[quote]One thing we have noticed is a lot of discussions about the Endgame and how it can be improved. Right now, these discussions are also happening in our studio. We are listening, but need time to digest everything and draw up the best plans for the future. We will have more to say on this soon. Please stay tuned, and keep the conversation rolling.
-Cozmo[/quote]
Thank you for the update and it's good to hear it's being discussed internally. Like you said, there are millions of players and we all have differing and strong opinions on what Destiny is/should be and it's got to be hard to build a game that fits what everyone wants. That said, here are some things that I believe would improve the game and endgame grind (some more easily doable than others, but all I think worth considering)
1) A total rethink on team sizes. 3, 4, 6 doesn't work. Ostensibly the reasoning for 4v4 PvP was creating the best crucible experience possible. It doesn't take much searching to see that isn't panning out.
Yes, good connections and crisp play are fun but what's more fun is playing with friends and not telling 2 they have to go after a raid.
DeeJ was correct about Destiny and friendship but the current game philosophies don't support that. There are no easy transitions from patrol to PvP to raiding. It's disjointed and leads to someone always left out or already playing with others because there wasn't room.
Clans in-game are great, but raids as the only 6 player social activity isn't sustainable. Besides Crucible, patrols should 100 % be accessible by 6 members of a fireteam. We cheese it sometimes and it's FUN all running around planets and doing public events together just like it was a blast to cheese 6 into CoE and Archons Forge in D1. I also think despite the idea of Hunter, Titan, Warlock symmetry of 3 person Fireteams, they should grow to 4 eventually.
2) Get rid of Xur. It's good 3oC are gone but exotics still don't feel like special drops anymore. I remember the feeling of having my first exotic drop in D1 and how exciting it was. They're basically handed to us in D2.
I think having chance drops from strikes, the NF and raid underbelly chests is fine; as well as the weapon specific quests like MIDA, but I think Exotic Bounties should return. I think the Vanilla Exotic Bounties were probably the best bounties in D1 and truly felt rewarding. When someone had Thorn, you may not have liked the gun but you knew they earned it.
I would remove Exotic engrams from heroic public events and instead put bounty drops in the loot pool for a set of exotics obtained through them.
3) make exotics feel exciting and special. They don't need to all be more powerful, but every Exotic should have one perk that makes it fun.
4) Eververse is robbing the game of end game content. While I think it's somewhat better than D1 (though still hate that Eververse is RNG) in that items get sold for dust that we can attain just playing as well, I think too much was put into that loot pool.
The exotic ships and sparrows should all be moved to random drop chances in Lost Sectors and Cayde's chests. I would put them at low to extremely low drop chances but they're content that players would enjoy playing and grinding to get instead of wasted as Eververse purchases.
5) The token system needs a lot of work. It's okay with the world vendors and wasn't too bad with the Faction Rally, but it's not popular in IB and how the same random gear drops we get in every other faction engram ended up as loot possibilities for ranking up in IB is really mystifying.
6) There's not enough unique loot. When it was announced all great would have static rolls, I assumed that would be made up for with just tons of variety. That's not really the case.
While the unique sets from the various vendors are cool, there should be more starting with strike specific loot drops like we had in D1. Outside of Zavala's reward drops, there's pretty much no reason to run a non nf strike in D2. I know that for whatever reason you all hated us grinding for weapons like Grasp, but the fact that we did spend so much time farming Omnigul should tell you that we thought it was fun and rewarding.
7) mods aren't fun and there economy is still awful. It's kinda cool we can have 99,999 Glimmer now, but when we're constantly dropping 95% purchasing blue mods to hopefully convert to purple (and not having enough Glimmer to apply them if they do drop! it becomes less fun really fast.
Blue mods just need to go completely. What's their function other than to stack to make legendaries? Drop the pointless step and just let us purchase purple mods.
The mods themselves need work too. They're all pretty boring and outside of weapon stability mods, pretty useless. I've seen suggestions for things like 3rd eye on mods. Don't know that I'd do that on every weapon, but I think exotics all having a customizable special mod slot (with special mods like 3rd eye) would make mods and exotics more fun.
8) Let us replay the full campaign. The Ikora memories idea isn't bad but should not be the only way (besides starting over) to replay the full campaign. Ikora could still have her memories, but I think they should be special, more in-depth missions in the vein of Praedyth's Ghosts and really bring the lore to life. Wouldn't have to be all the missions either.
9) Give more (read: any kind of) endgame challenges for solo play. The craziest thing about D2's disjointed team endgame is that it's all so punishing for solo play.
Crucible just isn't very fun solo.
Nightfalls are no longer soloable
Strikes don't drop anything worth playing with randos to get
Most public events I attempt solo, there aren't any randoms helping either.
There's no arena style endgame like PoE, CoE and AF
Outside weekly milestones, there's nothing else really to do and no daily bounties to grind
10) Jay from Destiny tracker suggested bringing back record books. This again could really give more to achieve at endgame and could be an avenue for even more unique gear sets (the Eververse gear sets could have been in a record book instead and I know players would've loved grinding PvP and PvE for those set completions.
11) make power level matter. It's one thing to scale everyone on patrol, but it plays and feels exactly the same at level 7 and 90 Power as it does at level 20 at 305. Shouldn't we feel stronger?
12) make endgame more rewarding in general. Playing IB everyday for no gear drops. Running the raid for no drops and level nothing gear you already have at the vendor. Those aren't rewarding experiences.
13) gate content better. Other's disagree but I still feel the raid a week in was a mistake and took away from exploring and really getting into the depth of the worlds. Instead everyone was power leveling for the raid and it turned out level didn't really mean much.
Trials did the same with PvP.
Now this week you had intended to drop IB and the prestige raid together. That made no sense. Why would you, knowing a lot of people are going to be grinding the raid all week, put out ib at the same time and make people choose?
14) completely redo the crucible. Casual and competitive would maybe work in set game modes, but they are all RNG.
In D1 I learned Destiny PvP playing Control. I was able to really learn the mode, the flow, the maps, etc in a game mode I felt good playing. D2 is a nightmare hodgepodge. There is no getting into a flow or rhythm when the game mode changes every match.
15) rethink timers. They're okay occasionally but they're mostly just artificial difficulty.
16) give us a Forge and Theater mode.
17) what's the point of the farm? Once we open the tower there's no real reason to ever go back and even if you prefer it, no vendors. Expand the farm. Give "remote" vendor access and please give us a shooting range. It would be so so so nice to be able to chill and test weapons while hanging out in the social space. Particularly if there were challenges and daily/weekly leaderboards.
18) let us grind and build gear sets how we want. There's nothing that really distinguishes any of the sets beyond skins. My choices as a Hunter are basically mobility and resilience. Sorry, no recovery for you today. Someone suggested let us use all our pointless Legendary shards to reroll the gear slots.
19) keep content flowing. So far we've had the faction rally added. It was fun enough, but let's be realistic. It was content that already existed turned into a limited time event. The world events were the highlights for me though as they really brought the planets to life that week.
20) Destiny is still fun AF. The weapons, classes and abilities are still fun. The raid is fun. PvP can be fun. The planets are beautifully crafted. Playing with our friends when the game allows us too is still fun. Just give us more to do. More to Chase and more to experience both with friends and SOLO.
Thank you
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1 返信SlowDancer13により編集済み: 10/14/2017 6:51:56 PMMy biggest issue is the power scaling. It drives me nuts that as a 305 Light Level Warlock, I die just as fast as if I was 240 in the Nightfall. I’m 65 levels above recommended, why am I dying so quickly? Edit: Bad Math
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Kiloにより編集済み: 10/15/2017 3:49:11 AMI just want an endless wave mode. Like zombies in CoD or Junkensteins revenge in Overwatch. I don’t want PoE. Way too much down time and it’s just flat out boring. Same with Archons forge. Everyone just picks a door and spawnkills everything. It’s boring. I just want to hold off for as long as I can before getting overwhelmed by adds. That’s fun. I can spend hours doing that.
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Good post. On your point about Eververse, you said that you want to see the ships and sparrows relegated to Cayde's chests and Lost Sectors. I understand the intent, but you specifically say this would be to provide something for players to grind towards. However, Eververse items come from Bright Engrams, which come from earning exp by playing the game. So, theoretically, wouldn't this actually [i]hinder[/i] a player's grind to be more focused than it is now? I don't feel like that would be a good change...
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2 通の返信Totally right about exotics. They don't feel special at all. We went from greats like sleeper and dark drinker and telesto(!) and outbreak prime to fighting lion. Remember the first time you saw or used Touch of Malice? You probably thought "Holy shit this is nuts". I want that feeling again. I get that Bungie are probably holding back a lot of exotics and returning exotics (please bring back Telesto). It's just tough going from the wackiness of RoI-era exotics to what we currently have.
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1 返信I would love if we could get a form of prestige public event so if we're in a heroic one we could perform some insane task to activate it. Like possibly "ether resupply" a second giant servitor could appear I don't know just something bungie could think about down the track
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egm09により編集済み: 10/14/2017 11:24:26 PMI agree with all of the post for the most part. Although I do say one of my favorite things that could be added was the gun range in the farm. Being able to test a weapons recoil or see which sight you like best while having access to your vault would be really nice.
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2 通の返信I agree. Good post. Unfortunately, nothing will be changed until year three when the game is approaching its end.
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2 通の返信Get rid of the raid maze - Just spawn people in their checkpoints. - Give people their loot at the end of encounters, instead of hunting chest tokens in the maze for another hour.
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1 返信Light/power/level have never meant anything in destiny. All the mobs take the same number of bullets to kill if your level 1 or power 305. Poorly designed artificial hurdle to slow down player progress. The farm needs more support. I only finished the lackluster campaign for the faction event, which I knew was going to be dead orbit. (New monarchy for life). There's literly no reason to play this game more than once a week. This game has had feedback for years and I give simply doesn't care, they just want to part you with your money. I've never purchased this game or dlc, they came with the white PS4/PS4 pro. There's nothing in this game worth the justification of the price tag nor the dlc.
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IMO they should also add a rank to competitive and seasons or something that offer unique rewards at the end of it depending on your rank or it could just be the same weapon but each rank gives a better version of it with better perks or something or even just aesthetic differences for each variation of it so that people wouldn't bitch about not being able to have a certain weapon because they suck at pvp (me) the same could go for armor or they could offer a unique shader emblem ship sparrow etc. The point is that there needs to be an incentive for comp besides the game modes whether incentive is a rank and unique rewards at the end of a season or even just a different set of armor and weapons that you can only get from comp and you can get them with comp tokens that you would be rewarded with for winning or completing the season with a high rank would give you more tokens.
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2 通の返信[quote][quote]One thing we have noticed is a lot of discussions about the Endgame and how it can be improved. Right now, these discussions are also happening in our studio. We are listening, but need time to digest everything and draw up the best plans for the future. We will have more to say on this soon. Please stay tuned, and keep the conversation rolling. -Cozmo[/quote] Thank you for the update and it's good to hear it's being discussed internally. Like you said, there are millions of players and we all have differing and strong opinions on what Destiny is/should be and it's got to be hard to build a game that fits what everyone wants. That said, here are some things that I believe would improve the game and endgame grind (some more easily doable than others, but all I think worth considering) 1) A total rethink on team sizes. 3, 4, 6 doesn't work. Ostensibly the reasoning for 4v4 PvP was creating the best crucible experience possible. It doesn't take much searching to see that isn't panning out. Yes, good connections and crisp play are fun but what's more fun is playing with friends and not telling 2 they have to go after a raid. DeeJ was correct about Destiny and friendship but the current game philosophies don't support that. There are no easy transitions from patrol to PvP to raiding. It's disjointed and leads to someone always left out or already playing with others because there wasn't room. Clans in-game are great, but raids as the only 6 player social activity isn't sustainable. Besides Crucible, patrols should 100 % be accessible by 6 members of a fireteam. We cheese it sometimes and it's FUN all running around planets and doing public events together just like it was a blast to cheese 6 into CoE and Archons Forge in D1. I also think despite the idea of Hunter, Titan, Warlock symmetry of 3 person Fireteams, they should grow to 4 eventually. 2) Get rid of Xur. It's good 3oC are gone but exotics still don't feel like special drops anymore. I remember the feeling of having my first exotic drop in D1 and how exciting it was. They're basically handed to us in D2. I think having chance drops from strikes, the NF and raid underbelly chests is fine; as well as the weapon specific quests like MIDA, but I think Exotic Bounties should return. I think the Vanilla Exotic Bounties were probably the best bounties in D1 and truly felt rewarding. When someone had Thorn, you may not have liked the gun but you knew they earned it. I would remove Exotic engrams from heroic public events and instead put bounty drops in the loot pool for a set of exotics obtained through them. 3) make exotics feel exciting and special. They don't need to all be more powerful, but every Exotic should have one perk that makes it fun. 4) Eververse is robbing the game of end game content. While I think it's somewhat better than D1 (though still hate that Eververse is RNG) in that items get sold for dust that we can attain just playing as well, I think too much was put into that loot pool. The exotic ships and sparrows should all be moved to random drop chances in Lost Sectors and Cayde's chests. I would put them at low to extremely low drop chances but they're content that players would enjoy playing and grinding to get instead of wasted as Eververse purchases. 5) The token system needs a lot of work. It's okay with the world vendors and wasn't too bad with the Faction Rally, but it's not popular in IB and how the same random gear drops we get in every other faction engram ended up as loot possibilities for ranking up in IB is really mystifying. 6) There's not enough unique loot. When it was announced all great would have static rolls, I assumed that would be made up for with just tons of variety. That's not really the case. While the unique sets from the various vendors are cool, there should be more starting with strike specific loot drops like we had in D1. Outside of Zavala's reward drops, there's pretty much no reason to run a non nf strike in D2. I know that for whatever reason you all hated us grinding for weapons like Grasp, but the fact that we did spend so much time farming Omnigul should tell you that we thought it was fun and rewarding. 7) mods aren't fun and there economy is still awful. It's kinda cool we can have 99,999 Glimmer now, but when we're constantly dropping 95% purchasing blue mods to hopefully convert to purple (and not having enough Glimmer to apply them if they do drop! it becomes less fun really fast. Blue mods just need to go completely. What's their function other than to stack to make legendaries? Drop the pointless step and just let us purchase purple mods. The mods themselves need work too. They're all pretty boring and outside of weapon stability mods, pretty useless. I've seen suggestions for things like 3rd eye on mods. Don't know that I'd do that on every weapon, but I think exotics all having a customizable special mod slot (with special mods like 3rd eye) would make mods and exotics more fun. 8) Let us replay the full campaign. The Ikora memories idea isn't bad but should not be the only way (besides starting over) to replay the full campaign. Ikora could still have her memories, but I think they should be special, more in-depth missions in the vein of Praedyth's Ghosts and really bring the lore to life. Wouldn't have to be all the missions either. 9) Give more (read: any kind of) endgame challenges for solo play. The craziest thing about D2's disjointed team endgame is that it's all so punishing for solo play. Crucible just isn't very fun solo. Nightfalls are no longer soloable Strikes don't drop anything worth playing with randos to get Most public events I attempt solo, there aren't any randoms helping either. There's no arena style endgame like PoE, CoE and AF Outside weekly milestones, there's nothing else really to do and no daily bounties to grind 10) Jay from Destiny tracker suggested bringing back record books. This again could really give more to achieve at endgame and could be an avenue for even more unique gear sets (the Eververse gear sets could have been in a record book instead and I know players would've loved grinding PvP and PvE for those set completions. 11) make power level matter. It's one thing to scale everyone on patrol, but it plays and feels exactly the same at level 7 and 90 Power as it does at level 20 at 305. Shouldn't we feel stronger? 12) make endgame more rewarding in general. Playing IB everyday for no gear drops. Running the raid for no drops and level nothing gear you already have at the vendor. Those aren't rewarding experiences. 13) gate content better. Other's disagree but I still feel the raid a week in was a mistake and took away from exploring and really getting into the depth of the worlds. Instead everyone was power leveling for the raid and it turned out level didn't really mean much. Trials did the same with PvP. Now this week you had intended to drop IB and the prestige raid together. That made no sense. Why would you, knowing a lot of people are going to be grinding the raid all week, put out ib at the same time and make people choose? 14) completely redo the crucible. Casual and competitive would maybe work in set game modes, but they are all RNG. In D1 I learned Destiny PvP playing Control. I was able to really learn the mode, the flow, the maps, etc in a game mode I felt good playing. D2 is a nightmare hodgepodge. There is no getting into a flow or rhythm when the game mode changes every match. 15) rethink timers. They're okay occasionally but they're mostly just artificial difficulty. 16) give us a Forge and Theater mode. 17) what's the point of the farm? Once we open the tower there's no real reason to ever go back and even if you prefer it, no vendors. Expand the farm. Give "remote" vendor access and please give us a shooting range. It would be so so so nice to be able to chill and test weapons while hanging out in the social space. Particularly if there were challenges and daily/weekly leaderboards. 18) let us grind and build gear sets how we want. There's nothing that really distinguishes any of the sets beyond skins. My choices as a Hunter are basically mobility and resilience. Sorry, no recovery for you today. Someone suggested let us use all our pointless Legendary shards to reroll the gear slots. 19) keep content flowing. So far we've had the faction rally added. It was fun enough, but let's be realistic. It was content that already existed turned into a limited time event. The world events were the highlights for me though as they really brought the planets to life that week. 20) Destiny is still fun AF. The weapons, classes and abilities are still fun. The raid is fun. PvP can be fun. The planets are beautifully crafted. Playing with our friends when the game allows us too is still fun. Just give us more to do. More to Chase and more to experience both with friends and SOLO. Thank you[/quote] Some great suggestions here. Bungie needs to act fast. I'm seeing less players every week.
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1 返信Seriously, more exotic weapon and armor quests, please. Just have the entire next wave of exotics available via quests only, and then add them to the engram loot pool after the first season has passed. And granularity. I think that's what I miss most out of the endgame cycles. Right now character specs are far too limited in terms of perk modifications, and gear is just repetitious. Getting three of the same gun in back to back gunsmith packages would at least be less annoying if they had some variation between them. We're missing the sense of being epic or legendary. Challenges don't feel challenging enough, and beginning activities shouldn't still be tough to complete with nearly maxed-out characters. The world scales a bit too much. And I realize development forked right around Taken King/April Update's launch, but go back and take some lessons in terms of everything from the last year of D1. There's a lot from that ti.e period that seriously improved the game that shouldn't have been ditched in the new iteration. Were D2's developers just kept completely out of the loop from what D1 was doing after the fork?
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[quote][quote]One thing we have noticed is a lot of discussions about the Endgame and how it can be improved. Right now, these discussions are also happening in our studio. We are listening, but need time to digest everything and draw up the best plans for the future. We will have more to say on this soon. Please stay tuned, and keep the conversation rolling. -Cozmo[/quote] "We didn't finish Destiny 1, and now, whoops, looks like we didn't finish Destiny 2. We suck at life." - all of Bungie. Everyone.
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4 通の返信In all seriousness, I think it might be in your best interest to move on to another game. It seems you want a game entirely different from what you've been given, and those changes are just not going to all happen when there are always going to be people that want others things or prefer the game as is.
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Sols, In all seriousness if you have to make a list that totally revamps the game in almost every aspect, what does that mean to you. Your list is good but is not exhaustive I am sure you will admit. You are suggesting they basically make a better game than the one we have been given. And btw I cannot see how 6x6 won't be a complete shit show on these new maps with there terrible connectivity issues. The game is having difficulty running 4x4 flawlessly.