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Edited by classyhob013: 2/16/2015 6:43:57 PM
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How Kabr could've "died"

Now I know there are already many theories of what may have happened to Kabr, but recently there has been a surge of "Kabr's Transformation" post proposing that that he didn't die but instead transformed into something else (perhaps Atheon, or something). Supporting evidence in the descriptions that come with VOG Raid Armor make this totally plausible... [b]click spoilers for armor description[/b] [spoiler]Façade of the Hezen Lords: "The helm's nerve interface incorporates Vex cells. They're dead, of course. But not too dead to dream..." [/spoiler] ^Not too dead to dream? WTF does that mean? Well, perhaps it is suggesting that vex may not die when their bodies are destroyed/dismantled. Which could be possible considering that the in-game narration says the vex are all controlled by one mind. One mind spread over many bodies; killing one body does not destroy the mind in it. [spoiler]Fragment of the Prime: "Caged in ascendant motes, it still glimmers with the light of some ceaseless calculation."[/spoiler] ^Hmmm a fragment of Vex dismembered from its body but still calculating (calculating could be the equivalent of robot breathing) and alive? Okay, well, then clearly Vex parts still have some sort of "pulse" even when they are dismembered and their goblin bodies destroyed. So if someone were to, oh I dunno, wear them perhaps, would that be bad to cover yourself in living vex technology? [spoiler]Kabr's Brazen Grips: "He consumed their technology like fire, fashioning armor from their remnants."[/spoiler] ^Okay, so Kabr did exactly that: made armor from Vex to protect himself while in the vault. He was covered in vex tech, literally. He wore it for extended periods of time I would imagine, I mean after all, why would you take off armor, right? But perhaps this was Kabr's downfall *cue dramatic music* Multiple VOG raid armor descriptions seems to imply that their technological connection to the Vex allows them to become attached to you, or that once worn, they're hard to take off for some unknown reason, perhaps because they start to [i]consume[/i] your light, just as Kabr was consumed (according to grimoire cards). [spoiler]Prime Zealot Cuirass: "Forged from the ruin of Hezen Vex armor. The sensory interface feels more natural than bare skin."[/spoiler] ^Hmmm. So this hunter armor forged from Vex seems to feel more like your own skin than it does armor? [spoiler]Prime Zealot Greaves: "Skinned in the membranes of the Hezen Vex. There is very little risk they will become permanently attached to your body."[/spoiler] ^These hunter boots were also forged from Vex. Now they say there is "little risk" it will attach to you, but something tells me that is a lie/sarcasm, knowing how Destiny works. Especially after reading the warlock chest armor and hunter helmet... [spoiler]Cuirass of the Hezen Lords: "Slept in the armor last night. Woke to feel my heart stuttering to the pattern of an unknown signal."[/spoiler] ^Woah, what? The armor clearly was doing something to the guardian. It was clearly doing something to their body. [spoiler]Prime Zealot Helm: "Forged from the cores of Hezen Vex. If you feel a sense of revelation, remove immediately and inject antientheogens." [/spoiler] ^So clearly wearing this thing ,made from vex, messes with your mind. Entheogens are practices for transcendence (aka becoming god/ something else), so having to inject antientheogens would mean then that if the helmet starts [b]making you into something else[/b], take it off and be yourself/mortal. So clearly wearing Vex stuff seriously screws with you. It messes with your mind and heart , becomes attached to you, and tries to transcend you. Perhaps this is what happened to Kabr: he put on armor (which we know he did), the armor drove him crazy and consumed him, and by wearing it he became something else. Which could be why he says "if you hear from me again, I am not Kabr"; because he realized what the armor was doing to him but couldn't take it off because it wouldn't allow him to. Therefore he didn't die, he just changed. His helmet even says so: [spoiler]Battlecage of Kabr: "Kabr fought the Vex alone. But somehow they [b]didn't[/b] kill him."[/spoiler] There is no trace of his body, nor his light (that turned into the relic according to grimoire cards), nor his guns, nor his ghost. [spoiler]Kabr's Forceful greaves: "He was claimed by the Vault. His armor and myth are all that remain."[/spoiler] Perhaps because he isn't dead, just something/someone else... EDIT: WOAH. Thanks for all the hype guys! Glad to know my theory has provided input on solving the mystery of Kabr. And for those who disagree with me, remember, it's just a theory! [b]Don't h8; appreciate [/b] Edit #2: [spoiler]Aegis: "These are the last words of Kabr, the Legionless: I have destroyed myself to do this. They have taken my Ghost. They are in my blood and brain..."[/spoiler] ^[b]Most compelling evidence that Kabr transformed into something by means of wearing infected Vex armor...[/b] Edit #3: Remember, [u]I am not saying what Kabr transformed into[/u] (we don't know what that is yet; perhaps the Relic, perhaps Atheon, perhaps something else). All this post does is provide possible evidence to the "death" of Kabr. And saying he is truly dead because he sacrificed his light for the relic could be wrong because Eris sacrificed her light and is clearly still alive. Edit #4: We are on the highest rated topics page w/ #destiny. WOOP WOOP. Thanks guys!

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  • I know what happened. My friend Praedyth died, now only me. Kabr was a strong man, leader. But fell, Pahanin was fast, full of knowledge. Kabr [u]was[/u] transformed, his weapon the vex mythoclast. This eyes disappeared, only one remained. The VoG changed his thoughts. Made him joint the pattern, not the great mind but yet a mind. No, Atheon is not Kabr. Who else would've had the power to change him? I can see him. Now, the Vault may be a guardians playhouse, but for us it's a tomb. I'm trapped, immortal of age, unable to not see everything. I have no ghost, but I can revive myself. I can move around the Vault, the doors open for me, I could escape, if the pattern allowed. But I am not the pattern that Kabr was forced into. I am not the guardian that roamed the wastelands. I am the ghost, not of myself, or of Kabr. But of the fireteam. The last survivor. Makes me feel like Eris. Only that she escaped. This place is my prison. Kabr, is the prison guard. The religious King, the Gorgon. He no longer is like the goblins, the pattern has changed him again, perhaps. Perhaps the pattern may free him. Like Praedyth and Pahanin. Praedyth is not alive, but is ghost is, unable to revive its minion. Kabr's ghost is with me. Just surviving. In the end, a hunter is a scavenger. A warlock, is a knowledge searcher. A Titan, a protector. But a ghost? A ghost is none, they only have one protocol. Follow the pattern. Not the vex's pattern but their own. If we discover that, it will be like the golden age has returned. But Kabr, is the vex. Worse than death. Seeing the death he inflicts but unable to help. Kabr is alive, but longs to be dead.

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  • Necrobump

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  • This is a really good post and rare we have lore theories brought to us with evidence so well done for that. In other Grimoire cards, guardians who wear the vex armour are said to have heard voices (assuming the controlling mind) and thery took it off. I personally think that the Vex wiped Kabr's team from time and space (see grimoire cards again as Kabr says "I know I could not have entered alone but I was, and I wasn't" or something along those lines) and since Kabr actually used Vex flesh, his own light to make the relic and his morbid fascination with the vault I think he may have been transformed in to something. We've seen how the Vex can take over and reform things as big as planets in just a few days. I personally like how open every raid story is, makes for interesting theories.

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  • Do we know if gorgons detect anyone wearing full Kabr armor? Since they are part of the vex network. I got the helm the other day, will try soon.

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    • If he was transcended, he must be Atheon for sure.

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      • Bump me for later pls!

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        • Maybe I'm the next vex raid Kabr could be the end boss??

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        • This is a great post, I'm not knocking it, but why in the hell are all these gray bars that say show spoiler in it?

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          • Read the Battle cage of kabir's description (VOG hard helmet) it says he battled the vex but didn't die

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            • Vexual Transmitted Disease.

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              • What if, WE are kabr. And that's why we can use his armor and relic as if its for us. Remember your ghost saying [quote]you've been dead a long time[/quote]. What if??

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                • I was under the impression kabr died fighting gorgons. And the vex created the titan armor from his armor.

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                  • Edited by Pancake: 1/20/2015 4:45:11 AM
                    I think it's unlikely that Kabr could have turned into Atheon but I do think that it is possible that Atheon and the Vex inside of the Vault of Glass have a common goal with the guardians that conducted raids on it. Bungie said before the Dark Below released that the Vex Mythoclast was designed to be one of if not the best weapon for Crota's End. There was also a grimoire card that said that only a weapon of incredible light could defeat the hive (the mythoclast). I believe that the Vex, being able to travel through time, fell to Crota and his army of darkness along with the rest of the Solar System and have now come back in time and created the Vault of Glass as a testing ground to ensure that only the strongest of guardians are able to wield the weapon that would make it possible to defeat Crota before he and the Hive take over the Solar System. There is also a grimoire card that says that the Vex created the mythoclast but are not able to use its power effectively, explaining why they have to find guardians powerful enough to properly use it to stop Crota from wiping out guardians and the Vex alike.

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                    • Very well thought out post, OP, with plenty of evidence to back up your points. It's quite morbidly fascinating to imagine Kabr slowly being consumed by his own armour. If Vex armour is able to affect Guardians like this... Could the same be said for Hive armour?

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                      • I personally think that Kabr tore himself apart and became the pool of light we see in the Templar phase. Whatever remained became the relic, where I believe he still lives on in.

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                        • Lol

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                        • He drowned in the salty tears of guardians who didn't get the loot they wanted. R.I.P

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                        • More story than the actual game.

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                          • Ever since that picture of all the DLC that will be coming out I thought maybe we will learn more when we have another vex raid again. Perhaps he comes to the tower like Eris to warn us of a greater danger in the vault or maybe he'll be the raid boss. But who knows really.

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                          • I think atheon captured kabr and is doing something to him

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                            • Also if you look everywhere (most noticeably on top where you spawn at the templars well) there are floating&teleporting "snowflakes" could this be Kabrs ghost in some form.

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                            • Kabr turned on to the relic shield huys

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                              • ....Or he died cuz his bubble went down at an unreasonable time

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                                • Wow that's interesting...

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                                • Really good theory , Thumbs up!

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                                • Great theory man, I love all of these VOG ideas, makes you really wonder

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