already got their pinnacle weapons from quick play for the most of the week. Add a solid matchmaking algorithm on the top of that and the Crucible will be much more even.
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It's funny to look back--I don't like Crucible so the first time I ever played, I did so to get Ace of Spades. I remember my first couple games I felt like I was getting mauled (I was using the Ikelos cannon, so not the best, but relatively fast, and my aim isn't terrible); I kept looking at what killed me, and it kept being the same guy with some random legendary hand cannon. "Wtf man, how is this dude with that Luna's Howl generic HC killing me so quickly?" It was only a month or so later reading these forums that I pieced together that I was actually getting merked by one of the best PvP weapons in the game. Now every time I'm surprised how quickly I die, I feel a little better when I look at the top left and see the word "Luna's."
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3 답변Why not just move them to the 150 RPM handcannon archetype. The gun type would still have its superior time to kill with the same glorious howl as now, but the recoil would be harder to use at range. I think this would be the most effective nerf if they were to do one. I would rather them fix the matchmaking so that people in comp who haven’t gotten to the level to get the gun wouldn’t face it every match. Right now I’m facing them consistently at 100 Glory, and that is really not okay.
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11 답변Bring back Luck in the Chamber perk. This will give other HC a chance to compete against LH and NF. I honestly think this would make a huge difference please bungie.
