so far i have managed to grind out both the gambit and vanguard ritual weapons and right now I am two thirds done with the crucible one, that said.....the grind is just as bad, I am sure the scholar who made the grind for these is one of the same people who seem to think a slug shotgun can't accurately hit a target 100m away and drops off after 11 or 12 meters. part of the problem i might have getting randys throwing knife might be that i suck in the PVP side of the game but nonetheless the grind they put on these is kind of stupid, im all for the grind they have on say last word, ace of spades and lumina since those are good exotics but to put this much of a grind on something which only advantage is some perks that already exist.....kind of dumb, i mean why make the grind take so long, hell im almost done with getting recluse and mountaintop from having to grind the hell out of survival. slightly annoying grind aside i am having fun since sometimes i do well in the pvp part other times quite an embarassment.