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Lord Bird Iにより編集済み:
10/15/2015 1:50:39 AM
119
"Sunbreaker is only based on the super, so that means the subclass is fair."
Compare the base melee/grenade/super to any other subclass. The grenades and melees are balanced with the other subclasses, but the super completely outclasses any other comparable super. And somehow the fact that most of the subclass upgrades make the super even more powerful makes the subclass balanced? This is just flawed logic. Other classes have upgrades to improve grenades, melees, etc. but because the Sunbreaker's mostly upgrade the most powerful attack, the super, that somehow makes the subclass worse? I think all the subclass upgrades aside from Cauterize are fair (Giving that huge of a bonus for every single ability kill is overpowered), but the Hammer is unfortunately due for some tuning eventually. Do note though that I hope the other subclasses are rebalanced as well, as I don't want to have another Hunter supremacy Crucible meta like before, nor do I want any other subclass to be the most powerful.
Related Post on my balancing suggestions if you'd like to read them:
[spoiler]https://www.bungie.net/en/Forum/Post/159316548/0/0[/spoiler]
Edit: This comment made me realize an argument people may have:
[quote]Stopped reading the second you said a titan's base melee was on par with either class.[/quote]
I do agree that the Titan melee is by far the worst of the three classes. This is something I would address if I was in charge of the balancing (I am unfortunately not). Either way, the melee range doesn't mean that the super should be this powerful (The other Titan subclasses have the same range but worse supers.)
Thanks for reading,
Birdman00
English
#Destiny
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2 通の返信
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1 返信
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The reason sunbreaker is OP is this: They get 1-hit-kill ranged attacks, more armor, and mobility Every other super only has 2 of these GG: mobility and 1HK Ranged, no armor BD: Armor, Mobility, but Melee only (razor's edge is somewhat of an exception, but it requires skill to aim and must be on the ground, so I consider it Melee still) FoH: 1HK and Armor, no mobility/one chance only Defender: lol nice try Nova Bomb: 1HK and Armor, no mobility/one chance Sunsinger: more armor and range, but a) grenades don't track like hammers do, b) they are really slow compared to sunbreakers Stormtrance: mobility and armor, not a 1HK and short range SS: armor and range, but no mobility/one-3 shots only, requires skill to hit target So yeah 7 supers are balanced and 2 are not
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1 返信Ronin Tanukiにより編集済み: 10/18/2015 4:47:30 AMAt this point they should really just nerf it, people's immediate reaction is to run for their lives. Seriously, the second the "ting" is heard, they abandon everything they were doing and scatter like roaches. It makes it quite annoying to get kills. Either that, or they suddenly become kangaroos. Jumping everywhere, like someone dropped a crate bouncy balls. Once they feel like they can "fight back" Sunbreakers will start racking up kills again. Nothing like a little bit of hubris.
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1 返信
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Sunbreaker is a very strong class without the super. Just gotta use it right. But the super does kinda go to far with output given the damage resistance. Should only take a small adjustment to resistance to fix.
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48 通の返信Yggsgallowsにより編集済み: 10/15/2015 1:49:53 PMThe Sunbreakers melee ability literally only applies Dot. It doesn't do any damage. It's total trash. Sunbreakers have mediocre grenades. Compare this to a Nightstalker who has amazing map awareness thanks to Keen scout, which upgrades the most potent tool in crucible. They get poison. They get shadestep. And their super can immediately shut down a sunbreaker. If the 5 bazillion hunters out there would just save their super to shut down titans rather than trying to be Rambo all the time it would be readily apparent how terrible Titan's neutral game is. It's not even that hard to kill them. A fast firing sniper will completely disintegrate them. People just have to change their play style to be ready to counter for the super. But change is bad, so they just come here to bitch instead.
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13 通の返信I'm sorry but if you think sunbreakers neutral game is comparable to other classes neutral game then you are pretty blind. Lets look at blade dancer since sunbreakers are considered to be better then them in every way. Blade dancer has a tracking nade. Which is better then every nade the sunbreaker has. Blade dancer has blink. Which is inf better then Titan skating. Melee's. blade dancer can have a melee in 5 seconds flat. Sunbreaker actually has something comparable. Thermal vent. Sadly it requires a kill to trigger and you have the worst melee range. Where as blink strike nearly has the range of a warlock melee. Blade dancer also can have a ohk melee that procs anywhere but the direct front. Blade dancer has quick draw. Which makes everything but reloading faster. And it's always active. Sunbreaker has fleet fire. But you need multiple stacks. And it requires kills to trigger. Both have the ability to get health back on demand. This is the only time the classes are on par. Lastly the blade dancer has the ability to remove itself from the radar at any time. And if you can't see the strength for that idk what to tell you. Now that was just the blade dancer class. If I wanted to I could compare it to others to show you just how weak their neutral game is. I'm not saying that sunbreakers need a buff. Just saying its blatently false to say their neutral game is on par with other classes. If you call their weaker then average neutral game fair you are basically indirectly confirming the balance that we speak of.
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No matter the build, I think any super should be able to counter and kill another with the exception of the Titan bubble being used mostly for defense, (defending against a golden gun or nova bomb for example). Golden gun should kill a sunbreakers no matter what.
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3 通の返信
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7 通の返信The problem is, we have more hunters than warlocks, then titans... so people cry in that order.
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4 通の返信Titan melee while being the shortest range is also the fastest which is why it's the shortest
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So your argument for Titans having a bad melee and finally a good super is that well Titans others supers are worse and so are their melees . That's dumb bro ahahah so nerf hammer of sol so it can be as bad as striker and defender ! The worst pvp classes . I agree with some other stuff you said but you aren't wording things great buddy
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5 通の返信*coming from a warlock main whos never used titan in crucible* Titans have the worst melee, comparing hunters and warlocks both have ranged melee, and i think the hunters knife can even headshot. Hunters have 1shotkill trip mine and warlock grenades are also pretty good like arc bolt and thunderstorm. Titan grenades are underwhelming, the best one is the fusion and it only kills if it sticks. The super is the only reliable ability. Think about it, he can get off 7 hammers but u can run away from them, when in the other hand hunter has 3 hitscan shots, 4-5 grenades in between supers, and a throwing knife compared to a 3 feet range melee. Havent seen many warlocks complain about titans, only seen a couple hunters whining cause now they feel like they have a competition in crucible. You know, because they are the "best class" Kappa.
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6 通の返信Melting point is pretty great in crucible. Hit anyone else in their super and they die super easy. Plus the burn leaves them on almost no health. However if you run bad juju and get a 5 kill streak off spawn, you almost have super. I've had many games where I get 4-6 super activations.
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2 通の返信Exactly, the melee is probably the best in the game, fusions are cheap kills and incindiery got buffed. Titans complain more than warlocks and hunters
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2 通の返信I love how HoS made all the other titan subclasses redundant. It definatly needs to be tuned. [spoiler]really enjoying the few fist of panic though.[/spoiler]
