JavaScript is required to use Bungie.net

Forums

6/18/2013 4:37:36 AM
20
Because it is taking advantage of children who are unable to make smart decisions due to their undeveloped minds. It's much like a genius asking you to complete a mathematical equation that you aren't able to understand, and then forcing you to write what they tell you. You don't know any better, so you just have to listen to them, even if what you are writing down is wrong by mathematical standards.
English

Posting in language:

 

Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

  • And before you tell me I don't know the difference between Child Molesters and Pedophiles: Pedophilia is what we call the mindset of the adults. Child molestation is just the actions that take place after. You cannot have one without the other. In fact, I have no doubt in my mind that people would gladly accept Pedophilia if it weren't for the fact that there is no way to integrate this sort of sexual attraction without allowing the physical side taking place. One really cannot exist without the other, therefore they are almost completely dependent on one another. There is only a difference in definition, but in practice, they are directly correlated.

    Posting in language:

     

    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

  • It's just an attraction. It doesn't hurt anyone if someone just has an attraction. One can exist without the other. You are just generalizing and using fancy ass words to cover it up.

    Posting in language:

     

    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

  • No, I'm not. You can't allow the attraction without them wanting to make it a reality. In fact, that's what we have nowadays. They cultivate the attraction, and then it becomes too much, so they force it into reality. That's when you have the molestation. Those were fancy words? Wow, you need to go to highschool dude, I don't think I used a word with any more than five syllables. If that was too difficult for you to understand, then perhaps you aren't ready for this sort of discussion....

    Posting in language:

     

    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

  • Just because someone has an attraction does not mean they want it to be a reality. Many people are ashamed of their attractions and don't want them. Just because someone fantasized about something does not mean they want it to happen.

    Posting in language:

     

    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

  • But remember that Child Molestation thing I mentioned? That came about because there were pedophiles that wanted the attraction to become a reality. The attraction is much like between a man and a women. You are so hardwired to make it a reality, because to you it is supposed to happen, so you take the steps needed to cultivate a relationship between a man and a woman, or a man and a man, or a woman and a woman. Same thing with pedophiles, they see the attraction as natural, and so they wish to also act upon their feelings. They will almost always make the attraction a reality.

    Posting in language:

     

    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

  • 0
    I'm just going to say that I personally don't force or trick women I find attractive to have sex with me, or even have it as a primary motive when around attractive women. Maybe I'm just a freak and most people have no control over their impulses even if they recognize they're actions as wrong.

    Posting in language:

     

    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

  • I'm not saying that someone would trick a woman into having sex. I mean they just do what they think is normal in getting into a relationship, such as buying dinner on dates, holding doors open, speaking kindly and such. That sort of thing.

    Posting in language:

     

    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

  • 0
    My point is that it's not exactly easy to do those kind of things with a child, a pedophile can't really make their attraction reality without force or coercion. To be a child molester someone has to both be a pedophile AND have no moral qualms with those kind of actions.

    Posting in language:

     

    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

  • That's the thing though. If Jonny is attracted to a woman, he finds this natural and organic. He truly believes there is nothing wrong with this attraction. Bobby has an attraction to a child, and he finds this natural and organic. He truly believes there is nothing wrong with this attraction. They both have attractions, and both believe these are normal feelings. They will both have a hard time being told that the attraction is unnatural, and both disagree that what they feel is wrong. Does that make sense?

    Posting in language:

     

    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

  • Edited by God: 6/18/2013 5:42:09 PM
    0
    [quote]Bobby has an attraction to a child, and he finds this natural and organic.[/quote] Well, in all honesty, it is. Any attraction is 'natural' unless it is the product of brainwashing of some kind, and people can't control what stimuli arouses or repulses them. The problem is with acting on impulses without think it through... [quote]He truly believes there is nothing wrong with this attraction.[/quote] Do you really think that this is the case for anyone who holds an attraction? Tell that to all the gay people who go to great lengths to suppress their feelings or even kill themselves over it, even though there isn't actually anything objectively wrong with it. You're suggesting that they can't self-reflect or have self control. Sure someone who really does think this is dangerous, but just having an attraction doesn't implicate such a belief.

    Posting in language:

     

    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

  • There is physiological evidence that homosexuality is caused by a cluster on the male hypothalamus. This attraction has a natural causation, and does not have a level of exploitation that is found in pedophilia. Pedophiles justify their actions as natural, neglecting to take note of their exploitation of the child at hand. The child is unable to make the right decision due to the undeveloped nature of their brain. That's what this is all about. The pedophile has an attraction to a child, but the child would never be able to make the right choice because they are still undeveloped. [quote][b]Posted By:[/b] God Well, in all honesty, it is. Any attraction is 'natural' unless it is the product of brainwashing of some kind, and people can't control what stimuli arouses or repulses them. The problem is with acting on impulses without think it through... [/quote] While what they feel is in fact a natural part of their mind, it is an unnatural alteration of the genetics of humans. This sort of attraction is considered a mental disorder, with plenty of pedophiles seeking medical attention from the appropriate medical practitioners. And you're right, the problem is when they don't think through the results of their actions, and there is in fact statics showing that a majority of pedophiles are unable to take control of their urges. [quote]Pedophiles molest 88 percent of our children who are molested. They commit 95 percent of the acts. This is a serious disorder.[/quote] [url]http://www.childmolestationprevention.org/pages/focus_on_the_cause.html[/url] My stance on the situation is there needs to be an acceptance of the mental disorder, so that those who have it can feel comfortable seeking out the appropriate medical attention they need, as well as research can be done to help produce treatments that truly help those with the disorder.

    Posting in language:

     

    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

  • Edited by God: 6/18/2013 6:18:59 PM
    0
    [quote]My stance on the situation is there needs to be an acceptance of the mental disorder, so that those who have it can feel comfortable seeking out the appropriate medical attention they need, as well as research can be done to help produce treatments that truly help those with the disorder.[/quote] This is, word for word, the exact same opinion I have. I'm only calling out the part where you say [quote]all pedophiles justify their actions as natural[/quote] Yes, someone who does justify their actions like that is dangerous, just like how murderers and other criminals justify their crimes. But that is an additional, separate disorder from the attraction. Using killing for example, a lot of people feel hate towards certain people, or enjoy violence in their movies or videogames. But there is a huge step between fantasizing about killing a person, and actually committing murder. Of course pedophiles commit most of the molestation, just like how murderers do most of the killing, but how many people who have those kind of thoughts or fantasies, or indulge in media that involves them, actually go on to act them out?

    Posting in language:

     

    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

  • [quote][b]Posted By:[/b] God How many people who have those kind of thoughts or fantasies, or indulge in media that involves them, actually go on to act them out?[/quote] That's tough to answer without any data on the subject. I would say that the problem is simply this: A pedophile seeks out ways to fulfill their desires, be it with CP, fantasization (not a real word I don't think) or what have you. This gives them positive reinforcement for their desires, and is a negative treatment to the problem. The attraction needs to be eradicated so that those with the disorder aren't closer and closer to performing an action against a child. The pedophilia isn't just limited to Child Molestation, it also causes CP, which in turn fuels the attraction. Fuel for this machine will only cause it to take action. [quote]But that is an additional, separate disorder from the attraction.[/quote] You're right though, they are different for the most part. But I believe that it is much like the HIV/AIDs, wherein a pedophile has the attraction, and it only takes time with positive reinforcement of the desire before they fall deep into their lust for the actions.

    Posting in language:

     

    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

  • Edited by God: 6/18/2013 6:53:40 PM
    1
    Yeah, we can hypothesize about the causes and what effect reinforcement has, but there simply have not been many substantial objective studies on the subject, particularly around CP (studies on that are conflicting, some say it provides reinforcement that encourages the acts, others say that since there is no cure for the disorder it provides an outlet, and evidence seems to go both ways). Another thing that just occurred to me is that we seem to be going by different definitions as well. Part of why it's so hard to discuss it seriously is that the definitions are different depending on the field. In law enforcement it refers just to child molesters, in psychiatry (the DSM) it's a strong primary attraction or impulse, in psychology and common use it refers to any sexual interest in children. I'm going by the common use, you're going by the DSM definition, in the context of which you have been correct. Overall I really want to stop discussing this since this is a video game developers site.

    Posting in language:

     

    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

  • They are not monsters that you can just analyze and generalize. They are normal people like you and me who were unfortunate enough to be attracted to children. It's not a sexual orientation. It's an attraction. Foot fetish is an attraction but it's not natural.

    Posting in language:

     

    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

  • 0
    Chakas it's no use. The world isn't ready to put aside their gut reactions and social stigmas for the sake of scientific knowledge.

    Posting in language:

     

    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

  • They aren't monsters, but they are human, and we can analyze the living hell out of humans. We can make scientific decisions based on data. If you wish to discredit me at this point, you are discrediting the entirety of the scientific method.

    Posting in language:

     

    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

  • I'm not discrediting anything. You haven't given me any data other than what you pulled out of your ass when you generalized countless people. If what you said was true, we would have a lot more -blam!- in this world.

    Posting in language:

     

    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

  • [quote]Pedophiles molest 88 percent of our children who are molested. They commit 95 percent of the acts. This is a serious disorder.[/quote] Source: [url]http://www.childmolestationprevention.org/pages/focus_on_the_cause.html[/url] [quote]According to the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM), it is a paraphilia in which adults or adolescents 16 years of age or older have intense and recurrent sexual urges towards and fantasies about prepubescent children that they have either acted on or which cause them distress or interpersonal difficulty. [/quote] Source: Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders DSM-IV TR (Text Revision)

    Posting in language:

     

    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

  • [quote] Pedophiles molest 88 percent of our children who are molested. They commit 95 percent of the acts. This is a serious disorder.[/quote] Well no shit Sherlock. Who else would be doing the molesting? This says nothing. All it talks about are the pedophiles who have acted on their urges and not the ones who haven't. [quote]According to the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM), it is a paraphilia in which adults or adolescents 16 years of age or older have intense and recurrent sexual urges towards and fantasies about prepubescent children that they have either acted on or which cause them distress or interpersonal difficulty.[/quote] Why did you even post this?

    Posting in language:

     

    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

You are not allowed to view this content.
;
preload icon
preload icon
preload icon