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4/5/2012 12:26:45 AM
24
When did destiny development start? Some interesting research...
Some of the longer term members here may remember BentLama (Nathan Walpole) being a Bungie employee. BentLama also worked at 343i recently.
He has previously worked on Halo 2 (Bungie), Halo 3 (Bungie) & Halo 4 (343i/MGS).
Looking at his resume ([url=http://www.bentllama.com/resume_nathanWalpole.pdf]link here[/url]) I see work on "undisclosed projects" reaching back to 2007 with Bungie. It seems interesting to me that a senior animator and conceptual developer for enabling the development team was working on "plural" as in multiple undisclosed projects.
What does this mean? I'm not sure but I wanted to post and get some speculation going. Perhaps he worked on Reach, maybe Destiny commenced all the way back then as well? Personally I think Destiny is in that mix.
I imagine his specialty in proof of concept, pre-vis and character rigging with test animators as well as design viability studies attribute him to working in the very early stages of game development lifecycles.
Any ideas on the projects BentLama worked on during those late years at Bungie? I'm thinking Destiny has been around for longer than we suspect.
Bungie have known for many years now that they were buying themselves back from Microsoft and moving away from Halo. I recall Reach had a small team assigned to retool existing Halo technologies to deliver their best game and ODST was the main focus. However I believe a semi-fast one was pulled on Microsoft and more resources were devoted behind closed doors to Destiny during both those game developments.
This leads me to think Destiny is closer than we think...
Side Note: Another point of interest here is I see 343i had him working on concept animation work for and "undisclosed Halo project" in 2008-2010. This means work for Halo 4 has been going on for over 4 years now.
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i am adding this to my list but we have a feeling it was orginial thought of by halo 2 but project started around ODST
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I do believe at one point Bungie said that Destiny has been working on 'Destiny' for along time. Now they never said this directly but it was inferred once(or multiple) time(s) that now they have the resources(technology and money?) to final push this project through. I believe that 'Destiny' is a game that Bungie has been planning fro multiple years. I'd go to such lengths to say that it was brought to the table back when Halo:CE's dev cycle ended. ~Quinton~
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Professor24 I do believe at one point Bungie said that Destiny has been working on 'Destiny' for along time. Now they never said this directly but it was inferred once(or multiple) time(s) that now they have the resources(technology and money?) to final push this project through. I believe that 'Destiny' is a game that Bungie has been planning fro multiple years. I'd go to such lengths to say that it was brought to the table back when Halo:CE's dev cycle ended. ~Quinton~[/quote] I agree the outlines and concepts go that far back. I'm sure they are leveraging all their experience, something like: Halo CE: Campaign & console with refinement in controls. Halo 2: Social gaming, online networking, online community support/growth, party systems. Halo 3: Anti-modding, security systems, improved networking, content sharing, website integration (API's etc), player content generation, online co-op, theater. Halo 3 ODST: Faster production, story, mood, firefight, smaller development team. Halo Reach: Engine retooling, advanced netcode, hitscan evolution, customisations, player economy-style system, advanced website integration, API's. AI improvements, engine optimisations. Aerospace/Crimson: First steps into developer/platform support as a back end supplier. Join all that together and I agree the systems all come together with ideas, art, code libraries, networking, social communities, engines, engine providing, business systems etc. It's all got to join up at some point, right? [Edited on 04.04.2012 7:26 PM PDT]
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Oddley765 Side Note: Another point of interest here is I see 343i had him working on concept animation work for and "undisclosed Halo project" in 2008-2010. This means work for Halo 4 has been going on for over 4 years now.[/quote]It's possible. I took a computer programming class once, and it took me two weeks to get simple text based program to run without any bugs. Now can you imagine putting together a game that has animation, sounds, graphics, stats, etc? 4 years sounds reasonable enough, and it will be closer to 5 when it's actually released. Seems like a good amount of time.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Oddley765 Side Note: Another point of interest here is I see 343i had him working on concept animation work for and "undisclosed Halo project" in 2008-2010. This means work for Halo 4 has been going on for over 4 years now.[/quote]As I mentioned [url=http://www.bungie.net/Forums/posts.aspx?postID=69922521]in my prediction thread[/url], 2007-2008 was when the Halo Chronicles series was being designed, but fell through eventually. That team then became the ODST team as we know it now. 343i only got their team properly kitted out for Halo 4 sometime in early 2011 (I was contacted about becoming a concept artist there, so I asked a few questions), and even then production hadn't properly started quite yet. As for Destiny, I'm confident that Bungie's always had something of an agenda for what they want to do after each project is complete. As a company, especially as directors and producers, it's vital to your continuation as a company. Bungie hadn't even expected Halo: CE to be such a success, and heck, originally Halo 2 was intended to be the last Halo game for them. We haven't seen or heard very much from Jason Jones since around this time (in part because he's camera-shy) so I'd happily guess that he and others within Bungie have been developing what they want for Destiny since around Halo 2, for sure (although considering how stretched they were during the development of that game, they probably put it on the backburner until after they finished). If Bungie is putting feelers out for Beta testers already ([url=http://www.bungie.net/Account/Playtest/UserResearch.aspx]which they totally are[/url]), then we can assume that they have already reached an Alpha stage for Destiny. I suspect we'll hear a Beta announcement date sometime this year, perhaps even around E3 or Bungie Day (the One of Seven invitations allude to this as well). [Edited on 04.04.2012 8:31 PM PDT]
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Oddley765 Halo 3 ODST: Faster production, story, mood, firefight, smaller development team. [/quote] This specifically interests me. I could see Bungie breaking up dev teams into relativity small groups of 10-15 people all working on something specific, having weekly check ins on theit progress ect. Also after the game is released they've said, "we want it to be more of the fans creation, than ours". Don't quote me on that, but it is something along those lines. Now if they do want that to happen, they're going to need lots of DLC. Having lots of small dev teams working on different DLC's sounds like a great idea to me. One new set of DLC(maps, characters,items,patches[?]) per month? Pretty awesome if you as me. Sorry, I really like speculating. Is there a Destiny speculation group? ~Quinton~
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@SonicJohn Nice informative reply and an interesting job prospect you have there! Also I recall your prediction thread now, solid stuff again mate. I agree about the experience, assets and skills transferring from previous games developed. Actually not just transference but planning I'm sure. I think your timeline is right on the money, I'm also sure Bungie pulled Destiny from the back burner to the forefront during Reach & ODST development. I base this on the fact they knew they were leaving Microsoft and had two more Halo games to delivery still. Oh and what is ~Quinton~? Two replies in this thread have it? [Edited on 04.04.2012 8:59 PM PDT]
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Didn't Jason Jones jump out of Halo as soon as Halo 3 was complete? It would be fair to assume that he has been working with a small team in pre-production since then. And concerning that in three years (the time between the releases of Halo 3 and Reach), they would've been able to do quite a lot of pre-production and even huge, public prototypes (ODST and Reach). Even the first hint to Destiny was back in the time before Reach was announced. I remember a quote in a weekly update something along the lines of "[something about ODST]... we have a small team working on a yet unannounced prject (Reach) and a small team working on a prject that is just a distant [b]star[/b] in the horizon". Now, that certainly isn't the exact quote, but it has the main point. I tried searching the BWU, but couldn't find it as I had no idea of the exact time. Anyhow, as SonicJohn pointed out ODST and Reach have basically been two huge prototypes for possible features of their next game. Bungie pretty much got open hands with both games which allowed them to use them as testing platforms for new features and such. So, I believe that the pre-production of Destiny dates all back to the start of 2008 and the full production started at the beginning of 2011. They have basically had three years to make prototypes and build their new engine. And as the game isn't coming out any time soon (2014 would be my bet), they have a lot of time to make the game as they want it to be, possibly hinting on a game that is supposed to last a bit longer than just three years. But that's already a lot of speculation.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] tsassi2 Didn't Jason Jones jump out of Halo as soon as Halo 3 was complete?[/quote] He actually already jumped out of Halo as soon as Halo 2 was complete. He just looked at the missions of Halo 3 when they were nearly finished and gave advice how to improve them. Jaime Griesemer wrote this in his résumé on his blog: [quote]Unannounced Project, Game Designer 2008 - 2010 - Participated in very early stages of project planning - Designed and built multiple gameplay prototypes in a modified version of the Halo engine - Helped to secure publisher funding partially on the basis of these prototypes[/quote] So Bungie is working on their new game at least since 2008 and Jason Jones probably even since 2005. [Edited on 04.05.2012 4:06 AM PDT]
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While all of this investigation and speculation is interesting, and a fun diversion in the current dry spell of direct game information from Bungie itself, I do hope we get a ViDoc after the public reveal that gives us a detailed backstory of the origins of this new IP and game.
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I think im going to be patient and not break neck over this, if bungie didnt want you to know you wouldnt simple as that, little hints and clues then should talk for itself. But if i had to guess id agree with the probability of this idea originating all the way from halo2. [Edited on 04.05.2012 4:57 AM PDT]
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@tsassi2 I agree the game/universe time is aiming for the 10 year mark, especially if we're speculating MMO or RPGS elements. @Simjon4Two If JJ and/or a small team started back in 2005/08 I am officially even more excited for this game universe. @HiredNoobs Hopefully the next reveal is a Bungie ViDoc, I'm getting chills just thinking about it.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Simjon4two [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] tsassi2 Didn't Jason Jones jump out of Halo as soon as Halo 3 was complete?[/quote] He actually already jumped out of Halo as soon as Halo 2 was complete. He just looked at the missions of Halo 3 when they were nearly finished and gave advice how to improve them. Jaime Griesemer wrote this in his résumé on his blog: [quote]Unannounced Project, Game Designer 2008 - 2010 - Participated in very early stages of project planning - Designed and built multiple gameplay prototypes in a modified version of the Halo engine - Helped to secure publisher funding partially on the basis of these prototypes[/quote] So Bungie is working on their new game at least since 2008 and Jason Jones probably even since 2005.[/quote] The planning phase could've indeed been started in 2005 already. But the team working between 2005 and 2010 must have been small. Most likely ranging from Jones by himself to five people at max. On the other hand, they most likely got quite a substantial increase in size when Bungie got to finishing Reach and all of the programmers, animators, designers and artists weren't needed with Reach anymore. In light of this information, I'd personally estimate something like: 2005-09: Jason Jones + 0-4 other people (varying at times) 2009-10: 10+ people 2010-: the whole Bungie team But whatever it is, they seem to have been planning this for a long time now. I wouldn't like to make baseless assumptions, but just the sheer time spent on it makes me think the game will be amazing. I should probably keep my expectations lower as I have only seen less than five seconds worth of development video that didn't even have textures.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] tsassi2 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Simjon4two [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] tsassi2 Didn't Jason Jones jump out of Halo as soon as Halo 3 was complete?[/quote] He actually already jumped out of Halo as soon as Halo 2 was complete. He just looked at the missions of Halo 3 when they were nearly finished and gave advice how to improve them. Jaime Griesemer wrote this in his résumé on his blog: [quote]Unannounced Project, Game Designer 2008 - 2010 - Participated in very early stages of project planning - Designed and built multiple gameplay prototypes in a modified version of the Halo engine - Helped to secure publisher funding partially on the basis of these prototypes[/quote] So Bungie is working on their new game at least since 2008 and Jason Jones probably even since 2005.[/quote] The planning phase could've indeed been started in 2005 already. But the team working between 2005 and 2010 must have been small. Most likely ranging from Jones by himself to five people at max. On the other hand, they most likely got quite a substantial increase in size when Bungie got to finishing Reach and all of the programmers, animators, designers and artists weren't needed with Reach anymore. In light of this information, I'd personally estimate something like: 2005-09: Jason Jones + 0-4 other people (varying at times) 2009-10: 10+ people 2010-: the whole Bungie team But whatever it is, they seem to have been planning this for a long time now. I wouldn't like to make baseless assumptions, but just the sheer time spent on it makes me think the game will be amazing. I should probably keep my expectations lower as I have only seen less than five seconds worth of development video that didn't even have textures.[/quote] No reason at all to keep expectations lower.. This is Bungie we're talking about. It will be awesome! I just want to know how Activision fits into their overall equation...
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6 Replies[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Poe Sword No reason at all to keep expectations lower.. This is Bungie we're talking about. It will be awesome! I just want to know how Activision fits into their overall equation... [/quote] Activision fits there as a publisher, nothing else. Of course they will get some help from ACtivision such as testing and possibly new technoologies, but Activision won't be an integral part of the development process. But keeping expectations low is always a good thing. After all, you lose nothing and if the game actually super awesome, you will be much more excited about it because you were positively surprised. The waiting also goes by faster when you keep your expectations lower.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] tsassi2 Activision fits there as a publisher, nothing else. Of course they will get some help from ACtivision such as testing and possibly new technoologies, but Activision won't be an integral part of the development process. But keeping expectations low is always a good thing. After all, you lose nothing and if the game actually super awesome, you will be much more excited about it because you were positively surprised. The waiting also goes by faster when you keep your expectations lower.[/quote] Sounds good, I just didn't want Activision to have expectations of Bungie like MS making them put stuff out so fast. Also I agree about the time going by faster, but when you have high expectations and it superseeds those, then you're playing a Bungie game! Based on how Bungie has evolved through the years I can't imagine a bust at all.
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I found this in an interview from 2007: [quote]So from that point of view we don't have a shortage of people happy to make Halo games, but obviously there are guys that have shipped Halo games for ten years, and they are definitely ready to work on new IPs or create new things. We're actively engaged with the senior staff here on a couple of new IPs right now, but the team that can generate cool Halo games is still running full-speed as well. I'm sure those senior Bungie guys will sit in as advisors - on pre-production, design review and polishing the game as we build it - but they won't have to get their hands as dirty in the bits of pieces of the next couple of Halo games.[/quote] Sounds like some grizzled ancients did already work on new stuff while ODST and Reach were made.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Simjon4two I found this in an interview from 2007: [quote]So from that point of view we don't have a shortage of people happy to make Halo games, but obviously there are guys that have shipped Halo games for ten years, and they are definitely ready to work on new IPs or create new things. We're actively engaged with the senior staff here on a couple of new IPs right now, but the team that can generate cool Halo games is still running full-speed as well. I'm sure those senior Bungie guys will sit in as advisors - on pre-production, design review and polishing the game as we build it - but they won't have to get their hands as dirty in the bits of pieces of the next couple of Halo games.[/quote] Sounds like some grizzled ancients did already work on new stuff while ODST and Reach were made.[/quote] No that is interesting and seems to confirm the timeline for Destiny "really getting underway". I'm certain the moment Bungie closed the MS buy back deal that started on Destiny as a priority. This then left then open to trying new things with ODST & Reach.
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I heard that the pondering started after Halo 3 came out.
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Can. Not. Wait. For. This. Game. This speculation is driving me insane.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Professor24 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Oddley765 Halo 3 ODST: Faster production, story, mood, firefight, smaller development team. [/quote] This specifically interests me. I could see Bungie breaking up dev teams into relativity small groups of 10-15 people all working on something specific, having weekly check ins on theit progress ect. Also after the game is released they've said, "we want it to be more of the fans creation, than ours". Don't quote me on that, but it is something along those lines. Now if they do want that to happen, they're going to need lots of DLC. Having lots of small dev teams working on different DLC's sounds like a great idea to me. One new set of DLC(maps, characters,items,patches[?]) per month? Pretty awesome if you as me. Sorry, I really like speculating. Is there a Destiny speculation group? ~Quinton~ [/quote] There is actually, right [url=http://www.bungie.net/fanclub/426933/Group/GroupHome.aspx]here[/url] [Edited on 04.16.2012 2:53 AM PDT]
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] TheHawk62 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Professor24 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Oddley765 Halo 3 ODST: Faster production, story, mood, firefight, smaller development team. [/quote] This specifically interests me. I could see Bungie breaking up dev teams into relativity small groups of 10-15 people all working on something specific, having weekly check ins on theit progress ect. Also after the game is released they've said, "we want it to be more of the fans creation, than ours". Don't quote me on that, but it is something along those lines. Now if they do want that to happen, they're going to need lots of DLC. Having lots of small dev teams working on different DLC's sounds like a great idea to me. One new set of DLC(maps, characters,items,patches[?]) per month? Pretty awesome if you as me. Sorry, I really like speculating. Is there a Destiny speculation group? ~Quinton~ [/quote] There is actually, right [url=http://www.bungie.net/fanclub/426933/Group/GroupHome.aspx]here[/url][/quote] A little quiet but get some more members in there and I'd participate.
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2 RepliesDestiny couldn't have started development while bungie was with M$. If so, it would have belonged to M$.
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They said it had 10 years in the makinh
