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paper_gunsにより編集済み:
10/1/2025 7:27:46 PM
22
Raid Races
Who are raid races designed for? Why should I care one bit about watching the same streamers play another raid race? Who cares? Maybe if the raids were actually fun for the usual clan and gamer instead of the 0.0001% of top players. Most I talk to won’t even try the regular version let alone Epic. Bungie continues this same old pattern.
Where is the guided mode like Rite of the Nine Explorer? Stop catering to the top 5 teams and maybe people will come back to play.
Edit: to be more constructive..
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I remember the original races were open to everyone and they didn’t cater to the streamers for a buck. The difficulty of the races now is designed for the handful of streamer’s skill level. Someone made the comment below about it being the “Olympics” and that part I agree with minus the continuously expanding difficulty modifiers. For example we don’t cater to influencers when selecting Olympic contenders and those who qualify compete. Perhaps they hold qualifiers for Raid Races. As many point out these raid racers and streamers are also cheating and exploiting to win and make money.
My intention of this post is not to complain, though that is how it started. I would like to see the game improve and Id like to see Bungie chase something other than money. Raids rock and we should celebrate those who excel at the game and do extraordinary things. We should also make it a fair playing field and stop catering to streamers. I dont win raid races but its fun to try. Its not fun when its so difficult that people wont play or just get mad during the gameplay.
I suppose Im fed up with streamers, changes to the game that negatively impact player experiences, and Bungie’s increasing lack of care about the actual game experience for the main population of the game. It sure seems like Bungie does this because so much money comes from the streamer community as opposed to the gamer community. Financially it makes sense, but this also seems like a masterclass on how to royally screw up a game and the majority of the customers for some extra cash.
New - listen to the players, not the streamers.
Old - Who is making design decisions for your company? They should be fired.
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1 返信I laughed when Aztecrose said Epic DOP will be his last day1 raid Mind you these are the same dudes who said DOP was insanely hard and complained that they wanted more challenging content previously and was up at arms over the Day1 raid drama Look at who you have been supporting Bungie most of your dedicated streamers are leaving yet a large amount of casuals still here.
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3 通の返信“SteamChart” says it all. The passed couple of days, the numbers of players dropping Sept. 22 - 11k, Sept. 23 - 16k, Sept. 24 - 12k, Sept. 25 - 12k, Sept. 26 - 13k, Sept. 27 - 15k…guess the only ppl are playing are Twitch & YouTube streamers.
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1 返信Racket UKにより編集済み: 9/28/2025 6:17:34 PMAlso the person who won the race, got banned for having 2 cheaters on his team, from a previous raid, he doesn't even, care about cheaters on his team, he just wants to finish first. I wouldn't of put it past him to have cheated in every raid, he should be banned altogether, once you cheat, that's it, instant ban, i was watching luckyy, i wanted him to win.
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2 通の返信I love how these guys are writing novels about why theyre not competing like it's Muhammad Ali backing out of a championship bout or something.
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1 返信Magisceneにより編集済み: 9/29/2025 12:59:59 PMI used to enjoy contest mode raids to try getting the cool emblems but now they’re just to annoying to deal with now so I retired from them. I wish they would bring back crota contest level difficulty instead of the salvations edge level because crota was atleast tuned just right challenging yet fair. Even contest viewing experience is boring because it’s always the same few streamers or blacked screens with no audio so I can’t even enjoy the competitive spirit. Salvations edge I get why it was over tuned because it was the big bad and final raid of a saga. The DP first contest left me like what are their intentions for contest mode going forward because only so many teams cleared it. Do they want to have contest only be for the top 1% or was it mistuned since they did the damage number compression. Either way it left me like ok contest isn’t for me anymore. Even the contest dungeon in renegades doesn’t leave much to hope because I would like to think Bungie would be thinking “okay the top 1% had their fun in the DP contest raid, let’s create a contest dungeon experience more players can complete instead of just the top 1%”. I highly doubt they will do that.
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5 通の返信It's fairly evident after RoN and the immense negative reaction from the top players in the community that Bungie decided to pull away from those types of experiences in favor of a more "competitive" type one. Unfortunately, the only way to do that was to jack up the difficulty to ridiculous levels, the last three raid launches have historically low clear levels not matched since Last Wish, and I feel like this has only been more fuel on the fire to the problem. I am of the mindset that Bungie really needs to just muffle those top 0.1% when it comes to feedback at this point in the game. The game as a whole needs to really start pushing back towards a more casual audience (I know, a lot of people cringe at the "casualification" language here), we're not earning new players with raid races that are pushing even the top players to the utmost limits of the game. Desert Perpetual needed to be a DSC tier raid, not another SE tier raid as it pertained to contest, while the elite were clamoring over it and calling it "the best raid experience", the ship as a whole was still sinking (Steam capped at 28k yesterday.... on a raid launch day), and things are only going to get worse now. I think Bungie needs to take a long break from this type of content at this point; Ship a dungeon with Renegades that is exciting to all players, even if they need to sacrifice the difficulty. We need to get more players involved in the endgame so they stick around and draw more players into the title. Future contest raids need to be on the RoN-DSC level, I don't care if we get a base raid that is easy, it draws a hell of a lot more players to the game versus a DP style DPS check wall. Especially if now we're going back to a Normal / Hard (Epic) style raid launch, you can make the base raid highly inviting to all players, then dial things up with the Epic mode.
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1 返信I used to like raids, but then they became overly complicated with lackluster rewards for the time investment. Also the elitism, not wanting to teach people or having the patience for more than 1 wipe, checkpoint stealing etc makes it a horrible experience.
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SuperKingzach12により編集済み: 9/28/2025 7:58:06 PMI agree like after playing and clearing 100 clears of salvations edge I couldn’t bare myself to go through another 100 clears desert perpetual grind just for the sake of it Bungie needs to learn that make raids acessable and more Sherpa raider can teach and have fun instead of gatekeeping new players and returning players
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2 通の返信ForeverLaxxにより編集済み: 9/29/2025 7:18:27 AMIt was always an "open secret" that the Raid Race is a streamer event and source of free advertisement for Bungie. Once they updated the rules to [i]require[/i] streaming with this latest race (it didn't used to), it stopped being an "open secret" and just became blatant. This is Bungie's way of "giving back" to their most loyal of soldiers.
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My only beef with contest raids is how easily they're cleared after the contest modifier goes away. They still haven't found a middle ground for raids where teams are hotswapping weapons and juggling their kits to maximize dps to barely clear a dps check, and the next day the community is one phasing bosses with outbreak and t crashes. Dungeons after contest still maintain some degree of boss healths being in a healthy spot and since ghosts the enemy density in dungeons are usually substantially higher than in raids.
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I use to be into raiding. Croat and others like that when anyone could step in and try to learn the mechanics. Not spend 12 hours straight on it. The morning Crota was released it was a blast. 6 random experienced gamers trying to get through. Running through the gauntlet. Yelling into the mics. Dude trenchfoot is gone!! Anyone see him. Dude yells there are holes watch out!
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6 通の返信I use to like raiding. But the mechanics and how quick you die. Plus looking at these ppl streams for 24 plus hours looking miserable, makes me not want to raid. Or even do ultimate content for that matter. I just get my guns and go to pvp.
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4 通の返信
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Agree I watched the Race out of curiosity, and my god the mechanics are so convoluted in a way that make me not want to touch that s*** with a 6 foot pole. It sucks that my expansions money went to pay for this, I could not care less.
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4 通の返信How often do these races happen? I don't watch or participate but from what I understand, the answer is "Not very often." Let people have the damn things, they don't inconvenience you that much.
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1 返信You're saying listen to players and not the streamers but in what way are streamers and/or content creators not players themselves? The reason why Bungie most likely values their opinion over those of casual gamers is because these streamers spend a lot of hours in the game and play and test every aspect of the game. They often give detailed feedback or constructive criticism which Bungie values. if you want to know how the ''casual player'' gives feedback just look at the forums. The majority of the posts made have zero feedback in them other then ramblings about dropping numbers and complaining that Bungie should do better. This is why Bungie doesn't listen to us because the majority of us casual gamers can't act normally and only whine and cry about every little thing.
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2 通の返信Raid races are basically unofficial early access events for everyone before their official release on the following Tuesday. Your question of who they're for is equivalent to asking who the Olympics (or other tournament) are for.
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To play? The best of the best will complete it, but most competent raids used to give it a try. To watch? Everyone else… Raid races are a GOOD THING. They drive talk about the game and give the community an event to get behind. BUT there are 2 main issues with this most recent race. - Teams have gotten so competitive about this that it’s really impacting the experience for the viewers. This race was a step in the right direction. - The raid race only really helps if the game is in a decent place. If there is no drive to play or participate, all the impact goes away
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[quote]Who are raid races designed for? Why should I care one bit about watching the same streamers play another raid race? Who cares? Maybe if the raids were actually fun for the usual clan and gamer instead of the 0.0001% of top players. Most I talk to won’t even try the regular version let alone Epic. Bungie continues this same old pattern. Where is the guided mode like Rite of the Nine Explorer? Stop catering to the top 5 teams and maybe people will come back to play. Edit: to be more constructive.. New - listen to the players, not the streamers. Old - Who is making design decisions for your company? They should be fired.[/quote] Raid races have historically brought all time high attention to the game.
