Main problem is that it no longer feels like Destiny. They changed it a lot and the primary team shooting gets old. This comming from a 1.7KD player.

The stupid thing is that they should have ADDED 4v4 into the game. That way it could have been the 'ranked' playlist they based everything off of. Suddenly they have their 'esports game' and a game others can enjoy without the constant push towards competitive environments. Hell, even halo understood that. You know... the game Bungie made. They, of course, revolved around 4v4 but they had a plethora of other things for [u]other players[/u]. 8v8, 5v5, FFA, 2v2, and half a dozen fiesta, funny, care free modes as well. They don't even take things from the past that [u]might actually work[/u] and instead come up with 'new' broad stroke ways that look like garbage even on paper. -- Oh, and good luck with objective based modes. At least in 6v6 you had a greater chance of getting like minded individuals who wanted to win. Now? You'll most likely find yourself being the only one capping the point if you aren't with friends. And, on top of that, for this reason, you'll be facing teams all the time. Lots and lots of teams. Have fun solo players!

Omg shut the hell up as much as the noob quit the matches be 4v4 any way 5v4 6v2 i seen it all

Hopefully the balance changes will be separate from pve so pvp players can enjoy the miserable state they turn pvp into. Yea the state pvp is in now is here to stay and well its ur fault pvp players. Shouldnt have moaned so much about every single thing that killed u. Let pve balance changes like nerfing ghally so people would stop letting people into raids for not having it continue or black hammer so we wouldnt have infinite ammo. That im cool with. Nerfing special ammo reserves cause pvp players are moaning about people sniping all the time OR every class nerf ever done.

[spoiler]Law, I can't help but to giggle when I read your thread title, like a little school girl[/spoiler]

Sadly your not wrong. Bungie went the wrong direction. Only for the sake of a few streamers and elites. Participation in trials was low compared to other modes. The elites both hated and enjoyed this. Hated that some of the time it was extra sweaty matches. Loved it for the Farming of k/d and ELO abilities (we will just skip the "donate to me to play" selling of runs, and massive cheating for now). Bungie (in all there logic) decided trials was not the problem (what has been vomited by the streamers and elites). It was other modes are the problem. So bungie (to please the only player they care about) decide to make all game modes trials. 4v4. Even the new game mode is elimination style (worst mode in my opinion). Sadly I think this will have the opposite effect. Player will hate it. They will stop playing it. Leading to a even smaller player pool than now. Longer matchmaking times and even more lag. Also with out the change to PVP systems the cheating will keep going. Later bungie will try to argument the drop in players by making PVP guns and armor simply out class anything to get in PVE. Also include every exotic world have a PVP part you will be FORCED to do in order to get it. As a way to artificially inflate the numbers. Again a few get what they want at the expense of every one else. Bungie gets to keep saying "we are competitive" (trying to reclaim halo glory days) under a illusion. It's easy to say your competitive and should be in esports when the only way to play PVP is in esports. Just sad. The more I here the less and less I feel the urge to be excited about it or even buy it. I'm not saying some of the game might not be amazing (PVE) but the one part, the thing you do after raids and stuff is over, has been completely taken away from normal player. To get People playing PVP it should be made fun and engaging. Not restrictive, unfair, and unbalanced, and with out lowering the number of players in a effort to spread what few are around.

Don't get me wrong, I hate the fact that it's just 4v4 across all game-modes. From what I saw I can't say that I am looking forward to it whatsoever but, the "Hybrid servers" are intriguing and the gunplay looked smoother than it is now. Plus what we saw could change drastically within the coming months. So yeah, i'm mostly on the side with what you're saying here.

Sorry for your disappointment...I'm staying the f*** away from Destiny PvP this time. I played a lot of it in D1 but it frustrated me waaaay too much and I ended up rage quitting. I'm gonna stick with BF and Titanfall for my pvp fix moving forward.

I don't like the four vs four concept ! It's ridiculous !

I haven't played Destiny for a long as time. It was probably December. Of course I'm hearing about Destiny 2 so it's only natural I find out about it. The first bit of info my friend tells me about is 4v4 pvp. Instantly I knew why. I started in summer of 2014 with the alpha...the PVP has always been un fixable...the only fix is to reduce player count? It's a cop out in my opinion.

I agree, I wasn't expecting anything like Battlefield or Battlefront just because I knew they weren't going to go with dedicated servers, but I also wasn't expecting them to take the direction they've decided to take. 4v4 for everything (I'm hoping they misspoke and it's just the primary mode with more options) and slowing down PvP in general to basically mirror Halo style PvP is the opposite of what I was hoping for. I was really hoping they'd move back to a year 1 PvP style. But, like you said, it could be fun so playing the Beta is going to be a big factor in my decision to buy or not. I will say I'm a little surprised at all the "you haven't played it yet" responses. If you were stating the game was going to be terrible or something like that I could see those replies making sense, but we're talking about things we've seen and can draw reasonable conclusions from. This idea that you have to play something before forming an opinion is a bit ridiculous but seems to be par for the course on here anymore. Imagine how much money you'd waste on terrible games if you actually had to play them to know they were bad.

If they bring back Iron Banner and it's ONLY 4 vs 4, F@#K THAT!

Agreed, as a competitive player. I hate how they removed the fun factor and went all in on the sweat factor Not everyone wants to try hard every match

Esport = $$$$$$ -blam!- your playing experience, gimme the cash.

I agree wholeheartedly with this. And Luke Smith isn't that smart. I feel like Bungie is trying to cater to Youtubers and major Twitch streamers on how to make their game popular. And now I can only invite 3 of my friends, and I can't invite the guy who is bad but I still have fun with him. Sorry guy, you are bad so I am going to be picking up only 3 of my good player friends. Why not simply keep 6 v 6 and add 4 V4 as an option. Why not add an 8 V 8 option. Are internet speeds not increasing in the world, and people getting more bandwidth as time goes on, so wouldn't that logic apply to gaming as well. With people having more bandwidth to play with, they can in turn create bigger and better online games. Bungie CEO should stop listening to him, like he is holy grail of game designers. Just because the guy did a nice job with making the Vault of Glass, he also had a team he was working with, and he didn't create the Vault of Glass entire on his own. Why does this guy get to decide what Destiny 2 is and is not. Why not first ask players, not Twitch streamers or Youtubers what Destiny 2 should be like. And also he is kind of a douche bag. There I have said it. Just because he had some good ideas, doesn't mean that Bungie brains should all stop thinking, and give him ultimate control over the future of this game. Stop this guy before it is too late. Maybe they think that making Destiny competitive will increase sales, but in reality, I just play the game for fun. I don't care about competitive. I care about it being fun with my friends. Inb4ban. :P

They took away 6v6 to sell it back to us in the first DLC. You heard it here.

I think they'll add more game modes later on they just want to force 4v4 at launch to get the best idea of how it plays out with all the changes they made to PvP. Eventually I think once they have enough insight and feedback theyll include more variety. I do agree though that it's kind of disappointing to find out we are missing out on a lot of game modes that revolve around 3v3 and 6v6

Some people are responding without reading your thread Some people don't realize we already do have 4 V4 when bungee has network issues or in private matches, so we have a pretty good idea of what 4v4 is going to be like So many fanboys, who don't even play, commenting in support of less variety.

I can't imagine playing rift or control with only four players.

I'm more than worried about PvP. It seems we are in this Bataan Death March..........toward Halo. The whole 4v4 thing is just to make easier for them tweak/nerf gear. As a big fan of 6v6, I am so not impressed. I too was hoping for some kind of Battlefield 1 experience. Instead, we get an even smaller scale! All I can say is, PvE better knock my socks off.

Even over watch is 6v6

Options for more not less. Yes include 4vs4 but also include some mayhem maps with 10 v 10 or higher! That would be great!!!

Exactly. It's a down grade. Sequels are supposed to be upgrades.