end-game content should be a true challenge for even the best of players. casuals are casual and should stay in casual strikes. raids are for hard-forged teams. MM group of players=/=team.
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I run VoG HM pretty much every week via LFG which is not a group of people who know each other or are truly a "team" and usually, it goes fine. I actually enjoy getting people who have never run the VoG and have done more than one run in which there was maybe 1 other player who knew what to do. Those runs are more challenging and feel more rewarding IMO. I have limited play time, am a casual gamer, and LFG to play end game content, but I think there's a lot to be gained by having basic features added to a "social" game. At the end of the day, you have to use a separate device (computer or phone) to play content in a game that requires internet connection and requires groups for end game content. I'm not advocating to make end game easier, I'm advocating to make it more accessible.
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you can find pub allies even without LFG. my friend refuses to use LFG but still finds pub raids no problem, so the whole "you have to use an external thing" argument loses merit. MM brings out the absolute worst of the noobs, which get filtered out just by the tiny additional effort that LFG ensues. I do agree though; there needs to be a better way to find allies, like a text bar above your head or some check-box that says "looking to raid' or "looking to nightfall". I do not agree with MM in raids.
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Whats a pub group? I agree that for CE and VoG that MM would be heartache for many, but having MM available would not stop pre made teams from entering, or stop LFG channels from getting together as well. I am not saying its perfect solution, as there is no solution that will please 100% of the players, but it's better than what we currently have. I think MM would work better for things like NF and POE, at least not 32/34 POE as I have no idea how 35 is.
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pub group is kind of redundant... he would find a group of random people in the tower. suppliment that for "pub group" MM in NF; you know not what horrors you ask of. 32 and even 34 PoE could actually be viable for MM if it booted afkers much quicker, and Quodron wasnt in the mix. (hes the only boss that is sabotage able). 35 MM? no. just no.
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Qodron is by far the best of the level 32/34 bosses. He's the only one that really stresses teamwork. The PoE would be much better if the other bosses had lived up to the standard set by Qodron. If adding matchmaking means that we have to dumb down end game encounters then I don't want it.
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exactly! the new TTK strikes are supposed to introduce similar bosses, so well see how MM pubs will fare against more complicated bosses.
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Elitist
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is this where i call you a filthy casual? challenges should be challenging, and if part of that challenge is team-work and coordination then so be it. how do you expect to beat a coordination challenge when you cannot even be bothered to coordinate with 5 other people?
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Edited by Duck: 8/13/2015 11:20:49 AMdont see what the difference between match made randoms or randoms from lfg is. the only thing is the positive of not having to leave the game to do it. lfg doesn't guarantee you get a team that knows what they are doing or will listen when they dont.
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LFGers put the effort of going to LFG, MM pubs would consist of too much lazy scum that thinks its an easy loot button.
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elitist. so it is somehow a skill to put "poe 35 max gali or gtfo" or a board rather than an option in game for it.
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i never said LFG is the end-all answer, so dont be trying to put words into my mouth. you asked what the difference was, and i stated a very reasonable fact. how does that make me an elitist? did you ever play weekly heroic before it had MM? I ran it with pubs in the tower, and the cut of their jib was leagues above the garbage that sits in spawn or just afks when using its MM. why should i expect any better from MM if it was put into raids?
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elitist view
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what, just because you got the game means you should unlock all achievements automatically? achievements are rewarding based on the challenge, not the reward. "elitist view", pfft. i play magic, but that doesnt mean i should be in pro tournaments earning $3,000 dollars just for participating. entitled view.
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Edited by II Stargazer x: 8/13/2015 8:31:09 AMachievements are worthless, so is your bias view
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and yours is objective? end-game content is for end-game players. level 20s cant beat VoG because they are not prepared, unlike a higher level player who put the time and effort into becoming a higher level, and are thus prepared for VoG and therefore worthy. raids require teamwork and coordination above gjonkerhams and exotics. MM provides the anti-thesis of this, hence MM is not implemented for raids. also go tell a gold medal winner their trophy is worthless, i dare you.
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it only takes about 3 weeks to get to level 33 without doing Weeklies, Nightfalls, POE and raids, so they out level ALL the current raids, also we all have to start from somewhere, not everyone had the experience from the start and yes the means you also, give everyone the chance and stop only thinking of yourself ACHIEVEMENTS don't mean shit in the digital world, do you think your special just because you got 1 for making a cake in minecraft?
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you mean 32.... also 3 weeks is still slow, but w/e not gonna linger here much. what are you going on about? give everybody a chance? stop thinking of myself? i am one of the most indiscriminatory players you'll ever find. my only per-requisites are being prepared. if you want to do Vog then all i care about is you either know what goes on (oracles, confluxes etc), or are open to instruction, and meet the minimum required level. I've gladly taken new players through VoG, CE, and even Skolas. as long as they either know what to do themselves (experienced players) or listen to instruction or advice if new. thats it. I have personally given many people a chance to do end-game content as long as THEY are willing to put the effort forward. I will NOT carry people through if they are underleveled because that is an insult. like you said, even I had to start at the bottom, but eventually I WORKED my way to the top. Im not gonna breeze some scrub through end-game because they cant be bothered to put fourth the bare minimum effort. for the most part im still a pub raider but ill ask to kick under leveled players or just leave myself. I only did CE hard as a non-32 once because my friends where raiding and knew i was skilled enough to make up for that last level deficiency. beyond that, i raided CE normal until i was a 32, and THEN i began to run 32. i put fourth the maximum effort possible on my end BEFORE THE EVENT EVEN STARTED, so is it wrong of me to expect the bare minimum of others? I also dont want my end-game content to be a cake-walk. I expect to fail when encountering the greatest challenge, because it makes my success taste so much sweeter. I want to achieve something worth bragging about, not just retreading common ground. I want my hard-mode events to be that, HARD! when i face Oryx, i expect to get my ass handed to me. when i thoroughly beat Oryx on normal, I expect to see him continue to wear my ass in hard mode. I want him to be a tough mo' fo! when i beat him, i expect it to be with skill and grit and sheer determination with 5 other guardians who put fourth nothing less! I DONT want to just breeze through the new raid like I do nightfalls now. I DONT expect to be able to farm 34 bosses for cyphers easy-peasy. I want a CHALLENGE. THAT is the achievement I want! (the loot and little digital label can be actual gold-stars for all i care, but its the feat that i want to matter.) go home and be a family man, you filthy casual, and leave the end-game for those of us that can handle it!
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filthy casual at least I don't have a dick up my ass making me feel good
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dude man, like what you choose to do (and enjoy) in the privacy of your home should STAY in the privacy of your home. [i get what it is that your trying to insinuate, and again your the only one with a dick in your butt. aint no butt-hurt on or in my tushie.] scrub.
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my number 1 button to weed out the self-proclaimed elite, to those who actually have value in others, MUTE, bye SCRUB
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durr i muted you! thats y i posted it because it wouldnt block this message! female-dog, im elite because i put fourth the effort. im not some scrub that cries about sucking, and gets mad when somebody tells me to put fourth THE BASIC MINIMUM EFFORT!
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Edited by SwankyButters: 8/13/2015 9:13:44 AMPlease, someone beat crota blindfolded. I've played on teams where no one talked and we did fine. You would never have to be match made if they make it optional. I have no doubt I could do it in short order with noobs and no mics. How hard the raids are, is over stated.
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hold up hold up hold up, are you really trying to say the raids are too easy and have yet to beat even atheon on hard? :/