[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Philip J Fry [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Ahremos The state does not care if two people love each other. Its only interest is propagation, and -blam!- couples cannot propagate. [/quote] False. Same-sex couples can have children, just not with each other.[/quote] Firstly, I said propagation, which means "reproduction", not "adoption". Second, you failed to answer my question. In addition, should I be allowed to marry my brother with the intention of adopting a child? Also, unless the couple is adopting a child from out of the country, a new citizen is not being brought into existence, but simply moved from an orphanage to a household. Nothing is being created, a child is simply being moved.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Gman5434 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Rayzor1995 It's not necessarily about religion but about God, and He's been around the longest.[/quote] And who says that he is against it? [quote]I religion should stay out of the government then the government should stay out of religion, which won't happen.[/quote] I agree, so we should allow -blam!-s to marry since it is a legal contract and it shouldn't matter what religions say.[/quote]The God of Jesus is against it. He hates it. -_-

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Rayzor1995 I'm not making you do anything, do I have a gun to your head and saying "believe this or die." Nope. You are not being forced to do/not do anything here.[/quote] Voting for someone that intends to keep same-sex marriage illegal most certainly is pushing your beliefs on me and it is most certainly making it so that I can't get married.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] jonjon3000 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] tntbabin No way. I believe that being -blam!- is wrong and messed up, however while THAT'S none of my concern I'm Christian and marriage is a CHRISTIAN ceremony uniting a MAN and a WOMAN. So I see no reason why they should be aloud marriage.[/quote] By that reasoning nobody but christians should be able to get married.[/quote] Hmm I see your point. I suppose I should rephrase. All religions have a ceremony like marriage and it's always a ceremony between a man and woman, so no they still can't be married but as South Park has said they CAN be buttbuddies.

Marriage is supposed to be between a Man and a Woman. I think -blam!-s should still be able to get together as a marriage, just call it something else.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Philip J Fry [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Rayzor1995 And why do the HAVE to get married anyway? it's not like Not doing it hurts anybody either. [/quote] Want to know why they want to get married? Tax Benefits Filing joint income tax returns with the IRS and state taxing authorities. Creating a "family partnership" under federal tax laws, which allows you to divide business income among family members. Estate Planning Benefits Inheriting a share of your spouse's estate. Receiving an exemption from both estate taxes and gift taxes for all property you give or leave to your spouse. Creating life estate trusts that are restricted to married couples, including QTIP trusts, QDOT trusts, and marital deduction trusts. Obtaining priority if a conservator needs to be appointed for your spouse -- that is, someone to make financial and/or medical decisions on your spouse's behalf. Government Benefits Receiving Social Security, Medicare, and disability benefits for spouses. Receiving veterans' and military benefits for spouses, such as those for education, medical care, or special loans. Receiving public assistance benefits. Employment Benefits Obtaining insurance benefits through a spouse's employer. Taking family leave to care for your spouse during an illness. Receiving wages, workers' compensation, and retirement plan benefits for a deceased spouse. Taking bereavement leave if your spouse or one of your spouse's close relatives dies. Medical Benefits Visiting your spouse in a hospital intensive care unit or during restricted visiting hours in other parts of a medical facility. Making medical decisions for your spouse if he or she becomes incapacitated and unable to express wishes for treatment. Death Benefits Consenting to after-death examinations and procedures. Making burial or other final arrangements. Family Benefits Filing for stepparent or joint adoption. Applying for joint foster care rights. Receiving equitable division of property if you divorce. Receiving spousal or child support, child custody, and visitation if you divorce. Housing Benefits Living in neighborhoods zoned for "families only." Automatically renewing leases signed by your spouse. Consumer Benefits Receiving family rates for health, homeowners', auto, and other types of insurance. Receiving tuition discounts and permission to use school facilities. Other consumer discounts and incentives offered only to married couples or families. Other Legal Benefits and Protections Suing a third person for wrongful death of your spouse and loss of consortium (loss of intimacy). Suing a third person for offenses that interfere with the success of your marriage, such as alienation of affection and criminal conversation (these laws are available in only a few states). Claiming the marital communications privilege, which means a court can't force you to disclose the contents of confidential communications between you and your spouse during your marriage. Receiving crime victims' recovery benefits if your spouse is the victim of a crime. Obtaining immigration and residency benefits for noncitizen spouse. Visiting rights in jails and other places where visitors are restricted to immediate family. It's not just say they're married. It's so they're just as equal as you and I.[/quote]Wouldn,t that be the Govt's fault for making these programs to "Help" some and not others?

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Rayzor1995 It's not necessarily about religion but about God, and He's been around the longest.[/quote] And who says that he is against it? [quote]I religion should stay out of the government then the government should stay out of religion, which won't happen.[/quote] I agree, so we should allow -blam!-s to marry since it is a legal contract and it shouldn't matter what religions say.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Philip J Fry [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Rayzor1995 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Philip J Fry Why should religious beliefs be pushed upon my life?[/quote]You live in a real world, learn to deal with it.[/quote] Why should your religion be pushed on me? You are violating my rights to not partake in your religion by doing so. Maybe people don't think like you do. YOU need to learn to deal with it.[/quote]I'm not making you do anything, do I have a gun to your head and saying "believe this or die." Nope. You are not being forced to do/not do anything here.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Destiny 2011 the majority of American households want to keep the sanctity in marriage, and since the government is the people's government,[/quote] [url=http://bit.ly/mEoY9S]False[/url] what place does the minority population have in trying to invade an issue that isn't hurting them like segregation would?[/quote] Well, it's the government's job to protect the minority from the tyranny of the majority. Also [url=http://www.hrc.org/issues/5517.htm]link[/url]

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Gman5434 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Destiny 2011 with the current Conservative movement coming together, the Constitution will be permanently amended to inclusively define marriage as a sacred bond between a man and a woman.[/quote] Who gets to define it? On what grounds are you basing that definition? You need to understand a few things: Same-sex marriage has been around well before your religion so, if anything, you're changing the definition.[/quote] It's not necessarily about religion but about God, and He's been around the longest. [quote]Your religion doesn't have a monopoly of marriage, you need to understand and acknowledge that not every religion agrees with yours on the subject of religion. Regardless, marriage today is considered a legal contract and can be done in a completely secular manner without any involvement from a religious institution. And the fact that it is a legal contract coupled with the fact that the government shouldn't discriminate is why same-sex marriage should be legal.[/quote]I religion should stay out of the government then the government should stay out of religion, which won't happen.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Ahremos The state does not care if two people love each other. Its only interest is propagation, and -blam!- couples cannot propagate. [/quote] False. Same-sex couples can have children, just not with each other.

No. The state does not care if two people love each other. Its only interest is propagation, and -blam!- couples cannot propagate. I love my brother. If our parents died, and we had to raise our little sister, should we be allowed to get married in order to get the legal benefits?

why do you losers hate ga­y people so much? i don't get it.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Rayzor1995 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Philip J Fry Why should religious beliefs be pushed upon my life?[/quote]You live in a real world, learn to deal with it.[/quote] Why should your religion be pushed on me? You are violating my rights to not partake in your religion by doing so. Maybe people don't think like you do. YOU need to learn to deal with it. [Edited on 08.13.2011 6:21 PM PDT]

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Rayzor1995 And why do the HAVE to get married anyway? it's not like Not doing it hurts anybody either. [/quote] Want to know why they want to get married? Tax Benefits Filing joint income tax returns with the IRS and state taxing authorities. Creating a "family partnership" under federal tax laws, which allows you to divide business income among family members. Estate Planning Benefits Inheriting a share of your spouse's estate. Receiving an exemption from both estate taxes and gift taxes for all property you give or leave to your spouse. Creating life estate trusts that are restricted to married couples, including QTIP trusts, QDOT trusts, and marital deduction trusts. Obtaining priority if a conservator needs to be appointed for your spouse -- that is, someone to make financial and/or medical decisions on your spouse's behalf. Government Benefits Receiving Social Security, Medicare, and disability benefits for spouses. Receiving veterans' and military benefits for spouses, such as those for education, medical care, or special loans. Receiving public assistance benefits. Employment Benefits Obtaining insurance benefits through a spouse's employer. Taking family leave to care for your spouse during an illness. Receiving wages, workers' compensation, and retirement plan benefits for a deceased spouse. Taking bereavement leave if your spouse or one of your spouse's close relatives dies. Medical Benefits Visiting your spouse in a hospital intensive care unit or during restricted visiting hours in other parts of a medical facility. Making medical decisions for your spouse if he or she becomes incapacitated and unable to express wishes for treatment. Death Benefits Consenting to after-death examinations and procedures. Making burial or other final arrangements. Family Benefits Filing for stepparent or joint adoption. Applying for joint foster care rights. Receiving equitable division of property if you divorce. Receiving spousal or child support, child custody, and visitation if you divorce. Housing Benefits Living in neighborhoods zoned for "families only." Automatically renewing leases signed by your spouse. Consumer Benefits Receiving family rates for health, homeowners', auto, and other types of insurance. Receiving tuition discounts and permission to use school facilities. Other consumer discounts and incentives offered only to married couples or families. Other Legal Benefits and Protections Suing a third person for wrongful death of your spouse and loss of consortium (loss of intimacy). Suing a third person for offenses that interfere with the success of your marriage, such as alienation of affection and criminal conversation (these laws are available in only a few states). Claiming the marital communications privilege, which means a court can't force you to disclose the contents of confidential communications between you and your spouse during your marriage. Receiving crime victims' recovery benefits if your spouse is the victim of a crime. Obtaining immigration and residency benefits for noncitizen spouse. Visiting rights in jails and other places where visitors are restricted to immediate family. It's not just say they're married. It's so they're just as equal as you and I.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Destiny 2011 with the current Conservative movement coming together, the Constitution will be permanently amended to inclusively define marriage as a sacred bond between a man and a woman.[/quote] Who gets to define it? On what grounds are you basing that definition? You need to understand a few things: Same-sex marriage has been around well before your religion so, if anything, you're changing the definition. Your religion doesn't have a monopoly of marriage, you need to understand and acknowledge that not every religion agrees with yours on the subject of religion. Regardless, marriage today is considered a legal contract and can be done in a completely secular manner without any involvement from a religious institution. And the fact that it is a legal contract coupled with the fact that the government shouldn't discriminate is why same-sex marriage should be legal. [Edited on 08.13.2011 6:20 PM PDT]

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Philip J Fry Why should religious beliefs be pushed upon my life?[/quote]You live in a real world, learn to deal with it. [Edited on 08.13.2011 6:20 PM PDT]

I have no problem with it so sure, why not? It doesn't affect anyone else in any way so I don't see the problem.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Philip J Fry[/quote] Edited post

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Philip J Fry [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Destiny 2011 The way I see it, with the current Conservative movement coming together, the Constitution will be permanently amended to inclusively define marriage as a [b][u][i]sacred[/b][/u][/i] bond between a man and a woman. [/quote] Nothing in our government should be based on how sacred something is. This is not a theocracy. Religion has no place in our government. We have the freedom of religion in our country. We also have the freedom FROM religion.[/quote] Before I head out, I'd just like to state that many people oppose same-sex marriages without religion involved. Aside from what the liberal media tries to brainwash you with, the majority of American households want to keep the sanctity in marriage, and since the government is the people's government, what place does the minority population have in trying to invade an issue that isn't hurting them like segregation would? Adios, bro. EDIT: And the last sentence was created so that way you libs can't try and act like I'm abusing minority rights, since this issue is so unimporant. [Edited on 08.13.2011 6:20 PM PDT]

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Destiny 2011 The way I see it, with the current Conservative movement coming together, the Constitution will be permanently amended to inclusively define marriage as a [b][u][i]sacred[/b][/u][/i] bond between a man and a woman. [/quote] Nothing in our government should be based on how sacred something is. This is not a theocracy. Religion has no place in our government. We have the freedom of religion in our country. We also have the freedom FROM religion. Why should religious beliefs be pushed upon my life? [Edited on 08.13.2011 6:16 PM PDT]

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Infini7y Same-sex couples that want actual marriage should be ashamed anyway. A ceremony built upon beliefs and such that actually speak against -blam!--blam!-ity, and they want to perform that ceremony? That's almost like a jew in WW2 wanting to run a concentration camp.[/quote] Really? Is that why you can get married in a completely secular matter? Is that why some religions that grant marriage don't condemn -blam!--blam!-ity. [Edited on 08.13.2011 6:20 PM PDT]

Screw it, I'm not going to consistently try and reply to three or four posts that continually try and prove that this issue is some sort of life or death matter. The way I see it, with the current Conservative movement coming together, the Constitution will be permanently amended to inclusively define marriage as a sacred bond between a man and a woman. With that said, I really don't see the point in arguing about a subject that -- with the previous evidence stated -- doesn't matter.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Gman5434[/quote]Once again with trying to drag other minorities down to that level. Like I said in my original post, I support an alternative to marriage for same-sex couples that provides the same benefits as marriage. That's equal rights, and something a lot of countries do. The only reason you'd still want marriage despite having such an alternative already in place is because you cant have it. Same-sex couples that want actual marriage should be ashamed anyway. A ceremony built upon beliefs and such that actually speak against homo-blam!-ity, and they want to perform that ceremony? That's almost like a jew in WW2 wanting to run a concentration camp.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Destiny 2011 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Philip J Fry [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Destiny 2011 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] NewRadical12 Answer the question: should we allow opposite-sex couples who either cannot, or have no intent to, biologically reproduce be allowed to marry? I've posed this at least twice.[/quote] No, and for for a solid reason: Marriage's inclusive definition specifically read that it was a sacred bond between a [u]man[/u] and a [u]woman[/u]. There's no point in changing the definition to allowing ghey's to marry and for infertile couples to not marry. [/quote] Your reading comprehension needs some work. He's talking about straight couples not having kids.[/quote] I thoroughly understood his post, and I'm still assuming responsibility for the post I sent. My point was that no one should be able to step and redefine marriage to allow same-sex couples to marry, and no one should step in to prevent infertile couples to marry.[/quote] So the sole purpose of marriage is to procreate? I can do that without getting married, though... Besides, same-sex couples can have kids, just not with their partner. Look at Neal Patrick Harris and his partner. They have two biological children.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Rayzor1995 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Philip J Fry [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Destiny 2011 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Philip J Fry [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Destiny 2011 You're right, they would then be exclusive to the respective groups -- but how is that such a bad thing? Who is it starving? Who is it killing? Who is it stopping from loving each other?[/quote] The point you're raising actually supports everyone getting married. If there's no difference and it's not hurting anyone, just call it marriage.[/quote] The point you're raising actually supports killing all exclusivity.[/quote] You're right. Why should one group of people get something, and another group of people get something else? Why can't everyone have the same thing?[/quote] [quote]Why can't everyone have the same thing[/quote] Facedesk Facedesk FaceDesk![/quote] Would you care to actually have a conversation, or just antagonize me?