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작성자: Spawn
12/12/2018 2:42:52 PM
329
Anyone else think Raids have become over engineered and too complicated?
It'd be a Saturday night, and I'd be kicking back with my fireteam, large Jack Daniels next to me.
We'd start a raid and maybe some of us would be inexperienced or new to it?
But we'd have a laugh and Troll each other, by pushing people off ledges, or instructing them wrongly for the giggles.
But there was no pressure, the mechanics weren't too challenging, and it didn't take long to learn.
As I watch each new raid drop, I watch a stream or YouTube, and sit and think - WTF?
A catalogue of tasks that must be performed, a light level needed that'll take ages to achieve.
Weaponry and armour that you'll have needed to have traded your freedom for.
And RNG drops of exotics, that simply don't happen.
Glue some elitism into the mix as well.
I go into a new raid and I should already be experienced lol
LW dropped and within 48hrs lfg sites were littered with "Must have experience" - within 48hrs??
I'm just saying it just seems like the fun aspect has been ripped out, and replaced with over complicated mechanics.
Perhaps to extend game play?
What ever happened to NORMAL MODE and HARD MODE?
Yeah where did that go?
I'm not struggling, hell I'm 628 pretty much across 3 characters, and have smashed LW out a lot.
I'm just saying how this is all seeming to be heading in the wrong direction.
Where did all the fun go?
[spoiler]Moderator edit: This thread has been moved to #Feedback forum so that other Destiny players can weigh in. [url=https://www.bungie.net/en/Forum/Post/139533839/0/0] See Cozmo's thread here[/url] for more information about the #Feedback tag and its uses.
Feel free to private message the moderator who moved your post, link to topic for further clarification about why this topic was moved.[/spoiler]
English
#feedback
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3 답변Last wish is the only raid that currently frightens me away from attempting. I just can't force myself to remember a name for every single symbol, I don't have the brain power for that The new raid looks super fun though
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3 답변작성자: Kas 12/12/2018 2:59:11 PMYou people are ridiculous, NONE of you even ever have to figure out the raid , literally just watch a youtube video and apply skill & you tards are crying about That? If your complaining about that you shouldn't be playing this game or any other rpg like game for that matter. Nothing is this game is complicated at all. smh for -blam!- sake yall can't be this stupid yall probably just suck at this game or you're a casual. yall just keep messing destiny up. just like Street Fighter & overwatch Bungie listening to these clowns will ruin their game. Only idiots complaining dont actually play the game like the rest of us. Nothing is destiny is complicated, nothing, the game is grindy thats it. There are super mario levels harder than this entire game like WTF & this is "complicated & hard" yall are children that just want to sit mindlessly in front of a screen and shoot stuff with no intellectual or skill challenge or yall want to be CARRIED. Go play COD or fortnite.
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11 답변they really aren't that hard outside of a first run when your under leveled once your on level its a cake walk
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Haven't played SoS or last wish or the new raid for this very reason. There is a fine line between fun and difficulty that could be struck with normal and hard mode but that idea vanished. Also the "you already need to know the raid like the back of your hand" mentality has ruined the experience for me. That said a good group of ppl can make a very challenging experience fun but those ppl are few and far between.
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1 답변I don't mind making something challenging. I do mind trying to communicate with 5 other people on a ridiculously circuitous method to get through an encounter, not because it is difficult mind you, but because of the sheer number of steps involved. Atheon was great. It was difficult at first, but once you got the communication down it was something that could be tackled. Not cheesed or whatever - just conquered. Crota's "raid" itself was easy enough, but once again at first glance it was a challenge. However with communication it was an accessible mountain to climb. Same with TTK and (less so) RoI. Then we got the Leviathan. And it was the first raid I left thinking "I never want to do that again". Even after a few runs, it is still a chore. It is not fun. Why? Because even communicating with your team does not net you a straight path to victory. The steps involved with just doing dps to the final boss are so convoluted and arduous it is more of a challenge maintaining your patience with other people than it is conquering an activity. Trying to find a group that is not talking over one another is more of a task than anything else! I got Forsaken and I have not yet even attempted to find a group for Last Wish. I have not seen anything on it, or how to run it. The absolute dumpster fire that was Leviathan turned me off to raids in this game completely.
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3 답변
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7 답변Remove the revive tokens from normal raids. No one wants to teach because of those revive tokens. Leave them for prestige raids...but normal? Who's bright idea was it?
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That's why I liked the dungeon, because it was easy and fun Not like the raids, I haven't completed any raid in D2 People seem to forget that this is a videogame, it is supposed to be fun and entertaining I still miss the good old days were you just needed to shot some bad guys and it was over
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[quote]But we'd have a laugh and Troll each other, by pushing people off ledges, or instructing them wrongly for the giggles.[/quote] "Hey new guy, see that giant glowing orb? You gotta jump up and touch it to summon the Warpriest." :::snicker, snicker:::
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Agree 10000% I feel like they need two versions. Fine keep a hardcore crazy challenge for worlds 1st and Datto BUT give us chill folks another laid back version to just have fun with friends in and get some loot. Even if the Casual version released a few weeks later I'd be fine with that. Does Power level BS really matter? why? like does Datto care IF the normal raid drops some 650 loot a month after he has beaten it blindfolded and has been 650 for weeks? let casuals have some drunk silly raid ledge pushing shenanigans again Bungie.
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12 답변I stopped reading here: [quote]large Jack Daniels next to me.[/quote] Get some real whiskey, like a respectable human being.
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Every raid is complicated and hard in the beginning. It takes time to figure out. But, once you do, it becomes second nature. Especially with a good team you are familiar with. King's Fall is still to this day my favorite raid BECAUSE of the more involved mechanics. Crota and VoG were always fun to just goof off with. No doubt about that. Heck, WotM was also fun to mess around with. I remember it was always a competition to see who could do the most DPS with certain loadouts. I will admit that that aspect has disappeared in D2. D2 raids are geared more towards full team cooperation for completion. If one or two guys fail, it's usually pretty detrimental. It does put pressure on you to not mess up. But, I still like the challenge. I've only completed Last Wish a number of times but even it is simple now that I've figured it out. Like I said. It just takes some time. I don't mind the complicated mechanics. There is only one "raid" in Destiny history that I will refuse to play again and that's Spire of Stars. The mechanics in that lair were essentially RNG which I do not agree with. I haven't attempted the newest raid but I look forward to trying it.
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2 답변Definitely agree, they should be tough encounters with basic mechanics, something like the forge/strike bosses currently on a bigger scale, in a unique area, that requires focus but not over the top precision coordination. When the top teams take nearly a day to complete a raid what hope do we normal players have, loved VOG, Crota, most of WOTM, hated kingsfall due to the uneccesary hoop jumping
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8 답변100% right. Calculus is easier than the raid mechanics now. Back in D1 if someone on the team sucked the other five could carry that person through, the way it’s been in D2 all six people need to be 100% perfect 100% of the time, makes it more stressful than fun anymore.
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4 답변Over engineered and complicated raids are the fun ones. Raids like VOG were cool and all, but the magic gets boring very fast. Stay here, defend this circle. Stay here, defend this conflux. I appreciate mechanics. They bring a bit more to do aside from killing ads. The new Scourge raid is actually pretty cool in design. The mechanics, albeit random have an actual purpose in terms of progressing forward. The act of hunting prey in a desert urban setting whilst fighting a Metal Gear is badass.
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The issue with "Must have experience" has been around since the beginning. None of the raids in my opinion are too complicated for anyone to handle. One of the things I do like about the raids is that each encounter generally has 3-4 of the guardians responsible for wipe mechanics while leaving 2-3 players able to take care of the enemies. This has been the structure since the beginning and it is good for both casual and experienced raiders. Another thing that may appear to be 'over engineered' is Bungie's attention to the issues during the encounters. You may not realize it but early raids were extremely buggy, lagged, etc. where timing seemed very off and random some times. Take Crota standing up for example. Most of the encounters in D2 have been ironed out and the bugs do not seem to be as prevalent. It can be exhausting learning new mechanics as each raid brings new challenges to the players so it may just 'feel' like there is too much engineering where, in reality they are right on point. With all of this said, I do feel that phase 2 val'caur in SoS is over-engineered. This would be the only thing that is over the top. There are so many phases and the window for reaching damage phase can be very challenging if you do not have coordinated players. And, once you finally reach damage phase, you are greeted by defensive missile barrages that essentially inhibit the ability to deal damage to the boss. There are a lot of good mechanics in the fight but compared to Calus, Argos, Riven, and now the Insurrection Prime, this fight is hardly rewarding.
