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originally posted in: Bungie you need to watch this.
12/14/2020 6:41:32 PM
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1. What's "broken" in the Crucible experience is the shotgun marriage of a competitive shooter with a loot-based RPG...using the tools and abilities of that loot-based RPG. 2 They 'broke both legs on the landing", because people SAY they want balance, when what they really want is advantage for their own play style. 3. CBMM is not a casual experience for the average player....and he keeps presenting a false choice to justify it. The map problems are the result of playing 6v6 on maps designed for 4v4. That's the reason why the old maps were removed. So that they could be reworked to work better for 6v6. 4. The Crucible player base isn't large enough to support 9 full time playlists....and Competitive especially can't support 5 full time playlists. 5. I stopped watching at 12:37, because he still hasn't addressed the elephant in the living room and the ROOT cause of why this marriage between a competitive shooter and a loot game is NOT working. LOOT....and POWER. What is "competitive" to shooter gamers is a game where there is a FLAT or "balanced" sandbox. Where one build isn't more "efficient" than another....so SKILL becomes what determines the outcome of fights. Whereas what makes loot compelling in a loot game or RPG iS POWER. The item does something cool and powerful that nothing else does. But once you let IN that factor, you've now created power-progression....power-inequality...and PVP becoming a blend of skill and BUILD-STRENGTH. So you can't introduce compelling loot....without destroying balance (and having the rich-get richer which REALLY destroys balance) ...... ...and you can't balance the game without destroying any sense of why anyone would chase after loot (or play the game for any reason other than simply enjoyign shooting other players in the face ) THIS is why vanilla Destiny 2 was such a disaster. ...and that still doesn't get to the issues created by the inability to monetize PVP content....and the inability to monetize cosmetics because of resentment and pushback from the PVE side of the game. TLDR: The creator has good ideas...but the problems is that none of the ones I've heard by 12:37 address any of the Crucible's REAL problems. They are akin to remodeling a house that is built on a cracked and crumbling fourndation. As I was discussing with another forum member today, Crucible doesn't need a new coat of paint and new playlists. IT NEEDS TO HAVE WHAT IS CONSIDERED PVP IN THIS GAME COMPLETELY RE-ENVISIONED. ...and I don't think that will happen for the same reason why what this content creator is suggesting won't work: You have a shooter gamer player base that is UNWILLING to accept a game where build-strength plays a role in who wins fights. ...and that is the only sustainable form of PVP that you can build off a foundation that is a LOOT game.
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  • Kelly took one too many shotguns today and now this is what the world gets. Broski I love you but it's a gun and it's EA sports. It's in the game.

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  • I’ve never had a problem with shotguns. And this game has suffered from the same unfixed problems and issue in pvp now for six years. The issue is that what the creator is suggesting is a band-aid on a cancer.

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  • I'm sorry bruh but no disrespect, How that astral horizon taste

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  • Edited by RavenousLD3341: 12/14/2020 9:39:45 PM
    The general work around I've proposed for this is to have PvP only weapons. So it kinda takes care of a few things. The developers focusing on a small set of weapons/armor that are only allowed for PvP gets the independent sandbox everyone has always wanted. It'll stream line balancing, because they only have to focus on a small set of wepaons. Which will also all the PvE game to literally go wild. Eververse could still be the main storefront for all of their consmetics, just add a PvP page. These weapons could have a set of PvP only perks. It'll give the PvPers something to hunt down and acquire though PvP only, that's only for PvP. The only downside is... it will likely drastically reduce their weapon pool, they will basically need at least 2 of every weapon type... for every slot. Same with armor. To compensate for the reduced weapon pool, they will need something interesting. Not sure what they will need to make this adjustment compelling, but it will have to be something to show off their dominance in the mode, or at least reflect the time they put in.

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  • Good idea. But I feel that If Bungie [i]could seperate [/i] the sandboxes without a complete rebuild of the game, they would have by now. I just don’t think they can do it, and won’t own up to the fact they can’t.

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  • [quote]2 They 'broke both legs on the landing", because people SAY they want balance, when what they really want is advantage for their own play style.[/quote] THIS, right here boys!! I've been saying this for years. These players screaming for "balance", is code for, "I want an advantage."

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  • Well you kind of invalidated your whole post by mentioning shotguns in your first sentence. Everyone can equip a shotgun. People love to complain about shotguns being op on the forums then they walk into crucible with one equipped and still drop a 0.8 kd.

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  • I’ve never said that shotguns were problem In this game...

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  • I can’t read

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  • I have days like that too.

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  • Remember folks, if it isn't Kelly, it isn't right.

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  • The thing is that the sandbox is currently balanced outside of the stasis subclasses.

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  • And the result is that Warlocks got left with only two viable subclasses. You can balance the sandbox. You just can’t do it without [i]breaking[/i] the pve side of the game. Vanilla D2 was very balanced. It was just boring as hell to play. Rewarded only one play style, and destroyed Destiny as a loot game and a power-fantasy game.

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