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originally posted in:Secular Sevens
8/4/2013 4:41:18 PM
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I'm SICK of seeing these "refuting Sarkeesian" videos cropping up again and again. Like Seggi said, the only major flaw in her videos is that her arguments should be obvious to anyone who has even moderate experience with video games, though even that does not render them irrelevant - they serve to raise awareness of such issues to non-gamers. If a black dude made a series called "Racist Tropes in Video Games", he would not recieve ANYTHING like this level of hate; in fact, I imagine that most gamers would support him. Anyone who seriously thinks that mainstream videogames don't oversexualise female characters or marginalise them to "love interest" roles is straight-up WRONG. And yes, I'm actually really -blam!-ing angry, because the responses to her videos, calling her out on particular examples of games that she didn't quite portray fairly or for using other people's videos or other techincalities, (as if those things somehow invalidate her arguments), as well as the threats of [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anita_Sarkeesian#Reaction]-blam!-[/url] and [url=http://www.newgrounds.com/bbs/topic/1310682]other violence[/url] against her only serve to perpetuate the image of gamers as misogynstic basement dwelling troglodytes (which, unfortunately, many are).
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  • [quote]And yes, I'm actually really -blam!-ing angry, because the responses to her videos, calling her out on particular examples of games that she didn't quite portray fairly or for using other people's videos or other techincalities, (as if those things somehow invalidate her arguments), as well as the threats of -blam!- and other violence against her only serve to perpetuate the image of gamers as misogynstic basement dwelling troglodytes (which, unfortunately, many are). [/quote] People gave her money to play all these video games and to review every aspect about the story and game play of them to analyze the "Sexist" and "Patriarch like" views these games portray, yet she BLATANTLY ignores a number of video games that has strong, independent heroines of their respective stories while nitpicking other plot points of games to drive her false point home. There is nothing wrong with a relationship in a video game with a female character, and when something happens that puts the female lead in danger, that doesn't turn her into an object. Obviously there is a serious connection between the hero and the girl that makes him want to rescue her, not because she's some prize that he gets to keep. But because the lead cares for her and wants to save her. Call it whatever you will, but I have the feeling she doesn't understand the basic parts of a deep relationship in stories. It doesn't matter who gets kidnapped, the SO wants to rescue them. The reason why it's always a male lead rescuing the girl is because it's a timeless general plot that can be used to further mostly any story, but it certainly isn't used by game devs to "establish a world of patriarchy on female characters" like she's implying. Furthermore, why does she even bother using sources of other people to summarize examples for her on games she has which clearly shows she has not played them and is just getting lazy. She's wasting peoples time and money to establish an obviously false view on games.

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  • [quote]People gave her money to play all these video games and to review every aspect about the story and game play of them to analyze the "Sexist" and "Patriarch like" views these games portray, yet she BLATANTLY ignores a number of video games that has strong, independent heroines of their respective stories while nitpicking other plot points of games to drive her false point home. [/quote] It's almost as if not every game is sexist, which was clearly her thesis statement. Feminism disproven!

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  • I'm not trying to disprove feminism. I'm trying to disprove her [i]individual[/i] view that games are sexist and only trying to turn women into objects which even in games that have a "Rescue the girl" theme, do not do simply because a girl being rescued in any form of media entertainment is not turning her into an object.

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  • Oh, so you think her individual view is that all games are sexist and that they're all trying to turn women into objects? Well, fantastic, now that we know you're criticising her because you don't understand what she's saying, we can all get past this simple obstacle.

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  • I never said all games, but thanks for putting words in my mouth, I'm hungry. The fact is she's saying the games that [i]do[/i] use the "Damsel in distress" trope is simply making the women in trouble in nothing more than an object cause the goal of the male lead is to rescue her. I can't really speak for anyone in a relationship here, but I'm sure anyone that was would want to rescue their SO not because they're a prize to win afterwards but because there is a serious relationship between these two people and rescuing the girl doesn't make her any less important. Furthermore she fails to recognize games where the roles are reversed (specifically FFX-2) where the female lead takes on the role of the rescuer in order to save the male lead. She ignores these obvious contradictions in her views. Granted you can say that these games may not come to light because "herp the classic sexist trope sells more" yet you can't make that claim on a game like FFX-2 which is highly praised.

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  • Neither of those things contradicts what she's saying.

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  • Mainstream games in which there are strong female lead characters are in a tiny minority. It's no good to just say "Well game X had a heroine! Feminism disproved!".

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  • Does the popularity mean anything though? I would argue that a game that counters her arguments that sells much better than a "Misogynistic, sexist" title is much more credible.

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  • I don't quite understand what you're saying. Popularity doesn't matter... But it does? What? The first and second sentences seem to contradict each other.

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  • That's what I was asking in the first sentence, I wasn't making a statement with a question. I believe that a game that doesn't have these Anti-Feminist tropes that sells much more is more credible than a game that sells like shit and has Anti-Feminist tropes.

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  • Well duh. And the opposite is true - and there are many more popular games which display these tropes than there are popular games which don't.

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  • Edited by Mega Blaziken: 8/4/2013 6:42:53 PM
    [quote]examples of games that she didn't quite portray fairly or for using other people's videos or other techincalities as if those things somehow invalidate her arguments[/quote] they do invalidate the arguments, it shows that she actually has no experience in those games, never even touched them or actually looked at the games themselves, and proves she's just bullshiting with one 5 second scene instead of looking at the game/cutscene as a whole, it proves she's a biased bitch and has no actual arguments, hell, she even refuses to look at the strong female characters like Samus, or Lghtning, as poiints where video did something right, instead she says video games have never showed strong female characters without a damsel plot point, she even went as far as saying that the villain killing the hero's loved ones (typically a girlfriend or wife which makes sense) is a bad thing just because it gives a male hero a motivation and some character development. and says women CAN'T feel any emotions when playing video games, just because the hero is male, or the one in distress is female, or hell, even when the hero is FEMALE. she's a lying hypocritcal con-artist, who doesn't even deserve any of the attention people give her.

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  • [quote]it proves she's a biased bitch[/quote] Hey, here's some good advice: if you want to be taken seriously by any kind of reasonable person who isn't a complete asshole, and not demonstrate that you're exactly the kind of vitriolic and vacuous 'critic' he's talking about, don't say these kinds of things. I'd address the rest of your post if you hadn't already shown that anything you say on the matter's completely worthless.

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  • She's a bitch because she stole from the people who watch her videos, producing the same shit she did before instead of increasing the production value of her videos, like she said she would. and disregarding my whole argument because of one bad word? ok, who's worthless again? the one who put out an actual argument? or the one who says "Your opinion doesn't matter because you swore!"

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  • Lol, it's not because you swore.

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  • Lolk, I'm going to go by your logic and disregard anything you say because you disagree with me.

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  • Again, that's not why, but, of course, I don't really care because you're not somebody whose opinion I happen to care about, as has been previously established.

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  • Edited by Seggi: 8/5/2013 1:05:07 AM
    Removed for S7 rule violation.

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  • I'm been beginning to think that people like you are actually feminists who call women ''bitches'' in order to help us know why feminism is necessary. In that case, thanks for your service.

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