[quote]a class that hasn't been changed, AT ALL FOR NEARLY TWO YEARS, is starting to shine.[/quote] *looks at quote* *looks at december patch* *looks back at quote* *looks back at december patch* So all those buffs that striker got do not count as changes? Special kind of thinking here....

They got a slight increase to their effective melee range and their hit registration for shoulder charge fixed. One is a very small buff that doesn't change the way the subclass plays or feels. The other was just a bug fix. So yes, the subclass hasn't changed at all for two years.

This isn't my account. This is my kids and occasionally wife (she's a full-time wife-occasional Destiny player- look through the other forum posts you will see my wife posting here too). I'm on XBone, different GT - 3 characters all classes, all 335, 125k Crucible kills, 200 raid completions, Alpha player, no inherent prejudice towards any other players preferences. Been playing games on multiple platforms, multiple genres for, oh, about 35 years. I have a completely rational take on this matter.

Ok and what does that have to do with anything? I've got the same things as well. Alpha player, beta player, day one player, moments of triumph finished. This proves nothing. And I don't care who's account it is. I'm directing my argument to whomever the biased person is. You listed nothing but completely un-rational and biased arguments against striker titans, best guess is because you like everyone thinks that your least favorite class is the only one with op abilities. First warlocks and hunters also have extremely powerful abilities along with titans. Second not only did you list strikers best abilities and make them seem much more powerful than they actually are, you also failed to list any counters. I'm not by any means saying these abilities are weak, but you seem to think they are game breaking, which they are not. The only reason strikers are at the top of the meta right now, is because they are literally the only subclass that hasn't been nerfed. Minus defender, but defender takes a lot of practice and skill to be good with and striker is much easier so majority of players will lean towards strikers. So now that we've gotten out of the way that you are completely biased against titans, seem to think that titan abilities are much more powerful than they actually are, forget that warlocks and hunters have powerful abilities too, and that strikers are the only ones never nerfed and that's why they are at the top now, let's talk about counters to strikers. MAP AWARENESS! Pay attention to your game, radar, and what's going on around you, and then maybe you'll realize that it's actually relatively easy to counter strikers.

Well, my reply is a response to you stating my lack of qualification to comment, based on an unleveled Titan and presumably the associated lack of experience of playing the class. I have both. The characteristics I stated in my original reply are not equitable in comparison to other classes. The highest armour, fastest mobility, OHK with no cooldown, an over-shield which all but negates the most powerful primaries in the game, a random skill-less super which is a get-out-jail-free for any tricky situation, a grenade that zaps from the vicinity of nowhere near it and Bungie nerfs Shadestep, Throwing Knives and Firebolt grenades none of which are actually lethal! If you think that's balanced, I don't think we have much to discuss.

Ok well first, I'm sure your "qualifications" are 100% legit. Whatever. It doesn't matter. What matters is the fact that you think you know what you're talking about, when in fact you have no idea. You would completely destroy another subclass just because you're biased against it and are mad that your favorite class/subclass got nerfed. I don't agree with bungie nerfing hunters and warlocks at all, but complaining and crying for more nerfs isn't the solution. It's people like you that got destiny into this situation in the first place. Maybe try asking for some buffs since you're "qualified" and all. Second, lightning grenades are powerful and can kill, but it takes two bursts to kill anyone including the weakest of armored enemies. If you are standing to get hit by two bursts then it's your own fault. Next, yes it kills in one burst to already weak enemies, but then again, so do other grenades. Also lightning grenades have to be thrown at the right place and angle for them to hit. Their damage cone is huge, but it isn't like firebolts where you could just throw them willy nilly and now that they will still tag someone. Third, FoH is a super and should be treated as such. Supers are supposed to be op and hard to stop. They aren't supposed to be "Oh this guy's running at with hammers or golden gun or nova bomb or fist of havoc or any other damn super, let me just pop a couple of primary rounds into him and be on my way." That is a stupid and illogical standpoint for a roaming super. Fist of Havoc is one and done. You get one shot with it. One and done supers are not nearly as forgiving as roaming supers like Hammer of Sol or Stromtrance. This, and the fact that strikers have to be around a group of enemies for their super to work, is why strikers have so much armor in the Fist of Havoc. Nova bomb has less armor because it can be launched from relative safety. Plus if you want to talk about "get out of jail for free cards" we can also bring up shadestep spam. Fist of Panic may get you a kill and out of a bad situation but it's a waste of a super, obviously, can't be spammed like shadestep or twilight garrison. Fourth, is shoulder charge. Firstly, shoulder charge actually does have a cool down and something that no other ability has, a charge up time. You have to sprint for a short time and then you have a limited amount of time before it wears off. Next shoulder charge is actually very easy to counter, contrary to your biased belief. I'd say 9 shoulder charge kills out of 10, are against guardians not paying attention. Step one, pay attention to the game and your radar. Step two, proceed to throw smoke, tripmine at the wall, shotgun in the face, sniper headshot, spray down with primary, jump over it, turn and run, use team shot, or activate your super. All of these are fantastic counters to shoulder charge and if done correctly will shut down the titan. If not, then you just got outplayed. Paying attention is the biggest key to countering almost anything in destiny. Finally, let me say once again that, obviously, I'm completely against any nerfs to the titan. I love titans and I main one. So it's gonna make me a little mad when I see someone, who on the profile they're replying on, has an unleveled titan and shit stats. You may be telling the truth and if you are, good for you. But, hopefully you can understand why I don't take your word for it. As, once again, your posts are completely biased against titans and saying that they're abilities are so powerful and warlocks and hunters have nothing like it. When in reality all classes have super powerful abilities and op abilities. Now, regardless of how I feel about titans, here's how I feel about hunters and warlocks. I think the majority of the nerfs are complete bullshit and I would love to see some hunter and warlock buffs in the future, hopefully near. The only nerf that I agree with affected titans as well, and that was the shadestep/twilight garrison nerf. The spamming on those two things was unreal and there was no counter and people definitely didn't get outplayed. You just had to sit there, while the guy you were about to kill because he got himself into a bad situation, gets away.

Mmm, that's a lot of text. You seem to be intent on questioning my legitimacy to comment based on experience (not valid), a stated bias (unfounded as I have not stated a preference to play any class) and a defence against these characteristics that is true of every ability, super or weapon in the game. I did not think the nerf to Twilight Garrison was any more justified than Shadestep, for example. What I do think is that Bungie knows their demographic. Younger, less worldly players always play the powerful hero character and that is what is being preserved. It's cynical and devalues the legitimacy of any claims of competitive or skilful gameplay.

And yet you expect me to believe what you're say about your other profile or experience in game. Ok, that makes perfect sense. Also I have pretty good reasoning for assuming your biased because, once again, you have an unleveled titan and have offered no proof about your real profile and you just refuse to believe that warlock and hunter have powerful abilities as well. For the example, landfall is a mini FoH combined with the best roaming super in the game. Do I want it nerfed? No. Is it a powerful ability? Yes. Based on everything that you have posted so far, it seems that you say you have qualifications and actually know how all the character play and feel and yet have offered no proof of this. You are biased against titans as your first post was complaining how op strikers are, even though they haven't changed at all since the launch of destiny, and how you want them nerfed. You stated how op their abilities are and over exaggerated how powerful they really are. Also you have had no reasonable, logical, or sound arguments to retort with to my points about striker. Based on those facts and a lot of their posts on the forums from hunter and warlock mains, you appear to be a biased and mad hunter/warlock main, who wants the titan nerfed because your favorite class/subclass got nerfed, and you aren't offering any sort of logical reasoning in a counter argument so that isn't helping your case. Also you have refused to back up what you are saying about being qualified with any form of proof. So I have stated how striker titans aren't op in a counter argument against you and haven't had any form of one back and while I have backed up what I said with proof, you haven't, and just hid behind false logic and big words.

I don't expect you to believe anything, nor does it matter to me what you might choose to believe or not. There is no onus on me to prove anything, I am merely stating what I believe to be incontrovertible. Your advice on how to counter Striker is unnecessary and serves no purpose for me. I am quite familiar with it and all 8 of the other subclasses in the game. You haven't presented anything legitimate here that counters my original reply to the OP, neither did I ask you to. That impetus is yours alone.

If you don't need any advice then why is your k/d terrible? And why are you so biased against striker titans, which you obviously don't play?

You have no idea what my KD, win/loss, Elo is. How does that legitimate anything posited here?

Actually I do. All I have to do is click on your profile name and it'll pull up all of your characters, their stats, and their levels. Like your negative k/d on all of your characters and your unleveled titan.

Like I said previously, these aren't my characters. The Hunter is mainly my wife, the Warlock is my ten-year old daughter and the Titan, probably a mixture of my 10 year old and 7 year old.

Ha! I knew you would say that. So predictable. And yet you haven't backed anything you've said up, with proof. You have done nothing but hide behind your own bias, poor reasoning and lack of logic, and big words. While I've offered a reasonable counter argument, of which you ignored and used your false statements, and backed up what I've said with proof. I do believe that is W for me, and an L for you. Better luck next time.

Win for you and loss for me? That statement backs up all the content of the previous posts. Puerile and juvenile. All the best.

...and my opinion is not biased. I think I addressed these things previously.