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8/14/2019 4:27:30 PM
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Power creep is real. And when it starts to affect how content is designed, it needs to be dealt with. Try to raid on LFG running any other build besides Well of Radiance and Lunafaction boots. You’ll either be kicked or told to switch.
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  • Then you start your own team instead. Maybe list “No Wellocks” as a condition.

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  • I don’t mind running Well. I play support roles in other games. But you have to be blind to not see that it’s become the best solution to all raid boss fights. Mainly because of repetitive design. Partly due to how strong team damage buffs are compared to dealing damage directly with our abilities. Well needs a nerf. Our other abilities buffed, and Bungie needs to be more creative.

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  • Let me be clear, I don’t Raid. Never found a group I liked enough to spend that much time with and the only couple of Raids I ever tried were mind numbingly boring anyway. I’m only responding to your assertion that you are forced to run Well or no one will let you join their group. Any time anyone points out how inaccessible Raiding is for inexperienced Raiders because no groups have the patience to teach the Raids we’re told to form our own group if we don’t like the conditions set by groups who won’t allow us in. The same is true for Wellocks. I honestly doubt it’s as big a deal as everyone claims though because there was zero discussion of this topic until Datto decreed a change needed to be made and it happened. I haven’t seen you or anyone else call out this problem ever until after the fact and now it’s suddenly game breaking. I don’t buy it. This is like the myth that sbmm causes massive, game breaking lag. It’s a myth cooked up to justify changing the game to suit a small minority of elite players and everyone else appears to be bandwagon jumping.

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  • So what, and I'll gladly wear them every time.

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  • The issue in the game rn isn't power creep, it's the absence of hardmode raids. These nerfs make our equipment feel bad everywhere, and the ease of the endgame isn't related to power. I have never really felt like I was in danger in a raid once I hit the level cap PERIOD. And that's the real problem

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  • [quote]The issue in the game rn isn't power creep, it's the absence of hardmode raids.[/quote] Its both actually. The lack of hard mode raids is another design issue that is making our accumulations of power a problem. Another issue is the persistance of old raids. So people are continuing to run old raids and raid lairs LONG past their "use by" dates. Which means we're running everything but the current raid, in a state that is massively overleveled. The first time I ran Last Wish I was 735 power....and just STEAM ROLLED our way through it with the clan I used to raid with from D1.

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  • I don't agree that it is both. Guardians should feel powerful, and while I agree infinite supers and heavy can become too much, bungie has still not address the issue of their adds shooting marshmallows. There are currently 2 activities in while I feel genuinely threatened by the PvE activity. And that's 1 while running high score Nightfalls and 2 The Reckoning. Nightfall being the more threatening because the adds are so powerful that a Well won't always be enough to save you. For Reckoning well, you just get pushed off cliffs. I run by those bosses with my butt cheeks clinched half the time, except on blackout because you're just auto deleted. In short I don't care how much power we as guardians aquire. HOWEVER the power we aquire must be met by equal force by the Enemies we're pitted against

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  • I completely disagree. I think there should be more difference felt in our power level vs enemies in old locations. Enemies that were difficult to fight when we were level 200 should be downed with a bullet at 750. I’d actually be almost OK with raids and nightfalls leveling with you. But public places and frankly most PVE environments should stay with their initial power level. The idea that an enemy levels as you level is idiotic. That’s one of the RPG element that is grossly missing from this game.

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  • Dude what are you talking about? No one care about partol guy, I'm talking about the endgame. Read my comment first then reply

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  • “Power creep is real”... Unless it applies to PVP, then the calls for nerfs(in PVP) are from “babies” or “tryhards” who seek to destroy the experience for lesser skilled players. All behind the premise that Destiny is a loot based game where the “power fantasy” matters... when in fact, almost every weapon nerfed for the sake of PVP never had any significant influence over the PVE sandbox. YET NOW, when the largest, broad sweeping nerfs to PVE are taking place, you of all people are here defending them... ironic at best, confused most likely, disingenuous at worst.

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  • I hate luna faction so much they're so damn ugly

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  • What, you don't like toe boots?

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  • I don't like the socks either that do it. I'm a god damn space wizard not a teenage mutant ninja turtle

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  • If they made bosses that pushed us out of areas and actually moved around instead of being stationary where we can just dump damage on them this wouldn't be an issue ..

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  • That's kinda how raids were in d1 as well and there wasn't a problem there. Granted, bosses had the capability to move, they just normally wouldn't because they were getting constantly staggered.

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  • Our supers were also weaker in d1 .. Our abilities were better too and we had self res warlocks not that I consider that necessarily op but I'm sure you'll run across someone who brings that up .. Honestly I just think they dont know how to make a dynamic boss encounter .. It would be nice to have a fight that actually tests our skill in the game .. If the bosses attacked us and made us constantly have to reposition we wouldnt be using well as much as we have .. Im really hoping we get a real boss fight where the boss just doesnt sit still .. Maybe a boss fight where can eventually stagger or stun him/her where we could use well for 10 seconds before the boss pops back up .. Maybe a larger health pool .. These damage phases are stale in my opinion.. Im sure we could think up something as a community to help them give us a boss worth fighting that'll give us a sense of relief after beating the encounter and feeling accomplished because of the degree of difficulty

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  • Did you.... Did you just make my point for me?

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  • Did I ? Im not sure lol

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  • The design of raids is very similar in d2 to as it was in d1, yet people enjoyed d1 raids significantly more, I say that isn't because of encounter design and then you said our supers weren't as powerful in d1.... they're nerfing well, the most powerful pve super.

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  • Edited by LikwiD_SmOkE22: 8/15/2019 3:01:38 AM
    They lack creative boss encounters.. A boss sitting still is boring.. Therefore we resort to being boring as well by sitting still dumping damage to end the raid as fast as possible.. There's no sense of accomplishment for me .. And I love to raid whenever I can .. I just wish we could get a dynamic boss fight where sitting still in a well isnt the best option .. Nerfing it doesn't do anything other than making an encounter like in cos to be more annoying .. I just dont know why nobody asks them why they can't make aggressive engaging raid bosses.. Is it fun for you killing a stationary boss?

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  • Edited by Lord Kielron: 8/14/2019 6:41:28 PM
    Honestly don’t think we are at that point, Kelly. Where we are at is a fundamental design flaw that dates back. Bosses that are stationary crit targets. It was the same in D1 for most raid bosses, and it’s literally the design of almost every raid boss in existence in this game. Survive, do mechanic, gather up in one spot and shoot the boss w your heavy, repeat. If bosses had more variety, Whisper would have been a non-issue to have received a nerf in the first place, and Luna-Well would have been a non-factor. This problem isn’t on well. It’s on their design philosophies. Nerfing well will not solve the problem. It’ll just prolong DPS phases to take an additional round or 2. We had similar issues with bubble in D1. As far as I remember not one of these streamers thought it was an issue (esp Datto, who mains a fn Titan). So why is this suddenly a problem? Until they fix their design philosophies with boss fights we can’t ever have anything nice. Sad And this is supposedly being classified as an RPG now?

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  • [quote]Honestly don’t think we are at that point, Kelly. Where we are at is a fundamental design flaw that dates back. Bosses that are stationary crit targets. It was the same in D1 for most raid bosses, and it’s literally the design of almost every raid boss in existence in this game. Survive, do mechanic, gather up in one spot and shoot the boss w your heavy, repeat. If bosses had more variety, Whisper would have been a non-issue to have received a nerf in the first place, and Luna-Well would have been a non-factor. This problem isn’t on well. It’s on their design philosophies. Nerfing well will not solve the problem. It’ll just prolong DPS phases to take an additional round or 2. We had similar issues with bubble in D1. As far as I remember not one of these streamers thought it was an issue (esp Datto, who mains a fn Titan). So why is this suddenly a problem? Until they fix their design philosophies with boss fights we can’t ever have anything nice. Sad And this is supposedly being classified as an RPG now?[/quote] Bubble wasn't nearly as bad as well, you still had to reload and travel in and out of the bubble and the weapons buff didn't last as long as well does

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  • Not to mention the nature of bubble lead to possible suicides when using explosions

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  • Edited by Lord Kielron: 8/14/2019 10:45:12 PM
    I mean people blow themselves up on the well sword, or strafing teammates, so that’s not saying much, lol

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  • We had similar issues with bubble in D1. As far as I remember not one of these streamers thought it was an issue (esp Datto, who mains a fn Titan). So why is this suddenly a problem? yup.

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