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originally posted in: Auto rifles in PvP vs prime weapons
8/13/2014 4:04:12 PM
8
.. auto rifles dominate close and medium range in pvp, pulse rifles are supposed to be a jack of all trades weapon, master of none that allows the best use of the weapon regardless of range, and the scout is for long range. think of it as rock paper scissor, auto beats the other two in close, scout beats the other two at long range, and pulse should be comfortable and usable at all ranges (however i do feel that pulse were under powered)
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  • Theoretically yes, but if you haven't notice this is a feedback thread. It's not the case from the beta. No one used pulse in crucible. If we want to be so technical, autos still could kill targets at "mid" range VERY quickly. Their bullet spread is minimal still at mid range, and that's just holding down the trigger. Auto rifles are overused in PvP

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  • bullet spread is minimal, but so is the damage, remember destiny is not like halo where bullets do teh same damage regardless of range, destiny actually has a damage drop off over range

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  • Once those shields are down a simple one bullet headshot ends the engagement. With autos having that tight bullet spread and rate of fire takin down shields are quick, even playing against scout rifles. I'm trying to say that autos shouldn't be able to handle even firing at a long range target but it's entirely possible.

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  • ... umm no, a headshot gives a precision damage modifier, a headshot on a shielded guardian does the same damage as a headshot on a unshielded guardian, now we don't know how much health we have in game, but if we assume 100 health, and 100 shields, in the beta, my auto rifle was doing 27 damage on precision hits at close range-ish range, that means it still takes 8 shots to kill a guardian from full to zero, or 4 shots on a unshielded guardian. did you know that the precision damage modifier is different based on weapons, for the scout rifle its quite high, a scout rifle can kill a guardian from full to zero in just a few hits (4 anywhere on teh body so with it's damage modifier for pricision shots you looking at a 2 shot kill weapon) funny thing, scout rifles tend to have a rate of fire which is only half, or 1/3 that of a auto rifle, which would give scout rifles a FASTER kill time over auto rifles, even in close range (with skilled shots) now sinc ehte beta is over this will be hard to test until the 9th, but as far as i can tell auto rifles, and scout rifles ARE balanced, expecially against eachother, pulse rifles on teh other hand need some help.

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  • Doesn't that bother you, theoretically, that the auto rifles have a tight bullet spread especially on full auto?? That doesn't work like that. Oh to your point about head shots, sure you might be right but most autos have a hi cap mag. Your shield is down, trust me there's already ten other bullets heading down range for your head. With the precise bullet spread.

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  • mag size isn't important, its rate of fire, and damage per bullet, auto rifles have a bad precision damage modifier (it's like .75) so their damage per bullet is weak, where as scout rifles have incredibly high damage per bullet (and their precision modifier is also high something like 3.0) so a single scout rifle round can do the damage of 6 or 7 auto rifle rounds. in terms of damage potential, if we remove accuracy, and spread from the equation, a scout rifle has a kill time which is very similar to a auto rifle, (or possibly faster) in terms of balance that is what we want to look at, kill time, because recoil is meant to interfere with (and can be overcome by) the player, and in terms of spread...well they aren't gonna make the same mistake they made with halo reach, random spread is ALWAYS a bad element to add to a game (again, random is bad period)

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  • Mag size does matter dude, having a 44 mag size with a precision that it is. That damage all adds up quick, might I add with the rate of fire.

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  • Mag size does NOT matter when we are comparing two weapons damage potential in a 1v1, because ALL weapons have large enough mags to ensure a kill with hits, a weapon is overpowered if it kills quickly, when comparing two weapons what we want to look at, for a raw damage situation like this, is rate of fire, damage per bullet, any damage modifiers, and that's really it, because, at the end of the day that's what matters in terms of damage, is how much damage they can pump out and how quickly. We want to remove the human elements from this equation so we also want to remove the elements that specifically interfere with humans, that would be the recoil. To simplify this question in terms of what's overpowered, and underpowered, what we want to know is how quickly one weapon can take a guardian from full to zero anything beyond that (like say, having extra bullets left in the mag) is necessary for this.

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