[quote]Bungie, Leveling is not content. Please allow me explain. We remember and appreciate when you introduced the level bonus from the artifact in supplement providing RNG protection as a means to ensure you could play and still become endgame-viable. When did this methodology change? Right now, at this very moment the most recent TWAB does not address the fact it takes so many bounties just to get your artifact level bonus high enough to participate in Grand Masters nor Hard Mode Vault of Glass (viable light in the latter’s case). Leveling your artifact is not a 1:1 ratio. Experience is tethered to bounties currently that; if you are limited on your time and you opt the value of your time as doing the raids instead of grinding Strikes, Crucible, and Gambit; you will inevitably hit the XP barrier to entry that I, and most of my community ran into. The expectation that you have to run an unwieldy number of bounties to hit the required level [i]despite[/i] being at the Pinnacle hard-cap (which I am) is disappointing to say the least. My community grinds this game for the interesting loot opportunities as well as encountering challenging difficulty, not an arbitrary number that holds no true bearing on how the game feels nor plays. Sincerely, [i]Monk[/i][/quote] This is LITERALLY why I liked the Armory DLC and Menagerie. If RNG didn’t roll your way on say Boots and Primary Gun that you needed to have to level up. You could target farm what you needed to infuse to level up from both activities etc. the Armory and Menagerie were the best parts of Destiny during the Annual Pass days.

I wouldn't mind to grind 25+ artifact levels just so enemies won't feel as tanky on GM nightfalls and streamer VoG difficulty, thing is every season I start right were I was the season before, that being tasked to grind artifact levels. This cheap difficulty manufacturing has to stop.

[quote]Leveling is not content. Please allow me explain.[/quote] This is a huge reason out of the many of why I stopped playing this game. Since Forsaken I've watched Bungie change a lot of things, and most of it hasn't been for the better. Aren't games supposed to improve a player's experience creating an incentive to want to play? I'm asking that becase, since Forsaken that was the only time the game was ever in a good place, Bungie has made it a point to constantly looks for ways to remove any incentives this game has so the player is left with nothing but grind. The constant resetting progress is a pure waste of a player's time when the company isn't really offering anything in return.

Agree completely- this is the first raid since D1 I have been unable to do, I refuse to grind bounties to level up, I'm already +19 which is generally what I get to most seasons, I don't see why they have done this, the GM nightfall is 1360 and is way easier, my clan almost cleared day 1 vog with contest modifier on but we can't even enter Master vog - stupid

The more people stop playing the game Bungie will listen. I feel the game is dull for example solstice event constantly EAZ and repetitive . I agree power leveling is stupid. It sucks the content pay for is cut out. Any other company did this shit would get sued unfair business practices.

Leveling could and [i]should[/i] be tolerable, but the way Bungie has chosen to implement progression, it’s miserable. I’ve never seen the least amount of effort put into the most required aspect of a game. To do anything, you have to level. New season, grind levels. New activities, grind levels. Artifact? Grind those levels. But instead of making the grind halfway interesting, they put stale, repetitive bounties and activities in front of us and expect us to just go at it. It’s insulting. It’s not fun. And they have the nerve to gatekeep the most interesting content behind a system designed to induce the most amount of rage. And worse, people will actually defend it. It’s baffling. They’ll repeat the same tired refrain: “grinding is the game, you just want everything handed to you, don’t like it don’t play”. Like seriously… when did y’all just [i]give up[/i] wanting something better?

You barely need any 'grind" to access GM people's complaining about that are super casual that play hero NF.... And for master VoG is the same but people's don't understand that it was meant for 1340-1345 not 1350....it designed to be a challenge

What's the problem with having a challenge? Ever thought about the fact that the power level requirement was set so high because it was designed with the intend to NOT overlevel it? They could have easily activated contest modifier for it, always setting you 20 level below. But they didn't, since it would nullify the artifact in its current design for the casual players (and the rest of the game) who complained for years that they have to play edngame activities for max power. So yes, power leveling in Destiny is content because guns in Destiny are no stat sticks like in WoW or most other MMO(RPGs). It's the same as GM Strikes. You can beat the activity, farm for loot, no matter if you hit 1360 for the Strikes or not. Endgame difficulty activites are meant for the hardcore players, not your average Joe out there. Most players who are fall into this niche are +20 artifact power anyway, like me. So your basic requirement for GM VoG is set. If you want the seal, and the same guns, just with 4 perks, then fine. Otherwise there is no specific unique piece of loot and no reason AT ALL to fall into a hardcore dive as a casual player. I really wonder where the idea of must-overlevel-this-activity thought comes from. And no, not all the content should be available for every player. It's a rule which needs to exist in videogames, and existed since videogames were invented. It's not like I demand an easy mode for Sekiro or Demon Souls because I think an activity/boss is too hard. Destiny 2 got so easy over the years, having a difficult activity, like GM VoG, makes everyone bursting out in tears cauz they aren't used to this anymore.

Just don't play it if I don't like it 👍

We’ve been saying this for years, they won’t change it.

For me personally, levelling is what I enjoy. It’s the challenge and having an end goal. Once I reach the level cap I play much less as there is nothing really to do. I could just grind for weapons but I can kill everything already so it’s pointless.

They need to remove the artifact. It's a plague

Read that as "leveling is not consent" initially.

Um, actually it literally is actual content.

Oooh yay, I finally get to be "that guy" So imagine I'm saying this with taped up glasses and a lisp while producing too much saliva when I talk... "Um, technically it is content. It may not be good content but it's still content. They're doing the best they can. You're not a game developer so you don't know. Covid something oppression...capitalism bad pay for my student loans to get that degree in gender studies...down with the patriarchy...please date me I'm so lonely...I'm doing good in the game and my self worth is intrinsically linked to my ELO so that means I'm winning in real life..." [spoiler]NAILED IT[/spoiler]

True. Which is why I keep saying that the pinnacle system doesn’t need to be fixed. It needs to be gotten rid of. Bungie has long used power (vertical) progression as a way to keep people playing despite Bungie’s inability to create enough loot, in enough variety for the game. Add to that, the lack of sunsetting, that lets the loot table bloat and creates the illusion of the game having enough loot. Result? About 75% of the game’s chronic problems But I don’t foresee Bungie addressing (OUR) concern here until the fix the manpower needs and weapons system issues that are keeping them from making enough loot for the game.

I'd love to know who says leveling is content. I'm pretty sure no one did.

While leveling shouldnt be the only content, it is content and one of the goals of the game: working up to X light level so you can do end game activities, and grind for rolls you want with ease. In relation to gms and master vog: they are the hardest pve end game activities, so you should have to work towards being able to do them. You shouldnt be able to just jump right into them day 1. Being able to jump into higher level activities day 1 just leads to another black armory situation. People complaining not being able to do said activity cause it's 'too hard', which leads to bungie nerfing the activity, which leads to people then complaining said activity is 'too easy', and they stop doing the activity. Which is another issue within in the community, but that's a different topic. Anyway, I get it, people want to do the newest thing in the game as soon as it's introduced, but that doesnt mean you will be able to. It's ok if you're not first cause you cant do it the sec it's put in game. It's not going anywhere, you'll be able to do it eventually. If raiding is your thing, till you get to the point of being able to do master, do reg vog.