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11/27/2023 8:06:06 PM
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Bungie balances the sandbox around popularity. Which is the worst possible way to balance your sandbox.
You send a clear message to your customers that, under no circumstances, can they chose to play this game their way.
Balance your sandbox and leave it.
Bungie literally are moving the goalposts every time this happens.
Imagine playing monopoly and the rules change so drastically you can’t even make it around the board once.
Welcome to Destiny 2.
Bungie - with an attitude like this you deserve to fail.
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Devil’s advocate here. A lot of games use popularity to help identify things that are unbalanced. Modes like trials and raids where winning and success actually matters show even better data. Popular things in there are things that people resort to when winning is important - broken, cheesy, and unfair tactics always come up in trials first… Has Bungie gone too far in the past? 100% yes. But to say that Bungie shouldn’t nerf things just because they are popular is just wrong
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The problem is that they often do very little to boost the unpopular options at the same time to make them more enticing, so we just end up with less options, rather than alternatives. That's my biggest gripe with Bungie always nerfing things. They hardly buff anything to compensate. That goes for the things they nerf as well. If you just nerf everything that's good about an ability or Exotic, it just becomes something that players will stop using entirely, like with Young Ahamkara's Spine, or Starfire Protocol. With YAS, they changed it to now require kills, but didn't consider increasing the amount of energy it returns, turning it into a dead exotic in PvE. Same with all the Exotics that regenerate Supers. Skull of Dire Ahamkara has been a useless Exotic for years. They never considered reworking it to boost Novabomb damage, or add Volatile to them, or enhance other abilities, such as Chaos Accelerant or the Pocket Singularity melee. Balance requires more than just nerfs. That's something that Bungie fails at--a lot.
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[quote]Devil’s advocate here. A lot of games use popularity to help identify things that are unbalanced. Modes like trials and raids where winning and success actually matters show even better data. Popular things in there are things that people resort to when winning is important - broken, cheesy, and unfair tactics always come up in trials first… Has Bungie gone too far in the past? 100% yes. But to say that Bungie shouldn’t nerf things just because they are popular is just wrong[/quote] You missed the point. Bungie shouldn’t be nerfing or buffing anything. Balance your sandbox right the first time and leave it. Crazy idea right? I dare you to count how many times Bungie have done this since they launched the game.
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[quote]Balance your sandbox right the first time and leave it. [/quote] Find me one game that has ever done this. And let me be clear, for a game to have done this, the game would need to be perfectly balanced from the start, and then never change. Those are the criteria a game would have to meet. Plenty of games have gone with no balance changes since launch, I think you'd be hard pressed to find one that was perfectly balanced. There was always one thing that didn't do good enough or one thing that dominated the rest.
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I think you may be asking the impossible in a game as big and with as many moving parts as Destiny. Devs can’t plot out every interaction and stuff is never perfectly balanced to begin with. Games that don’t do balance passes often just say the OP stuff is a feature. Bungie’s testers aren’t industry leading or anything, but to expect a perfectly balanced game off the rip is just as absurd as saying they shouldn’t use popularity in balancing
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SILLABYSSにより編集済み: 11/28/2023 3:19:16 AM[quote]I think you may be asking the impossible in a game as big and with as many moving parts as Destiny. Devs can’t plot out every interaction and stuff is never perfectly balanced to begin with. Games that don’t do balance passes often just say the OP stuff is a feature. Bungie’s testers aren’t industry leading or anything, but to expect a perfectly balanced game off the rip is just as absurd as saying they shouldn’t use popularity in balancing[/quote] Bungie apologists everywhere. I swear to god - half of these replies are actually from Bungie employees. What on earth are you talking about? What you described is their one job lol No one is asking for a perfectly balanced game - those are your words - what I’m expecting is for a developer to balance the game once, and not rewrite the laws of physics in the game 6 or 7 times a year. I don’t think that’s too much to ask. If it is, then no wonder no one wants to play this crappy game.
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In a live service model this will never be achievable. Add to that the ever changing landscape of artifacts, perks, mods, etc. Players are always finding ways to build and make the gameplay different. The devs always need to refining balance. Always. You're living in a fantasy land my friend
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[quote]In a live service model this will never be achievable. Add to that the ever changing landscape of artifacts, perks, mods, etc. Players are always finding ways to build and make the gameplay different. The devs always need to refining balance. Always. You're living in a fantasy land my friend[/quote] Completely unnecessary and unpopular. I find it hilarious that actual players are such homers that they like being nerfed like this. Makes you wonder if you’re an actual person with an opinion or an employee trying to take the edge out of the comments.
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No wonder our community is a toxic cesspool, you want a game that is constantly adding new stuff to maintain a state where all that stuff is balanced without ever having to change it. Is it possible? Sure. Is it in any way reasonable to expect? No, no developer is capable of that. What you are asking for is something that no one has ever done, because while doing it isn't [i]technically[/i] impossible, it basically is impossible.
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[quote]No wonder our community is a toxic cesspool, you want a game that is constantly adding new stuff to maintain a state where all that stuff is balanced without ever having to change it. Is it possible? Sure. Is it in any way reasonable to expect? No, no developer is capable of that. What you are asking for is something that no one has ever done, because while doing it isn't [i]technically[/i] impossible, it basically is impossible.[/quote] Yes that’s exactly what I want. Why are you making excuses for this company - you like getting nerfs and buffs every 2-3 months? Lots of developers can add to their game without rearranging everything else.
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[quote]You are the epitome of an armchair developer 🤣 [quote]Lots of developers can add to their game without rearranging everything else.[/quote] Name 2 that are games Like Destiny. I'll wait[/quote] Don’t wait for me - name a single developer that rebalances every weapon archetype every three months. Just one. I’ll wait.
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Firstly, I'm not going to accommodate your exaggeration of 3 months. Fortnite Apex Battlefield Halo Them and any other MP sandbox game. The ALL tweak the balance of weapons and gameplay depending on trends. If you don't know that, then gaming isn't your thing.
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[quote]Firstly, I'm not going to accommodate your exaggeration of 3 months. Fortnite Apex Battlefield Halo Them and any other MP sandbox game. The ALL tweak the balance of weapons and gameplay depending on trends. If you don't know that, then gaming isn't your thing.[/quote] Those are all PvP games lol
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And the majority of the sandbox conversation is because of Destiny's pvp. They are the same sandbox. Do you play this game? Are you one of those Destiny pve purists? The game has an enormous loot and ability pool. People are constantly finding the most OP way of doing things. Man, you know nothing about this game do you?
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[quote]And the majority of the sandbox conversation is because of Destiny's pvp. They are the same sandbox. Do you play this game? Are you one of those Destiny pve purists? The game has an enormous loot and ability pool. People are constantly finding the most OP way of doing things. Man, you know nothing about this game do you?[/quote] You do know Bungie can tune PvP and Pve separately right? They’ve done it before lol You have no argument- you just like to argue and talk down to people.
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[quote]They do it when they have to. they 'prefer' to do them the same. This has been there stance forever. Like I figured. You don't know anything about this game. That's not talking down. That's talking fact.[/quote] Hahaha Merry Christmas!
