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RaG nuh RocKにより編集済み: 4/21/2022 9:45:20 PM
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"Legacy" controller layouts have very unusual (and bad) penalties that other controller layouts don't have

The Legacy layouts feel very clunky, inaccurate, and random-feeling while aiming. I believe I have identified the cause of this, but this can't be fixed by the player, only Bungie can fix this. This imgur link contains a photo of a side-by-side comparison of the Right Stick of Legacy and Default controls. The green areas in the photo represent where aiming can be performed with the stick *while strafing.* This problem does not occur while *not* strafing. But if I'm strafing (especially to the left or right), the problem is obnoxiously intrusive and disruptive to the action of aiming. Start by viewing the Right Stick of the Default layout (left side of imgur photo). All of the green area you see is where the player must move the Right Stick if the player wants to move the crosshair around on-screen. As you would expect, it's a large area of the stick's range of motion. Next, look at the Right Stick of Legacy (right side of imgur photo). See how those green areas are far, far smaller than they are on the Default layout? THAT is the reason why Legacy feels unnatural, random, and extremely unforgiving. As long as the player is strafing, the ONLY parts of the stick'a range of motion where moving the crosshair on-screen is AT ALL POSSIBLE, are those little green areas. https://imgur.com/a/AH8mJe3 With the Default layout, I can move the Right Stick upward very slightly, and be rewarded with a very slight upward crosshair movement. And if I keep slowly, slowly moving the Right Stick of Default (or Southpaw) upward in the same direction, I will be accordingly rewarded with faster crosshair movement based on how far I have moved the Right Stick. So Default (also Southpaw) has a pretty large range of motion where aiming is possible, we can see that in the imgur photo link. However, with the Legacy controller layouts (both Legacy and Legacy Southpaw), ALL of that range of motion and aiming of the Default layout gets crammed into those teeny tiny green slivers. You can see for yourself in the imgur photo link. It's important to note this only occurs while strafing. I point out the Right Stick of Legacy because the Right Stick of Legacy has far more restricted Look Controls than the Left Stick of Legacy, and the issue is much more severe on the Right Stick for no apparent reason I'm aware of. But the problem does also exist on the Left Stick of Legacy (Legacy Southpaw is a mirror version of Legacy, so Legacy Southpaw has the exact same identical issue). At the top of this post, just underneath the Title, there is a YouTube video link. In this link, I have tried to demonstrate in practice, in Destiny 2, this problem. By watching that video, you can see how jerky, clunky, un-smooth, and random the aiming looks on Legacy layouts. I directly compare identical aiming functions of Legacy and Southpaw (which is the same as Default). The reason I'm using Southpaw instead of Default is because I'm left-handed. And lastly I want to add some context on who I am, maybe that'll be useful. I started playing console shooters in the 1990's on the Nintendo 64. The most popular shooters on Nintendo 64 are without a doubt the Goldeneye and Perfect Dark games. In these N64 games, Legacy is actually the default controller layout (in Goldeneye the actual layout option name was "1.1 Honey" iirc). Fast forward to 2001, when the first Xbox (and also the first Halo game) came out. My parents bought me an Xbox for my birthday, and it came bundled with Halo: Combat Evolved. A Bungie created game. I had a really hard time trying to adjust to Halo's Default controller layout, because I had been using Legacy for years prior, and Legacy was my first ever experience with controller aiming in a shooting game. I eventually discovered that Halo had multiple controller stick layout options, so I tried each of them in an attempt to make the game feel more natural to me. I found that Halo actually had the default layout from the N64 games! It was called Legacy, not 1.1 Honey. I was very happy with it. And, very importantly here, Legacy in that Halo, and the next 2 Halo games, Halo 2 and Halo 3, both had the same Legacy layout. So I felt right at home while playing Halo. Other games also had 1.1 Honey (now commonly known as Legacy), so I was able to play those games comfortably as well. Unreal Championship, Counterstrike, etc, then later with Call of Duty 2 which released on the Xbox 360 as a launch title. I never could really use what's now known as Default or Southpaw very well. It never felt natural to me. So fast forward once more to Halo Reach. Reach is significant because this is the Halo game that released with a DIFFERENT design of my Legacy stick layout. It was worse. Way, way worse than Legacy from the earlier Halo games. And TO THIS VERY DAY in 2022, every single Halo game to have come out after Halo Reach has also kept whatever changes were made to Legacy in Halo Reach. And the reason all of this is relevant to Destiny (because Bungie sold the Halo franchise to Microsoft and 343 Industries now develops Halo games), is because Destiny ALSO HAS KEPT those same changes to Legacy that were made with the release of Halo Reach. This problem with Legacy has existed now for the past 12 straight years in both Halo, and both of the Destiny games. It is VERY much so worth mentioning that because of this change to Legacy in Halo Reach, I had to give up Halo. I couldn't aim, the game had fundamentally changed for me, for the worse. And I had been playing Halo prior for the past decade since 2001, to 2010. Also very much worth mentioning right now, is the fact that THIS PROBLEM DOES NOT EXIST IN ANY OTHER GAMES AT ALL that have Legacy. This Legacy design problem has never existed in any Call of Duty game, Battlefield game, Borderlands, Unreal game, it doesn't exist in Back 4 Blood, Star Wars Battlefront, Anthem, Outriders, Perfect Dark, Splitgate, Spellbreak, Apex Legends, Titanfall, Ghost Recon, Rainbow Six, The Division, Warframe, Warface, Hyperscape, Mechassault, ANY game that offers Legacy as a stick layout option. No other game at all has ever had this problem. Not ever. This problem exists ONLY in Destiny 1&2, and all of the Halo games that released between 2010 and 2022. So every Halo, every Destiny game that has been released between 2010 and 2022. There's 2 "Legacy" controller layouts in Destiny's settings menu. One is Legacy, and the other is Legacy Southpaw. This is half of the controller layouts in Destiny. The other 2 are of course Default and Southpaw. So half of the stick layout options have pretty severe issues that aren't found in other shooter games. Only in Bungie games, hence this post to the Bungie Help forums. I have been dealing with this problem since 2014 when Destiny 1 came out, all the way up until this very day. In spite of this incredibly taxing and super annoying problem that has gone on in Bungie games for more than a decade, I have still used Legacy the entire time. It's the only layout I feel comfortable playing shooters with, and I do not, can not play games without Legacy controls. So this is now an accessibility issue for me, because the only layout I'm comfortable with has some glaring issues that inhibit my own ability to control my own aim. So I'm asking you Bungie, please take a look at how the Legacy controller option is designed in Destiny, so I can play Destiny with the same confidence and ability that I can while playing other games. You can look me up on Destiny, I play regularly on Xbox. My gamertag there is RaG nuh RocK. I'm not bad at all at the game, I can go Flawless in Trials if I want to, I have a Gilded Conquerer, I even have the Vow of the Disciple Cleaver emblem for completing the raid on contest mode. So even in spite of this problem, I am still somewhat capable but nowhere close to what I know I'm capable of, from my experience playing decades of shooters. I am very experienced with the use of the Legacy stick layout, having used exclusively this thumbstick scheme for the past 2 decades plus, starting in the 1990's and still to the day of writing this post, on Thursday April 21, 2022. Testing was performed with a Titan 2 device, the product of which you can see in the imgur photo. There's a YouTuber who does testing for many game's controller designs, and I created that imgur photo from one of his videos. I had to do a lot of my own research to figure out why this problem happens. I've spent probably thousands of dollars on different controllers over these years, trying to find some way to fix this problem. I can't fix it. You Bungie, you have to fix it. You created a problem where it did not previously exist in the first 3 Halo games. You created *introduced* this new problem in Halo Reach, and Legacy in Destiny 1 and 2 still use that same horrible design of Legacy in Halo Reach. And I have to deal with it, and so does every other player who uses Legacy. There probably aren't very many Legacy players playing Destiny, and I would bet that this problem you created has heavily influenced Legacy players to avoid playing Destiny. I understand this is most likely an error and not really intended to be in the game, and that you may not even be aware of it. It might've even been created in Reach by completely different people who no longer work at Bungie. But nevertheless, the problem exists. I am here now telling you that it exists and asking you to please investigate why Legacy controls in Destiny are so vastly inferior to Legacy in other games. Or the original 3 Halo games, because Legacy still works fine in those games to this day, even in the Master Chief Collection that 343 Industries made. I have tested this extensively on Playstation, Xbox, and PC versions of Destiny 2. I have many different controllers, falsely thinking it may be due to the controller I use. But it's not a controller problem. It's a game design issue.

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