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Edited by OutHouse:
1/14/2015 9:22:17 PM
24
"Cheese": Taking the fun out of gaming
I can't tell you the countless times I've been told while running someone from the community through the raid that they have [i]never[/i] done it legit. That if they die during the lamps. Their party has told them. "Just stay dead it's fine ". That they were excited to play with us to see how the raid was supposed to be played. To learn the encounters. The mechanics.
Why learn the mechanics and do it legit? [b]VIDEO GAMES ARE FUN[/b]
People forget. They are here for fun. Not so much the loot. But for [i]fun[/i]. By cheesing every encounter. You ruin it for yourself. And the people you are with. Cheese tactics are ruining a game that already needs a lot of love.
Look. I understand if you want to cheese a bullet sponge [i](valus ta'aurc[/i]) fight by finding a spot to sit and fill the boss with bullets. Because those fights aren't even fun.
But the raids ? [i]the raids are the best pve content in the game[/i]!!! So [u]why[/u] would you want to skip it?
People are so greedy about the loot or they say they "don't have time you don't understand" or any number of bullshit. My only answer to that? [b]too bad[/b].
If you [i]cant[/i] do it. That's not an excuse to cheat. You will never justify pulling your cable to make Crota kneel. The other stuff? Clever yes. But again. Why even bother playing the game ?
Why do people do this to themselves? What happened to that moment of victory. And satisfaction from defeating a challenge? Stop demanding a handout.
I'm not telling you how to play. Simply suggesting you play the -blam!-ing game you paid for. [i]Have Fun[/i]. What a novel idea.
TLDR: I simply want to know WHY people don't play the raid for fun. Is loot all you care about? is it all that matters? would you rather just log in go to the tower and have all the raid gear waiting in the post master? Why don't people play the raids for the content? what do you do WITH the raid loot? It just doesn't make sense to me. How is just getting the drops fun?
In Bungie We Trus7
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1 ReplyIts only taking the fun out of gaming for those who don't pay attention to their own game play.
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1 Reply1. You're assuming that the people who cheese are not having fun. 2. Crota's End is just not as fun as VoG (in my opinion, of course). For some people, the challenge of discovering a new way to "cheese" is rewarding enough.
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Getting new gear can be fun in and of itself and like a lot of people are saying cheesing can be fun. Ive done the raid both ways. First time I cheesed Crota I grabbed the sword and R2ed him until he was done and it was fun and funny as hell. I think the bigger question here is why do people need everyone to conform to their version of fun? I know you've said you want people to explain why something is fun but a lot of things in life it just is. Theres no rhyme or reason. Better yet why does anyone need to justify their fun to you? I haven't seen any threads where people are complaining about why people who only do things legit find it fun. They may be out there but I haven't seen em. Let people play how they want. If Bungie fixes it then its fixed. Why prattle on about it? If anything you should be thanking cheesers for exposing the glitches before everyone is running around with HM weapons/Necrochasm.
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3 RepliesMaybe different people have a different definition of fun. Who's to say the legit way is the way to play when everyone payed the same amount for the game ?
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3 RepliesEdited by Swiftlock: 1/15/2015 2:00:29 AMThankfully, your definition of fun isn't the same as other peoples'. Everyone has their own views and opinions. "fun" is 100% subjective. Open your mind a bit.
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1 ReplyBump for logic.
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Coz at 500hrs i dont get that moment anymore but love chilling with m8s ive made thru this game thats y i keep returning
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1 ReplyIf I wanted to have fun I'd run it legit with people I trust. If I just needed loot and my peeps aren't around, I wouldn't mind cheesing as it saves time. Let's be real, there are a lot of unskilled players out there, and I'm not getting loot, let alone having fun, with constant wipes. The way I see it. Though I agree the crota exploit is beyond ridiculous. PS I think you misspelled Rockets McDickface.
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1 ReplyIt's more fun to cheese, legit is fun the first couple times. Always looking for a way to do it faster with less effort. Remember Play Smarter not Harder.
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3 RepliesCheese is fun for me. Legit is fun for me. I like both and don't care which way other people do it. When I team up with people for either Raid, they're going to ask me one of two things: "Want to help cheese the Raid?" or; "Want to run the Raid?" To both questions I answer, "Sure. Let's do it.". Why? because [i][b]playing the game[/i][/b] is fun. Doesn't matter if it's cheesing or "legit". Cheese is just easier and more efficient to do. There. Threw off your whole equation, but that's how I feel.
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2 RepliesAgreed with your post until you said "you don't deserve the loot". It's not about loot or whether or not anyone deserves it it's as you said it's fun to raid and doing it legit is actually more fun than cheesing.
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2 RepliesI started soloing CE to avoid cheese. I don't see what's so fun about sitting at the back of a room until everything disappears, then standing at the back of a room while someone unplugs their console.
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3 RepliesIdk spamming solar grenades at the Templar with a bunch or warlocks was alot of fun
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3 RepliesEdited by ScribeTheMad: 1/14/2015 8:25:12 PMReally the hard part is defining "legit" vs "cheese" Cheating is another thing entirely and not something I condone. Glitching a boss to not fight back is cheating, jumping up on top of something so some mobs can't reach you is simply sound strategy. Walking somewhere the mob's leash won't let them follow would fall under cheese. You aren't glitching anything, merely standing beyond where they will go. Cheap? I guess, but that brings up the question, why would you willingly stand where they can reach you for the sake of "being legit"? Have you seen the early CE solo vid? The guy spends nearly all the time up on top of stuff, because it freaking makes sense, why would you willingly stand where the mobs can kill you in the name of a "legit" fair fight? This isn't some gentleman's dual, it's war, why shouldn't we use tactical advantages? This is complicated by the mess caused by lumping *everything* together under cheese/glitch/cheat. Cheating is cheating. Cheesing is cheesing. Cheesing is NOT cheating. Glitching is cheating Glitching is NOT cheesing. That said I recognize it can be frustrating when people insist on doing things a specific way, especially if that way is actually more work or frustratingly harder. Whether it's the wah wah we gotta do it "legit" crowd, or the we can haz to haz cheeze or we'll pitch a fit like a 2 year old crowd, both can be equally whiny, equally a pain in the butt to play with. Play the game, be efficient, don't waste effort, and don't insist on tactics or methods that are 2-3 times harder or take 2-3 times longer [b]for any reason.[/b] Dang forgot your main point. I have plenty of fun cheesing, not cheesing, whatever as long as it's not cheating. I'd wager that since I'm not stuck on "doing things legit" I actually enjoy the game a lot more than you might think. I do wish more people would be accommodating though, majority want to use X strategy? Alright lets do it. Majority wants to do it Y? Fine I see where you're coming from.
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4 Repliesi agree but "fun" is subjective. what may be fun for you could be torture others. take PvP for instance.
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3 RepliesIt all about time and reward if it was a glitch free experience then more people would be having fun but after the 5,6 or 20th time of the game glitch most just say the hell with it bring on the cheese. You act like people that have cheese have never done it legit when a good precentage have. The other precent are made of people who just suck at shooting, don't play enough to get good gea,r or people who keep going on pickup that cheese because It a pain to get 6 random people together. Flaws in the game is what cause exploits fix the game not just the exploits.
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5 RepliesI want to cheese to get to level 32, so I can finally start playing the game.
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1 ReplyRNG takes the fun out of gaming..........
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8 Replies
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6 RepliesIf you wanna play the legit way, go ahead! I do too! Form a team of people who like a challenge, that's my best advice. As for the cheesers, so what? How does their way of playing affect you? Hint: it doesn't. What separates a democracy from a dictatorship is freedom to do what we want. Bungie should [i][b]not[/b][/i], under any form of circumstances, dictate how we enjoy ourselves. Nor should you. Nor can you. Get over yourself, get off your horse, and play however you want. /thread
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8 RepliesBecause a majority of this game is an insanely repetitive grind fest without enough variety to keep it somewhat fresh. It's a chore after the 20th time, and the raid wasn't that good or fun to begin with
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3 RepliesEdited by Pale Mist: 1/14/2015 3:48:50 PMThank you for explaining to me what I find fun and how I should play the game. Yes, it is much more fun to lose 3 hours from the only day off I have per week on a simple part of the raid because some of my party members are -blam!-ing around. I bought the game with my money. From then on it was my decision how to play and what is fun. If I can do it, it's no one's business how I play it. Now it's been patched and I'll play normally. Cheating was also fun, and yesterday we did CE legit and succeeded everything in the first try. Suck on that people who think cheating means you can't do it legit.
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6 RepliesEdited by LbN SneaK: 1/14/2015 4:46:38 PMI agree with you. I am guilty of cheesing, but, in my defense I've always completed the raids the old fashioned way before hand. The raids are a lot of fun, first time VOG was probably the most memorable video game (PvE) experience I've ever played. Not justifying it, but I think most people start cheesing after completing the raids legit, and they do it just for a quick/easy way to get the best gear. The ones that are missing out the most are the guys that go LFG and search for cheese, having never played the vaults the correct way, as a team. OP is right, the raids are a lot of fun (mainly the first couple times though) and [b]if you haven't completed them without cheesing you are cheating yourselves from a great experience.[/b]
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9 RepliesThe funny thing is that you have probably cheesed the jumping puzzle in the VOG by going the shortcut or by jumping across, you probably never crossed it as intended using the mechanics of the game and jumping on every block before they disappear. We ran the raid legit prior to the patch and will when we want to after the patch, like you said we will do what we want and how we want to have fun. Please don't tell us what fun is.
