Huh, I just had the longest raid this last weekend. VOG on hard mode took almost 5 hours. Took a while to get to Atheon too, but there one of the guys admitted that he only has Thorn and he is low on ammo. No heavy synth or snipers either. He had no idea how to run the relic at all. Funny thing that his gamer tag was sharp shooter something... with no weapons or bullets, no heavy synth, etc. lol. So we tried and tried but every time he got teleported, he just could not shoot the oracles fast enough. We all kept dying. So at that point I just told everyone to let that guy pick up the relic and run with that. Better than shooting without bullets. Long story short, he learned how to use the relic in a few runs and actually got pretty good at it. We did beat Atheon after all. Before you ask: No we did not kick him from the raid, or anyone else. We are nice. Now the community has another person who can run relic really well. It was hard, but I got six shards from Atheon for it. Atheon is a cool guy. Cheers!