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publié à l'origine sous : Sunsetting sucks. Can we, like, not?
9/19/2020 7:26:27 AM
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Well, after CDPR shows how they packed huge world of Cyberpunk 2077 with tons of NPC, players items and even more story lines in 70 gb, Bungie failed again. They can't keep few static empty location and 5 models + reskins in 100 gb for no reason. So I guess both sunsetting and content cut is only show how pathetic Bungie are as a devs. And maybe someone who said they delete all location which assets they will reuse in Europa is...well...true.
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  • Well cp77 is a SINGLE PLAYER game that has a foundation and knows exactly what it is. Destiny 2 is a live service game, has no clear directions just a bunch of ideas that lead nowhere, and isn’t even near focused on single player experience. Can’t compare the two.

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  • Exactly, and cyberpunk is a one and done game with maybe a few DLCs. It’s not like it will have content for years to come.

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  • Actually some of us done one and done games like that. Side quests, new game plus, leveling, exploration alone would keep me play for a good minute. Hell im still playing The Witcher games and discovering shit. Some developers know how to make an open world game, some don’t. Bungie? Eeeeh

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  • Cyberpunk was deigned on a brand new engine. D2 runs on an engine made in 2010.

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  • Modifié par Chadmington : 9/19/2020 6:53:01 PM
    Well, I for one am going to give it to them that Bungie is using an old engine as their game's foundation (I'm talking Halo 3 old), so I can see that there might be a reason that they are forced to do this. But the decision to use this same old engine, and not upgrade/change it in the meantime where it was apparent it won't be able to handle a certain load after awhile, is a [b]monumental[/b] and amateur mistake. I'm certain that even CDPR changed or upgraded engines in some way between Witcher 3 and Cyberpunk 2077, even though we aren't even talking that much time difference between the two. [b]That[/b] is good decision making. (Witcher 3 uses RED engine, while Cyberpunk uses RED engine 4)

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  • Both that much time? Witcher released in 2015. 5 years ago. Also, CDPR released Witcher 3, a couple DLCs, and then nothing. Of course they had to ability to build a totally new single player game from the ground up: they didn’t have to keep a game going. Destiny has to upgrade its engine while making improvements to and generating content for the game that is constantly running. Completely different situations.

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  • Modifié par Chadmington : 9/20/2020 8:48:28 PM
    /whoosh What does that have to do with the fact that Bungie knew the game won't be able to handle X content after Y time, since supposedly they had a [b]10 year plan[/b]? And when they made Destiny 2, they should've had known that this will be the case, since they had years of experience with that exact same engine and version at that point. But since playtesting is an endangered animal at Bungie HQ, it's not surprising they just rush into everything without any thought. Also no, it's not a completely different situation. The GAMES are completely different, yes. The situation? No, absolutely not. Making a decision based on what your game is going to be, and what's going to be in it, is the same situation. Don't try to give me that shit that Bungie "didn't know" they would have this much content going forward. If they did, and didn't change/upgrade engines, it's a fundamental mistake. If they actually didn't, because they didn't even plan anything, because they were banking on the game miserably failing, then that's just incompetence and a last ditch effort. Pick one. A good example of this, is EA right now. Most of their games use the Frostbite engine that was made for Battlefield years ago. All the games that aren't in the BF/Battlefront series, are just unstable, cobbled together barely working messes that were put together with an engine designed to absolutely not do what they are forcing it to do. Anthem (Open World Multiplayer), Fifa/Madden NFL (Football/Soccer), NFS(Open World Racing), Mass Effect Andromeda(Open World Exploration RPG), etc. Destiny is using the Halo 3 engine that was designed with small area PvP that for some reason prioritizes grenade physics above all else, and short linear single player campaign in mind. They know about this, they know what kind of games they are trying to make, they know the engine can't handle it properly, and they know that it's a bad decision, but they keep doing it for one reason: it's cheap, and they can just pop out new games/DLCs every year to rake in some cashgrab money. Bungie couldn't release D3, because they lost multiple studios with Activision ditching them, and now they are paying the price for not taking this into account, being lazy, and taking everything for granted. And instead of admitting this, they are banking on the sheer luck that the game hasn't collapsed under it's own weight yet. PSO2 is having a global engine upgrade and update in early 2021, because they know the engine won't be able to handle the new gamemode/playstyle coming in the expansion, and it gets a complete graphical overhaul too. And that's a F2P MMO (an actual real one) running for 8+ years now, with constant (FREE) content updates for everyone. So, which one is it with Bungie? Greed, or laziness/inability to plan ahead? They forced this situation upon themselves, when they decided they are going to begin developing D2 with the same engine. They decided, whether unknowingly, risking this very situation in the future, or knowingly, sabotaging themselves, that they will use the same engine, regardless of it's age and flaws. And when they noticed the engine just simply won't do, they didn't take action. Well, they did, but that decision is what we're seeing right now, removing 2/3rds of the game and adding back some D1 content with a (more than probably) CoO size DLC. So they get off easy, and the players, in all sense, are paying for this mistake.

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  • Modifié par Crystilonus : 9/20/2020 10:07:24 PM
    Man, it must be great to backseat drive on what game developers should do. You should be able to make your own game and make no mistakes whatsoever right? Remember, opinions are like a**holes ....... Again, it’s super easy to make a “good game” when you can devote 100% of your resources for 5 years to make that game as well as that game being a single player experience. Situations are different because games are different, have different priorities and goals, and made by different developers.

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  • Modifié par Chadmington : 9/20/2020 11:04:24 PM
    Damn, how much do you need to be a corporate suck-up to make excuses for a AAA game developer that is constantly making bad decisions? [quote]Man, it must be great to backseat drive on what game developers should do. You should be able to make your own game and make no mistakes whatsoever right?[/quote] It's basic -blam!-ing decision making, not rocket science. "Will this engine be able to handle the planned content? Yes/No. Will development in this engine yield satisfactory results in the planned lifespan of the game? Yes/No." I would be able to make a [b]decision[/b] whether I'd want my game in Unity, or in Unreal Engine 4, once I know what sort of game I want to make. All engines have specs, and all engines have ups and downs regarding development, therefore once you have a plan, you can pick the one you need to properly complete and manage the project. It's not a mistery unresearched ancient code, it's a complete engine with properties, quirks, and features. Now if I were to make a completely new engine from scratch, that's a different story. There are a lot more things that can go wrong in that case, but Bungie has chosen a game engine that was their own, and was already complete, and they knew what they were working with. [quote]Remember, opinions are like a**holes .......[/quote] Then why should I care about yours? [quote]Again, it’s super easy to make a “good game” when you can devote 100% of your resources for 5 years to make that game as well as that game being a single player experience. Situations are different because games are different, have different priorities and goals, and made by different developers.[/quote] Bungie was devoting 100% of it's resources on Destiny for 6+ years with HUNDREDS of employees. It would even be excusable if the expansions were grand in size, but most of them were mediocre at best, and the latest "content" is bland, boring, repetitive, shallow, and mostly just cosmetics in eververse. Of course, they don't have the resources now with Activision gone, and most of the crew working on the Chinese IP, but this was -blam!-ed up and sent in a wrong direction from the beginning. Also, since we are on the subject of "It's easy to develop a single player game", nobody told Bungie that Destiny should be an FPS-Looter-"MMO" Borderlands knock-off mish-mash hybrid that they can barely manage to keep up with. I would even go as far as to excuse Bungie that they used the same engine from Halo 3 in D1, because they were experimenting, looking for the limits, and they wanted to create/finish the game in a familiar environment. But going up to D2, they already knew the limits, because they had years of experience constantly developing in it and updating it, and they decided that, even though D2 could've had been a complete hard reset in every way, to keep basically everything, along with all the associated problems with the engine. Nobody told and forced Bungie to keep using the same engine for D2 when there were many more development-friendly, prettier, and more flexible engines out there. So in the end, whatever the situation is now, the conclusion is, Bungie [b]decided[/b] to make a game like this, they -blam!-ed up, management was terrible, and now the game is slowly going off track into the void. There is a reason Activision ditched them. They might be greedy assholes, but they know when to cut losses.

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  • Then do it. Make your own game with all this knowledge that is 10000% better

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  • Okay.

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  • Let’s say, hypothetically, the pro-SS really care about “their” game. Why would file size even be a consideration? They’re all “Bungie-good criticism-bad”. How can they possibly want less content from them? And “storage size” is as laughable and “power creep” yet they keep eating the shit being shoveled

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