[b]I am NOT an employee of Bungie nor one of Microsoft, and my views and opinions do not necessarily reflect those of either of the aforementioned entities.
Also, thanks for sticking this Bungie, I hope it is useful.[/b]
There is one caveat to consider before we get under weigh. Bungie is not likely, nor or ever, to release the true inner workings of the Halo 3 ranking system, but as it is based somewhat on the Microsoft Trueskill system, this is a fair approximation of the way skill ranking works in Halo 3.
[quote][i][b]What is the Trueskill system?[/b][/i][/quote]
The Trueskill system is a player skill rating system for Xbox Live. Halo 3 uses a version of the Trueskill system in order to make the matches fairly even.
[quote][i][b]How Does Trueskill Work?[/b][/i][/quote]
Trueskill assigns skills on a normal distribution (bell curve, Gaussian). The Trueskill system has two main variables to consider. They are your player skill level ([b]Mu[/b]) and your uncertainty factor ([b]Sigma[/b]).
[b]Mu[/b] is an approximation of your skill level based upon past performance. Win games to raise Mu, and lose games to lower Mu.
[b]Sigma[/b] is the numerical representation of the range in which your [i]true[/i] skill could lie. Play really consistently, and you have a low Sigma. Play streakily, and you have a higher Sigma.
After a win, the Trueskill system adjusts your skill ranking based upon the Mu and Sigma of all the players in the game. We'll go deeper into [i]how much[/i] it is adjusted later.
Trueskill systems use a conservative ranking [b]Ranking = mu - (K * Sigma)[/b] so your skill is likely to be higher than the actual number represented in your Halo 3 highest skill level. K is a constant assigned an arbitrary value by the developers of the game.
[quote][i][b]Why don't I level up after winning X games in a row? / Why does my friend go up three levels a game and I don't?[/b][/i][/quote]
Mu increases after a win. Always. [b]The increase is proportional to the winner's Sigma and the Mu difference between the winner and the loser.[/b] So, if your Sigma is high, you will proceed faster through the ranking system (in BOTH directions). If your Sigma is low, you will both gain and lose rank more slowly.
[quote][i][b]So, I want a high Sigma value?[/b][/i][/quote]
While it sounds as though a high Sigma value is desirable, it CAN be a double edged sword. A high Sigma can mean you increase by one level for every win. It also means you decrease by one level for every loss. In addition, a high Sigma means that your skill ranking will be significantly lower than your actual skill owing to the conservative nature of the [b]Ranking = mu - (K * Sigma)[/b] ranking equation.
Also, Sigma value starts out VERY high. So, if this is your friend's first time in a particular ranked hopper, and he wins consistently, his rank will rise meteorically due to his high Sigma.
[quote][i][b]Myth Busting[/b][/i][/quote]
Trueskill DOES NOT take into evaluation performances inside the game. The ONLY statistics that Trueskill takes from a game are the Mu and Sigma values of all the players, and how you placed.
This means that out of all of these statistics:
Getting the MVP
Having a High K/D ratio
Getting the most medals
Skill levels of those you killed / killed you
Weapons you used
Headshots
Captures, detonations, stops, ousts, etc.
NONE of them matter when calculating the Mu increase/decrease. Any link between any of these and the skill ratings are purely correlative and not causative.
For example. When I play Team Slayer with my buddies on my alternate gamertag, much of the time I end up carrying the team. I created this tag to play with my buddies, and as such, have only ever played on that party with that tag. I ranked up to the level of my friends within 20 or so games, while it had taken them 50 to 100 games to reach their level. My friends thought that it was because of my frequent MVP status and my high K/D ratio that I leveled up so fast.
Wrong. I leveled up fast because [b]A)[/b] I initially had a very high Sigma, making my Mu more variable after each win, [b]B)[/b] Starting out at a 1 and playing people in the mid teens gave me a considerable boost every time I won, and [b]C)[/b] We won more frequently than they had in the past.
[quote][i][b]Summation[/b][/i][/quote]
If you're worried that you're not getting your fair shake in the ranking system, look at the last 50 games that you've played in that hopper. (If you haven't played 50 games, play more. The system needs more data.)
Take your win/loss average. If it's 65% or above, and you've been in that playlist for a while, you've probably increased in level 2 or more times over the last 50 games (or you will in the next 20 or so). Otherwise you are going to be hovering around the same level or dropping in rank.
[quote][i][b]Addendum, Opinion, and Technical Notes[/b][/i][/quote]
In strict Trueskill systems, Sigma only decreases. I believe the "momentum" system in Halo 3 means that Sigma can be increased through consistent winning or losing. This is total conjecture, but I think that Sigma in Halo 3 matchmaking hoppers is proportional to the absolute value of the win/loss ratio of your last X number of games. The formula probably looks a little like: [b]Sigma = C ( | wins - losses | )[/b] where C is an arbitrary constant. This would explain why when some people go on a win streak with two or more different parties, their skill goes up faster than their teammates' skill.
I also believe that the system is weighted so that the peak of the normal distribution is around level 20, not level 25. That means it will take more wins to level through 1-25 than it will 25-50. Which makes a bit of sense, if you don't want the highest levels too terribly crowded.
[b]The higher the Sigma of your opponents, the less Mu you gain from beating them.[/b]
Predictable outcomes (e.g. win against a lower ranked opponent) are treated as statistically less significant. Upsets are given more weight. So, winning against lower ranked opponents doesn't do much for your Mu rating. Neither does losing against higher ranked ones. But beat a team that's 6 or more ranks above you and at least someone on your team will rank up.
Trueskill ratings have no discernable correlation from hopper to hopper. When you play on a hopper you've never played on before, you are starting with a fresh Mu and a high Sigma.
Team Mu and Team Sigma are the summation of the Mu and Sigma values of all the players on the team. When calculating the skill of an opponent in a team game, the system uses the Team Mu and Team Sigma values in calculation wherever rational.
*Removed equations for space. They can be found in the link below.*
[url=http://research.microsoft.com/mlp/apg/Details.aspx#How_to_Update_Skills]The rest of the equations and a less Halo 3 centric analysis of the Trueskill system can be found here.[/url]
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[b]Important additions, Appendices, and Member Questions Answered[/b]
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[url=http://www.bungie.net/Forums/posts.aspx?postID=14457003]In-depth response to a post LoveNub made later in this thread. Should clear things up for some.[/url]
[url=http://www.bungie.net/Forums/createpost.aspx?postID=14504550]More data analyzed, and a request for help with research[/url]
[url=http://www.bungie.net/Forums/posts.aspx?postID=14451163&postRepeater1-p=4#14471689]Kudos to Jay120171 for finding the post detailing the Mixed Party Bug in matchmaking.[/url]
[quote][i][b]"Why do I win 10 games and not level up, then delevel when I lose 2? Help!"[/b][/i][/quote]
There are several possible explanations for this. The easiest one, and the one that fits the Trueskill system EXACTLY as explained by Microsoft, is that losing against a team that is X (I believe 6 or more, but experimentation is needed to determine the true value) skill points below you can cause you to lose as much as [b]5 times[/b] the Mu value that winning against even level teams gains you. Of course, winning against a team that has X [i]more[/i] skill levels than you can net you as much as 5 times the Mu gain. The reverse is true as well. Winning against a weak team can count as little as 1/5th of an even skill win.
Second, and this is enlightened conjecture, your Sigma value was low at the beginning of your streak, and since your win streak is raising it, the conservative ranking system (Remember, Rank = Mu MINUS (K times Sigma)) is kicking in to reduce your apparent skill level. Your real Mu is higher, but your higher Sigma is having a negative impact.
[quote][b]mo0vaf00 writes:[/b] (edited to clarify intent)
So is there some kind of value that requires you to be inconsistent to rank up? If I win 1 game going even and win the next going +10 do I have more of a chance of ranking up than just winning 2 games getting the same score?[/quote]
This conclusion is popping up fairly frequently. The answer is no. The system does not look at "In Match" statistics. At all. These stats are all included in a list above. The game only looks at your wins and your losses, and the strength of the opponents you play against.
Also, the system does not "reward" you for having a high Sigma value. There is ONE positive associated with high Sigma, and there are TWO negatives.
Positive: Your level can move up faster through winning.
Negative: Your level can move down faster through losing.
Negative: The conservative ranking system ranks you lower when your Sigma is higher.
Higher Sigma simply means your level is more fluid. Sigma is good to have high when you are still reaching your appropriate skill level, but good to have low once you've reached it and are working on improving.
[Edited on 11.24.2007 11:54 PM PST]
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i have the same problem, nd mutoid log's rite, bungies a game behind, dnt worry though it wont affect anything, whatever exp you have on you service record when you check it on your 360 is you exp, no less (its also late in changing armor) [Edited on 02.23.2010 6:42 PM PST]
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thnaks, man, awesome post, i was having alot of trouble figuring out how it worked, but knowing it was on a curve w/ uncertainty instead of a more straitforward system pretty much covered it for me...thnak you stats in math b! and thank you poster who no longer exists!
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Bungie.net is always 1 game behind. At least when it comes to exp. As for your levels, that's a known issue. Try playing some games alone, the party up again.
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Hello everyone. Okay, so my friends and I have won 50 out of 52 games, we have 50 exp. On here, it says we have 49 exp. You can add me, and look at my service record there, it's 50 exp out of 52 ranked matches. That's issue number one. Issue number two, We've won 50 games out of 52, and we're level 10 in team slayer. Explanation please?
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well i read the whole thing and i have to say that i honestly believe you because halo 3 was the first game i had and when i first stated playing on the ranked system,i immediately ranked up because i never lost a game.thanx for the new insight.
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thank you for this, i am one of the "complainers" about this stuff, thank you for finally shedding some light on this subject.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] HLR BENDERBALL My problem is the complete opposite, I keep losing but keep ranking up. Really starting to piss me off. In the last 25 games I am lucky to have placed 4th in 5 games, the remaining are 5th or 6th. I am ranked 10th now, since this losing streak I started ranked 6th. I either get in rooms where I am the lowest rank, or, in a rooms with sandbaggers (ie ranked 2-4)and they just clean the room. The worst of it is that I can't get more than 5 kills and just keep getting my ass handed to me, no fun. [/quote]That's caused by the fact that you don't actually start at 1, you start at 25. You are ranking down, but your sigma is dropping. High sigma is what makes your higher rank look lower. You'll just have to take the losses until your rank gets low enough.
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My problem is the complete opposite, I keep losing but keep ranking up. Really starting to piss me off. In the last 25 games I am lucky to have placed 4th in 5 games, the remaining are 5th or 6th. I am ranked 10th now, since this losing streak I started ranked 6th. I either get in rooms where I am the lowest rank, or, in a rooms with sandbaggers (ie ranked 2-4)and they just clean the room. The worst of it is that I can't get more than 5 kills and just keep getting my ass handed to me, no fun.
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SWEET!! i can annoy my friend EVEN more now XD
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OY SOOME ONE HELP ME I HAVE REACHED THE SARGENT RANK BUT HAVE NOT RECEIVED THE MARK V ARMOR IF ANY ONE KNOWS HOW TO FIX THIS PLZ TELL ME BY SENDING ME AN EMAIL AT WAZ9898@HOTMAIL.COM
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Blahhh. Halo 3 rankings are so frustrating. Ok, so I'm currently level 25 ts. I have played close to 70 games, lost 10, 5 in ts. Was in a party of three with one guy being the same stats as me almost, and a level 19 with 87 games with 3 losses. We easily won 20 games and lost 1. Within the first five games, the guy got to 20, but then we lost 1 game and he dropped to 19. We won more than 10 games after that, yet no one leveled up. Why is this? I mean we don't have very many games, yet we seem to be level locked at such a low level.
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Very informative, it's interesting because I never realized how much TrueSkill uses relevant probability rules. I'm in a college level statistics class and it's cool how we've learned about the Normal curve with mean (Mu) and Standard deviation (Sigma), and how it relates to this system. If only only the Mu and Sigma values were known of everyone in every game you played...I'm sure the ranking system would be much more predictable. Great Job!
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This system does indeed bite. However, it's a lot better than Call of Duty's kill = rank system. That just sucks.. Looking at this thread, I love how back when Halo 3 first came out, there weren't so many trolls and crap to ruin people's forum fun. Hoepfully the system will be better in Reach.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Whitepaws QC for example. If i derank my SWAT skill and that i have less exp, is it going to raise my sigma??? Cuz im stucked at level 43-44 in TS.[/quote]If you're stuck due to low sigma, deranking is the last thing you should do. No, it does not raise your sigma.
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I hate this system. I'm 98-1 in LW and I'm only a 35. Hell, i only lost my first game on my 97th match, and i went down too! High sigma + insane win streak = NO LEVEL FOR YOU
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for example. If i derank my SWAT skill and that i have less exp, is it going to raise my sigma??? Cuz im stucked at level 43-44 in TS.
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Thank you so much. This was a good read and helped me understand the system ALOT. I was jus about to post a topic asking about the system but saw this in the hot topics...very good read!
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I have a question: should I use the preference for a match with people around the same skill level as me, or should I just use the quickest preference before starting matchmaking?
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Thank you very much.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] I ToOxClutcH I Excellent. Very impressed with this thread. This clears up so many of my questions about the ranking system. I had a few questions that I would like someone to clear up for me.your 1) Does having a lower amount of experience have anything to do with your mu and sigma rating? 2) And does playing in a party with people who have new accounts affect how your mu and sigma are affected by a win or a loss? If someone could clear those up for me it would be great. Thanks again for the amazing thread.[/quote]1. No 2. Accounts with no games in the playlist have high sigma, which slows all others down.
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Excellent thread. On a scale of 1-10 I give it a 20. This thread should be recommended to everyone who wonders how the true skill system really works. Good job.
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That has happened to me a few times. It always happened after I quit out of a game. I might have just been that you quit out of a game and started a new one before the game had time to recalculate your rank after the quit.
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Excellent. Very impressed with this thread. This clears up so many of my questions about the ranking system. I had a few questions that I would like someone to clear up for me.your 1) Does having a lower amount of experience have anything to do with your mu and sigma rating? 2) And does playing in a party with people who have new accounts affect how your mu and sigma are affected by a win or a loss? If someone could clear those up for me it would be great. Thanks again for the amazing thread.
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i know it helped me out loads great post CH33RS
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hay can u help me with recon thx andyjam1478