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Editado por haisoon: 4/9/2018 7:18:42 PM
17

A Win-Win Proposal for a Superior Weapon Loadout System.

Since I know many people have short attention spans and unwilling to read so I created 3 versions of my Proposal, a super short, shorter and longer version. Longer version [spoiler] When Destiny 2 first came out, one of the things that came under criticism was the new weapon system consisting of dual primaries and a power slot, known as the Kinetic, Energy, and Power(or K.E.P) weapon loadout system. This new weapon system was met with mixed responses, some enjoyed it and saw it as an improvement, many were indifferent, and lots saw it as an abomination and viewed the only solution as to 'return' to the old Primary, Secondary, Heavy(or P.S.H.) weapon system of Destiny 1. Most people when discussing how the K.E.P. system needs to change, respond by strictly demanding the P.S.H. weapon system 'or else'. They offer no room for improvements or changes, let alone offer any creative ideas to accommodate others who actually like loadouts using the K.E.P. system, such as dual hand cannons, or other combinations, or people who despised being instakilled by shotties or snipers all the time. Hence I propose a solution to this problem that I believe is a win-win-win solution. I believe this system can make the P.S.H. people happy, the fans of K.E.P. happy, and furthermore I believe it can be a solution to make you, BUNGIE, happy. It can accomplish the formers by having more options than existing weapon systems, and the later by both building on existing foundations, and reducing the vast amount of coding changes, and animations needed to "convert" to the P.S.H. system allowing more resources freed to pursue other changes. This proposed weapon system consists of two parts, the foundation and the curveball. I will first propose the system, then I will discuss some possible problems and solutions caused by this system. The Foundation: Essentially I have found it always odd in game that despite both Gunpowder based weaponry, and Energy based weaponry were in use, that there were entire classes of weapons that only had one variant. It was at odds with similar game types such as Halo where you had counterparts of each weapon type, a kinetic sniper and a plasma sniper, a kinetic auto rifle and a energy auto rifle, kinetic vehicles and plasma vehicles, etc. As such from a in game/lore perspective that the Kinetic, Energy, Power system makes more sense. So I propose keeping the current Kinetic, Energy, Power system, but making one crucial change. That change would be to move existing and future snipers etc(former Secondary weapon types) and moving them from the Power slot to BOTH Kinetic, AND Energy slots. With this change some Snipers and Shotguns would have to be reprogrammed and given new animations to become Kinetic. But this amount of work would be much less than programming than attempting to 'return' to the P.S.H. system. Additionally this would have a MASSIVE benefit of allowing people to equip weapons how they like. It could allow people to have much more choices for weapon combinations than either existing weapon system. This system is a win-win, keeping fans and players of both systems happy. The Curveball: I titled this portion of the Proposed weapon system this way because this is an idea that would make the Proposed weapon system more than just practical, but entertaining. Unlike the Proposed Weapon System, this idea could be complicated to implement and adjust, but I believe it would be worth it. If this alteration were to be implemented it would be best after the Proposed system. The curveball would basically pick up where the Proposed Weapon system left off. You would already have snipers and shotguns etc divided among the Kinetic and Energy weapon slot. The focus of this alteration would be on the ignored Power slot. Basically the idea is for the Power slot to become known for its name, that is all weapons in that slot are POWERful. As such the strong weapons such as Rocket Launchers swords etc, would remain restricted to those slots only. This alteration however would allow you to convert ANY weapon in either the Kinetic or Energy slot to be transferred and equipped in the Power slot. When a normal weapon(Kinetic or Energy) is equipped in the Power slot it becomes a lot more powerful. The details of exactly how much more powerful they become is something that is subject to discussion, as you would want them not to overshadow Power only weapons. A possible example of how a weapon equipped in the power slot would change could be something like Better Devils. Normal explosions are a little bigger than heads/chest. Perhaps in the power slot the explosions would be the size or a person and be instant kills. The advantage of doing this would allow for greater tuning of weapons, such as an ordinary sniper would be used to take out smaller enemies/bosses while a Power Sniper would be used to inflict heavy dps on a boss. It could convert an auto rifle into a large machine gun or something similar. This idea could range from simple tuning of numbers(all Powercharged weapons gain a big boost to all their stats) to perhaps having an entire perk set that would only be unlocked when a power weapon. Transferring a Kinetic or Energy would be done by some sort of click and hold such as unlocking a ornament or dismantling a item while in the weapon menu(where you can change mods and perks etc). It could cost resources or be free. In the end I think this curveball needs a lot of discussion and work to become awesome, but I think the general idea behind it is something worth pursuing, and considering. The Problems: While the Superior Weapon System is a really sound and practical idea, it does have a few problems. Primarily these problems are in relation to PvP balance, as snipers and shotguns available all the time could make it easier for high skilled people to just brutalize low skilled people(spawn sniping for example). A good workaround could involve controling how much ammo is available in PvP, if the Curveball idea is implemented, then making a regular sniper two shot kills, and perhaps making a shot gun into a longer ranged weapon similar to sidearms and submachine guns, and not a 1 shot weapon. There are many more problems that could be considered, but I think many of them can be overcome, and the rewards far outweigh the difficulties.[/spoiler] Shorter version [spoiler] One of the things people complain the most about in Destiny 2 is how they changed the weapon system to dual primaries. People also demand that the only solution to fix the weapon system is to 'revert' to the D1 system of Primary, Secondary, Heavy weapons. There are some positive and good things about the current system, and it would be an immense amount of work changing power weapons to become secondary, and especially to cram all the Energy weapons in the 'Primary' Slot and redo animations, projectiles, etc. Instead the weapon system should stay Kinetic Energy Power as it makes more sense both in game and from a lore perspective(ie why no gunpowder snipers if there are gunpowder auto rifles). The Proposed Win-Win Weapon system would be to simply divide the existing snipers and shotties(and maybe fusion rifles) in the Power slot in half, then move them to BOTH the Kinetic and Energy weapon slots. So you would have Kinetic Snipers and Shotties, and Energy Snipers and shotties,etc. With this you could make people who like Primary Secondary system happy, and also make people who like the existing system happy, as well as making fans who would like running Shotties with Snipers happy, and people who like having more choices and options happy. WIN-WIN. Additionally it would require IMMENSELY LESS work to actually implement, allowing much more time and resources to be utilized working on other issues such as weapon perks/mod system, and creating additional weapons. So WIN-WIN-WIN. A crazy idea to build on this Weapon system and make it more interesting, would be to make Kinetic and Energy weapons able to transfer to the Power Slot, and become superPOWERed while in the power slot. Weapon stats and perks would be buffed to the point they are comparable to regular Power weapons such as Rockets. Hand cannons for example might become pocket snipers, or auto rifles become Heavy Machine guns, etc. This would open up even more options and allow people to create more combos(such as running triple hand cannon. Either way this weapon system regardless of whether it does the crazy idea or not, would be superior to BOTH Primary Secondary system and current Kinetic Energy system. It would make everyone happy, be much more realistic to program and implement, and would introduce more options. [/spoiler] Stupid short version [spoiler] Current weapon system not great. Old weapon system not the best choice for fixing weapon system. Better choice would be moving snipers, shotties, etc into Kinetic AND Energy slots so people can use weapons how they want. Also makes better sense from in game perspective(Y no gunpowder snipers?) Crazy idea after this would be making new kinetic and energy weapons able to be moved to Power slot and becoming much stronger if done. Auto rifles become like Large machine guns, Hand cannons pocket snipers, etc. [/spoiler] In conclusion this is an idea that certainly should be entertained and thoughtfully considered. I believe it can be a foundation for making this game and its sequels even more enjoyable, and that it can allow players what they enjoy, having more options and choices in how they play, and a win for everybody. Additionally with this system you would have more options to further develop the differences of Kinetic and Energy weapons, and their unique feel and attributes. If you think this is a good idea and a real win-win please upvote it and comment below, even if it is something simple like "Agreed". Help it get attention so it can be considered and hopefully implemented.

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  • Editado por marhunter7: 4/13/2018 4:26:49 AM
    What i would say is similar to what you are saying but i would go about it slightly different. I would say a good way to make both sets people to be happy-ish would be: Keep the kinetic energy and power weapon slots Make snipers shotguns and fusions be equip-able in the energy or kinetic slot. Bring LMGs back for heavy slot, keep swords, grenade launchers and rockets in heavy slots. Make it so that you can still equip a shotgun, fusion, or sniper in the heavy spot and doing so increases its damage but reduces it's ammo reserves. OR (and honestly the more personally preferred option) make specific heavy slot version of shotguns snipers or fusions (IE - sleeper simulant from D1) and also giving shotguns snipers or fusions that can be equipped in kinetic or energy slots (even if kinetic fusions don't make alot of sense, ignore that for now for sake of example). Keep the ability to equip normal weapons in energy slot or kinetic slot. This way if people want they can use an energy or kinetic version of the weapon they want, and also use what ever type of weapon for a secondary one; be it a scout rifle and a hand cannon, or a shotgun and a auto rifle, or even a fusion rifle and a shotgun. While still having a heavy slot weapon that is different for when something really needs to die. My idea is to kind of meet half way, because both weapon systems (D1 and D2's) have some merits and issues. Allowing more customization while also preserving the feeling of the weapon type and slot its equipped in. Also allowing each weapon to be balanced on an individual level instead of a archtype or class level. I like your idea but can't say im too big a fan of equipping things like auto rifles or hand cannons in the heavy slot. I can't help but feel that would bring about more problems than it would be worth considering bungie's habit of putting PvP balancing before PvE and potentially throwing all balancing in this game into a tail spin. Though that being said, i would not be opposed to having specific energy / kinetic version of swords rockets and grenade launchers; However they would have to be balanced alot to get the feel right without making them overpowered or worthless.

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    • as a person who used shot guns as much as i could in d1, and now that shot guns are even better in d2. nah, snipers and shoties don't need to be put back into the regular spots. people just need to get over it.

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      • Been saying this for a while. Only thing I'd add is low-damage melee weapons for the kinetic/ energy slots.

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        • can i have the short short version pleaseI?

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        • Creative doesn't equal balanced and you want the game to be a broken mess.

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        • Just add a fourth slot for special and call it a day. Double tap for special. Hold for heavy.

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          • So you just regurgitated the weight system the more than 1000 people have talked about this numerous times. #AttentionWhoreFound

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            • I totally appreciate the amount of articulation and time you talk into making this. That’s the first thing. Secondly I think it’s a great idea, and hopefully it gets looked at genuinely and discussed. Thank you Guardian

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            • No, D1 system, D1 system is what made Destiny feel like destiny, I don't know what this "fix" the weapon system business is. It was fun and original, and shouldn't have been changed. Just because a bunch of sub 1.0 kd scrubs get OHKed then whine about it, doesn't mean the whole game has to suffer.

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              • Editado por arf1049: 4/12/2018 2:06:32 AM
                Good idea but like -blam!- you’re gonna leave my FR’s in that horrible -blam!-ing power slot while tweedle dee and tweedle dum are put in kinetic and energy slots. And I’m aware you said them because they use gunpowder, and you also said etc as well leaving room for open debate whether FR’s fall in that category. However some people could only ever really use fusions as compared to shotties and SR’s

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                • Imma letchu finish, but, what if mods let you move any weapon you wanted to any slot you wanted, but nerfed or buffed it (damage and ammo in reserve) accordingly. You want a kinetic sword, the damage gets nerfed down to kinetic weapon level and no uppercut/lunge/smash, but you get a couple hundred swings (and can still guard). You want to move it to energy, same damage, halve the ammo reserves, and add in a burn and the RT attack. You want a Better Devils in your power slot, you can do that, but you only get 1 mag in reserve - it'll hit like a golden gun. That's how you make static rolls great, IMO. That's the dream I had when I played the beta and saw the mods - moving weapons around to whatever slot I wanted them in.

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                  • 2
                    I think you have some good ideas but I’m afraid that whatever they have planned is already on paper seeing as this issue is being addressed for the September DLC, funny that! Hopefully Bungie have listened and deciphered this time! A lot of your ideas could actually be implemented through mods and it’s a shame as the mod system is a good idea, it’s just that it in a prepubescent state atm! Well, gl to you guys n girls as I’m preemptively thinking May might be my last month playing anything Bungie again if that DLC and sandbox update stinks!

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                  • This would imply a total overhaul of the core of the game, they centered it around the weapon loadout system. They had a shit load of problems in D1 trying to balance the weapons , almost every weapon was nerfed and buffed and then got a nerf again along D 1 lifespan. Thats why we have what we have now, Bungies idea of balance. Good effort though, but i dont see Bungie making any significant changes on the loadout system for a very long time. They are just clueless when it comes to balancing weapons , as long as pvp is tied to pve ,the pve side is basicly screwed for the most part. Cheers.

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                    • Bump, really like the choices of what to read too.

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                    • I read the stupid short version. I’ve seen this idea before. It is creative, BUT you do realize that this system would mean that Bungie would have to balance every single weapon in all three weapon slots, right? From what I’ve seen to date, this would require ENTIRELY too much effort on Bungie’s part.

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                      • Agreed. Pvp balance be damned.

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                        • bump

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