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originally posted in: I am Confusion by the term "Crutch"
5/4/2017 5:46:51 PM
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Some good definitions here. I agree with Supreme Butthurt, Kone19ps, and Riv3rMon5ters for the most part. For weapons I also like to think of it where the mechanics behind how the weapon works is what's really doing the work for you. Think of how flinch was in Y2. It actually re-centered back on your target so all you had to do was wait for that to happen and you had your accuracy again. When flinch was increased all the people that relied on that mechanic lost their minds while really skilled snipers were mostly unaffected. The poor flinch was a crutch. Think of the real word. It's something that helps you move when you have a leg injury. Without it you would be less effective.
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  • That would imply was physically incapable raher than just bad. There is no such thing as a crutch in games. Only what suits peoples playstyles

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  • No it actually wouldn't because we're not talking about someone without actual thumbs. That was just a reference. Jeez [quote]There is no such thing as a crutch in games. Only what suits peoples playstyles[/quote] That's quite an naive statement. In general terms here are absolutely things that 'enable' people to be better players than they really are and without those things they would be bad players. Don't be Naive.

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  • If something suited you more, wouldn't you use it? I dont specialize in sniping, but im very good at agressive play, does this make agressive weaponry my crutch when perform very well with them? Considering i can do things without those weapons but those weapons suit me, that is not a crutch. A crutch would be a trigger bot, aim bot, etc

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  • [quote]If something suited you more, wouldn't you use it?[/quote] Irrelevant if it was determined that what made it effective wasn't skill. Again I go back to flinch. Flinch was so poor and negligible that it used to literally re-center by itself. This is the example of the game doing all the work and less skilled people benefiting from it. When flinch was increased all those people lost their minds while the truly skilled snipers were mostly unaffected. The less skilled people were using it as a crutch to get kills. This is just 1 example that actually happened but the scenario can fit anything. [quote]I dont specialize in sniping, but im very good at agressive play, does this make agressive weaponry my crutch when perform very well with them?[/quote] No. You're not really grasping what I"m saying. In this scenario it would only apply say if the Auto-Assist was so abnormally high that when you were shooting the game was doing the work and not you. [quote]A crutch would be a trigger bot, aim bot, etc[/quote] No those are cheats/exploits. A crutch is a way sure but not what I'm talking about.

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  • Flinch is the opposite of crutch. Its literally a countermeasure, when it was increased, it created a scenario where snipers can only be used by people who are the best at fighting that. Aim assist isint a crutch, its literally what makes a console shooter possible

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  • OMG. You're missing my point entirely. It's not about WHAT flinch is, it's about what it was doing to artificially help snipers at the time. Same with AA. If it's doing TOO MUCH of the work for you then it's a crutch. I can literally see that I can't have this conversation with you. We're clashing again. I can't do this with you today.

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  • I dont see how those are crutches. Thats what the weapons offer. Your opponent can use the same thing

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  • Forget it. You're still not understanding. I can't do this with you. I'm already getting a headache. You really truly do not understand where I come from and our conversations really do affect me physically. I literally cannot continue. You see it your way I see it mine. Fuking what ever.

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  • How is that a crutch? If someone literally can't aim, they would use an aim bot as a crutch.. If i was an agressive player, i would use a shotgun because thats how i play

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  • Edited by X-LoganX: 5/5/2017 5:41:13 PM
    BECAUSE THE GAME MECHANICS ARE DOING ALL THE WORK FOR THEM. GETTING THEM THE KILLS. WITHOUT IT THEY ARE INEFFECTIVE. THE FACT THAT THEY CAN'T AIM IS IRRELEVANT IF THE MECHANICS ARE GIVING THEM THE KILLS ANYWAY. DO YOU UNDERSTAND NOW!? If you don't get it then you never will. I'm not replying to this any more. Please go live in your world and I'll live in mine.

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  • Wow. So i dont matter? Im a member of the community too http://xboxdvr.com/gamer/Orpheus49/video/30483202 How can you look at a match like this and say....thats fine

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  • Stop doing that. Where did I say you don't matter? We simply don't understand each other in a way that makes us completely incompatible debaters. And what does this Vid have to do with crutching?

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  • It was intended for the other topic actually

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  • That's what I thought.

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  • How can you look at that. And say thats balance?

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  • I didn't watch the video for more than a minute on my phone.

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  • Thats really not fair if you tell your side and wont even pay attention to the other

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  • Calm the fuk down. I"m watching it now. Do you think I have on-demand unlimited time to watch vids? I'm at work FFS.

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  • Then you should have just said that, Why are you being so hostile? Calm down man. Im trying to ivite you to my experiments wih kone and kielron

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  • Because you are having emotional responses to me again and making assumptions that Im' ignoring you or something. OK So I watched the vid. What's the point you're trying to make with it?

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  • First off. You literally said you only watched it for a minute, what else is that supposed to mean? Second off, look at it there was literally 2 olayers not carring at least 1 meta weapon. Handcannons where everywhere icebreaker made several appearances, and even the shotguner switched to a sidearm as well. Yeah, thats not diversity

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  • [quote]First off. You literally said you only watched it for a minute, what else is that supposed to mean?[/quote] But did I say I wasn't going to watch the rest? No. You made an assumption instead is asking me if I was going to finish watching it. I'm not entitled to spell everything out for you. Ask don't assume. As for the rest, well all I can say that if this is your experience in your matches then I do feel for you. While the meta is there where I play it's not as apparent. I can't get too emotionally charged about it be cause it doesn't affect me in the same way it does you. Would I like to see variety in all modes and lobbies? Sure. Do I have all the answers? No. What I do know is bringing back Y1 anything is not the answer. Is Bungie looking to fix this at this point? Doubtful. My suggestion to you is to either live with it or find something else to do while we wait for what D2 is going to be. I know you love the game but if you're not happy with it and we're out of time for more changes then you have to choose what to do with it. So let me cross threads and ask you this? If everyone is using the meta is it a crutch? If the do 'fix' the meta and people cry about it (because they will) was it a crutch?

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  • How come i, scolded for my wording, but when you say something like that, its fine? Its not a crutch if you are using that hasent been destroyed. Its literally just using your most competitive option. Handcannons arent easy to use either, they need a very skilled hand to do well with. If i used an aim bot and a handcannon. Yes, im crutching As for that game itself. I purposely chose a meh performance on my part becuase i ask. What did you notice about that game?

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  • [quote]If i used an aim bot and a handcannon. Yes, im crutching[/quote] No your cheating. It's obvious you don't understand the concept. that' find but just admit it. As for the Vid. I noticed your meh performance for sure. I'm a Warlock main and it was pretty obvious. Your movement and Map awareness is great though. Everything else? I guess I just don't see it the way you do. I wasn't looking at it like "Hey there's lots of Handcannons, that suck for Variety." I'm looking at it like "Hey there's lots of Handcannons. I have to deal with lots of hand cannons. Moving on". I have to blatantly honest with you that I'm not concerned by it in the same way you are. Also the way this game is built with all the weapon choices and perk we're never going to have variety AND balance at the same time. In this scenario if everyone is using similarly performing weapons is it not inherently balanced?

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  • The probem is that, its pretty much impossible to win head to heads without any of the weapon. I listed. Thats not balanced, just because the opposition is on equal footing, does not mean the game is balanced. I showed that particular video, not olny for what it looks like to play in a meta lobby, but the fact that agressive tactics just dont work. The shoulder charge was extremely well timed. I wasent expecting him to rush me like that. Second time around. He didint even get a finder on me. But i didint make it back inbounds. This is the problem. I always used to play that agressively and i would play very well, now its like. You try to rush? You will get absolutely destroyed. Even when using the absolute nightmare of mobility, ionic blink, i still got shut down.

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