Hey man, i fully agree that its my job to try get better. And im never one to blame anyone but myself when killed in crucible. And i also respect that trials should be hard to achieve and that earning your way there should be a feat of skill. But heres why i think paid carries are bad for trials. As i said i know i need to get good, but im a realist. I will reach a brick wall eventually, and no amount of practice will ever make me competitive enough to consistently hang with top tier trials players. I need a learning curve of facing people at my level, then mid tier, then top tier and so on. If im consistently matched with players paid to play all weekend, and way out of my current skill level, theres no feasible way i can stay alive long enough to improve at anything. If top tier players have the incentive to keep playing all weekend for money, chances are i stand a greater chance of meeting nothing but stacked teams all weekend. No amount of getting good will ever put me in a position to compete. I dont see why people who have already gone flawless on all characters for the weekend cant then be moved into a seperate trials playlist for the remainder of the weekend, where they can all play each other. That way the top players can still run carrys and have a more elite challenge. And average players like me can try hone their skills and learn by actually competing and then hopefully moving into the elite playlist.

No one is asking it to be easy they just don't want it to be impossible, and currently for some it is impossible. Now before all the "git gud" starts happening unless you have a stacked team ( 2000+ ELO, above 2.kd) you might as well not play trials because unless you get extremely lucky your not going to go flawless , unless your playing for bounties and don't care about flawless . Trials lfg is the worst in order to get a team you have to either be casually doing bounties or have an insane ELO/KD and regardless of your skill 9 out of 10 times you make a bad play or a mistake you get booted and or your fireteam leaves ( what a kind community ) From what I can see there are only 2 problems with trials 1. A diminishing player pool leaving the majority of the trials population the sweatiest try hardiest players in the game ( hence why you get 5-0 on the first round in less than 5 min by a team on there 8th win ) 2. Matchmaking I honestly have no idea how you can fix this and make everyone happy win based Matchmaking creates bottlenecks, sbmm creates lag especially for the top 1% and cbmm let's the top 1 % pub stomp the lower 99% The only real fix I can think of is to greatly increase the influx of the casual pvp and pve player, with a much larger pool less often will you be matched with insanely good teams just my 2 cents

My issue with trials is I often hurt my stomach because I laugh so hard at all the whiny bitches that try to change the game mode because they're shit

The issue is skill some have it some don't that's life I'm unfortunately extremely average at pvp and have no shame admiting I've been carried to flawless (for free) lol

Typical elitist... muted

I think the main problem is the new generation. Most think they deserve to go flawless. We can only hope, as they grow, life will teach them you have to earn it and you don't get participation trophies. The problem is you and all these other players who aren't good enough to make it to the lighthouse every weekend and resort to complaining on this forum.

Reason I hate people who charge is one are you that ignorant go get a job amd.two.its not a guaranteed flawless so not worth it

I don't have an issue in trials, it's a mixed bowl, you have a chance to face great players, or unskilled players. These unskilled players need to learn how to use their weapons effectively to beat these skilled players, trials isn't static unlike the raids, not every activity is the same. Even the great players have a hard game time to time, even against unskilled players. ~[i]TheGreatNike[/i]

You should be able to go flawless after 3 losses still.

Why not.. Lets counter his poor argument. SBMM is bad because it often places you in laggy matches simply because the opponent needs to be on a winning roll, like you. And not happy with this, often you will play the same laggy team twice in a row meaning you not only lost your mercy, but your flawless because you are being shot through walls or the enemy is eating all your bullets and asking for desert. So, SBMM, definately bad. Paid carries are bad simply because they disrupt the so called good destiny community where people used to help each other. That, allied to TRIALS REPORT simply damages the community in its majority. As I've mentioned before a while ago, trials report deals the same blow to the community as gjallarhorn did back in the day when players were left out of raids/poe for not having one. Bungie criticized the matter, nerfed the weapon and yet, praises a website that does the same to the players. Deny players of content. So when these players need to pay someone to run trials with, because their ELO or KD are low I think there's a big problem there.

I Was playing trials this week, got to 7 wins and got matched with a team that was doing a carry. The 2 good players both had a 2.0+ kd and had played 142 games that weekend alone, That right there's the problem. I have no problem with being beaten by better players or people helping others out, but 142 games by Monday is a joke. I like trials but I think it would be better if once you got a card you had to finish it to get another. And if you go flawless, that's it for that character.

Join my group and clan on Bungie.net, The Wall Just Got Higher #Trump2016

Trials is like the rest of the Crucible... a damn joke. They need to change it from Skirmish to Clash. Match vets against vets and noobs against noobs but that makes sense so not a chance. Crucible is making me HATE this game... and no... I don't suck. Bungie has had 2 years and Crucible is still a joke. If they would stop breaking stuff and concentrate on fixing things, it would be different. Bungie's indifference to how crappy it is makes me sick. Take pride in your work scrubs. I'd be ashamed to show my face if I worked on Destiny's Crucible team.

The issue with carries is that the same top level players run trials continously. Even if they are doing double carries the skilll level of the top 2% is so much greater than the rest of the player base that theres little chance of most teams beating them. You can say get gud but most players are never going to get anywhere near that level. Im not against the idea of carrying but there should be a limit to how many passages you can run. Even if its a high amount like 10 per character. Thats more than enough.

I agree other than this statement "You want to just play scrubs all the way to the lighthouse??? If these things really bother you then you are probably one of the people that think you deserve to win every game." I have not seen anyone state they want to play scrubs all the way to the lighthouse they just want to play teams of equal or similar skill level more often. That doesn't make it easier for them. Obviously this is tough for Bungie to do considering all the factors that can go into someones skill level but it would be nice for everyone to have a reasonable chance by pitting them against similar skilled opponents. Of course then you might have guys dumping games to get their skill level down so they can play scrubs all the way but...

People who don't move from there spawn ever or you come across a team that's immune to damage some bs

People complain because they just want to be in the lighthouse already, no body wants to work for it anymore, everybody just wants to be THERE so they can tell others they've done it. I don't like the idea of carries or paying, I'm glad I've worked an made my way to the player I am now, I've gone flawless plenty of times. And the way how my life is without a car an working in a different city, I can't play the game like I did before, but because I come back to maintain the game an practice, I can still go flawless no matter whom I can compete.

I don't think I have a problem with the people who do carries. My problem is the people who have gone flawless because they either payed someone or they tricked a good player into thinking they are good as well. Yes,Trials should be difficult, and the lighthouse isn't for everyone. But when there are people on LFG sites who won't play with you because you aren't RealKraftyy, then it gets a bit irritating. My point is if you get carried, at least try to be modest about it or something. It doesn't do anyone any favors if you brag that you've gone flawless hundreds of times if you haven't earned it yourself.

[quote]So, I've read through the forums and see a few complaints about trials, but none of them are truly issues and I wanted to address them. Note: I am not the best trials player in the world probably closer to average than good, but this is how I feel. The first one I notice was a complaint about paid trials runs on Lfg. I don't get why that bothers people! I don't ever do them but if someone else wants to and some one is willing to pay them, doesn't bother me! Why does it matter to you if a skilled destiny player picks up someone who has never been flawless and takes them to the lighthouse???? Oh because you might have to play them and get beat?????? Get better at the game and stop pointing fingers at the better player like its wrong for them to be good enough to do carries, if you can't beat someone who is carrying then don't even address it because if that person decided to play with people that are as good as them than you(the ones who lose to double carries) wouldn't be able to win a single round, so stop complaining. someone else offering to get virgins to the lighthouse for money shouldn't hurt your feelings so much. If you don't like the moral side of it then you go carry people for free! Be a "good guy" in your eyes. If you can't carry someone then you can't even do what these people are offering to do, so why does someone who can't carry get to say weather or not someone that is good enough to carry should get paid??Others are complaining about sbmm and how they think it is in trials..... This is why I say non of these are the real issue! Streamers carrying, skill based match making, paid Sherpa carries on Lfg these things don't hurt trials of Osiris!!! Getting to the lighthouse is supposed to be hard!!!! If you report all the people doing carries and take away sbmm (which I don't even know is in trials right now, but wouldn't surprise me) then what? You want to just play scrubs all the way to the lighthouse??? If these things really bother you then you are probably one of the people that think you deserve to win every game. The real issues with trials today are those things that actually affect the game, not the things that would require you to be a good player to get past. Here are some real issues: the lag and the latency. Poor up close game mechanics like no hit detection when you try to melee someone who is killing you with a double melee. Twice I have lost a close game in overtime when the entire other team was killed and I was standing in the zone with time left just because of some glitch. Classes and weapons need to be more balanced, considered big changes like removing heavy things like that. Fixing some of these things could actually make a difference. Losing to someone who is teleporting all over your screen, that is frustrating and unfair. You basically get 2 wins for free, and it's ok to lose 1 game. Trials shouldn't be easier it should be more balanced and people with terrible connections should be kicked. If you lose, try to figure out why you lost and improve when facing similar play styles as those who normally beat you. Communicate with your team constantly. Grab a new card try again. I completely understand and agree with the opinion that bungie should remove sbmm from regular playlist. We need a place to casually game and have fun. No one wants every game they play to be sweaty and close, sometimes we don't play as good like after a long day at work and we just want some casual crucible. That being said, trials of Osiris is labeled as a tournament! It should be sweaty it should be tough. That is what makes going flawless feel like an accomplishment of some sort.[/quote] 1. They are paying professionals who play pvp 24/7 instead of "getting good" like you said 2. Your wasting money to pay people to help you out in a game. Do people do that in other shooting games?! 3. Skill based matchmaking will pair you up with people that are on their 8th win and they are pros who have a 3+ kd 4. The further you go it should get harder I do agree with that 5. Double melees is a perk or ability that some classes or exotics have 6. lag is a problem 7. You do need to be tactical 8. Normal people don't want to pop a blood vessel every match that's why you only see the best playing trials 9. People who don't play the game regularly don't want to deal with sweaties and try hards 10. People that have beatin it multiple times that day will still keep playing

You just put up a wall of text just to contradict yourself publicly. Trials is supposed to be hard but it's ok for people to be carried. Which one is if?

If it's truly "competitive" like everyone claims it to be, why are unskilled players being stomped by very good ones? That's not competitive.