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11/13/2015 2:42:22 AM
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The Hand Cannon
Personally, I love hand cannons. If you check my stats, my preferred weapon of choice for everything is the hand cannon, whether that is Crucible, Raids or just Patrols. I enjoy that precise, high-damage round of just about every hand cannon. But, even with my total of over 100,000 kills with hand cannons, I can just barely compete with pulse rifles. The reason- lack of aim assist. I thought that 2.0 would bring the downfall of the hand cannon with the range nerf, but the accuracy hit was easily the worst part of the overall hand cannon change. If you've used any hand cannon since 2.0, there is no possible way you never experienced this: you line up the headshot, get two shots off, line the third one up, take the shot... only to miss and get Hawksaw-ed down. Hand cannons used to have great consistency before 2.0. Hawkmoon was easily able to land three back-to-back headshots no problem, but now, I struggle to even get two sometimes. This is a problem.
I propose one solution- increase the base accuracy and aim assist of all hand cannons. Even keeping the range the same is alright, even though I believe it to be too short. The main counter to pulse rifles should be hand cannons, but they are just not consistent enough to reliably win any engagement. This fix may even be an indirect nerf to pulse rifles, giving them some competition may reduce their effectiveness.
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The range nerf was needed. A hand canon should not compete with a scout rifle. As far as I can see the hand cannon should be a mid range sister to pulse, how they manage that can't be easy. Overall I see the problem they have balancing weapons is that they have multiple guns filling the same spots. Short/medium/long in the primary slot, and the secondary slot. Getting a pulse rifle to fill the same roll as hand canon essentially, but with different rates of fire, impact, stability, magazine, but equal ttk. Secondly the reliance of perks that are really useless unless they increase stability and range make it hard to be creative. There is not a big enough bonus from almost any "other" perk to place it superior to a stability/range perk, more so in PvP. I can see things like fire fly and faster reload in PvE. Overall the meta would be more stable with either no hand cannon or no pulse rifle.
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I agree with your post whole heartedly. And I think it's awesome that the weapon balance coming out in a few days will literally do exactly what you posted along with hopefully fixing the pulse rifle meta that is in pvp right now. I don't particularly like hand cannons as I prefer weapons with a much faster reload speed over anything else, but your suggestion is great stuff. Not just angrily ranting about how the new balance sucks, and instead giving actual feedback. I salute you good sir or ma'am.
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2 RepliesIn my honest opinion i think they shouldn't nerf pulse rifles. I think they should restore hand cannons before 2.0 and tune The Last Word(rate of fire or range), Thorn(Burn) and hawkmoon(no triple stack lucky rounds) as well as buff auto rifles. [spoiler]just my opinion.[/spoiler]
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1 ReplyEdited by blockessa: 11/18/2015 6:03:32 PMI have to agree, Hawkmoon is nowhere near as consitent as it was before the patch. If you want a long range primary with high aim assistance (that isn't a pulse rifle) I would recommend you The Jade Rabbit, it allows you to easily compete with snipers and i[b][/b]t kills with 3 headshots. I hope that Bungie will buff handcannons, just a bit. Btw low accuracy is anoying in pve too. Sometimes I can't even hit Thralls! #edit You're xbox player, sorry. xD
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53 RepliesI love hand cannons too. The Last Word is one of my favorites. Hand cannons did seem to get hit pretty hard with the last weapons update, though Hawkmoon is still really solid. More changes are on the horizon. We will have some more details coming out next week about the December update.
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Yeah this a good solution.
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4 RepliesYes! Agreed. 1. Increase mag size by at least 2 or 3. 2. Increase range by 30% minimum. 3. Eliminate accuracy Nerf.
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3 RepliesPeople on reddit don't seem to agree with us.
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17 RepliesWe got bungie's attention on hand cannons. YES! The accuracy obviously needs a major buff. •I would argue that magazine capacity needs to be raised as well. Other primaries have the magazine capacity to kill 3+ guardians and they have a higher reload speed. •if bungie is feeling generous a slight range increase would be nice too. While I agree that their range was too much during the hand cannon meta, since then they have effectively fixed damage drop off. Range should be restored to 2/3 of what it was. •best example for my arguement would be my favorite weapon I've used from any game, Last word. I would like it to do what makes it exotic, being fired from the hip in close quarters to have a fair fight against someone with a shotgun. But that's all it does right now. It doesn't have the capability to operate as a primary. It has a magazine of 8 and if all bullets hit you can get 2 kills with a magazine. I want to be able to effectively aim down sights and be on an even playing field against someone at medium range. If you truly have used this weapon since 2.0 you know everything I'm talking about. Find my youtube video if you dont. It's on my gamertag.
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if you can get an imago loop (pref w/ firefly) you wont be dissapointed.
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How about take away all aim assist
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1 ReplyOk so your my long lost cousin who's not obsessed with fusion rifles instead of hand cannons, I might not have that amount of kills with them as I am forced by friends to use something else. But my favourite special weapon is a fusion rifle.
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Hand cannon ammo also makes them a pain to use. I'm a holdout who keeps using them, but in any mission I play with friends I'm running out of primary all the freaking time. They al laugh - their scouts rifles seem to always have ammo. My melee kills are going up because of the time I just have to run around punching stuff waiting for a white brick to drop
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2 RepliesBungie wants one type of gun to be the meta. First auto's, next hand cannons, now pulse rifles and next will be scouts. So keep the ones you like!
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Last word range is poor but still good gun
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Shotgunning sunbros are the new meta. No accuracy needed. Destiny meta is cheese right now.
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1 ReplyYup. The ppl at bungie must love pulse rifles. They effectively killed any primary weapon competition for pulse rifles with 2.0. The new "balance" leaves you with a crucible lobby of 80-90%+ pulse rifles. ARs, Scouts and HC need to be buffed or pulse rifles need to be taken down a few notches if they actually want balance in crucible.
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the simple thing bungie could have done is these simple fixes to the most common problems with hand cannons Last Word They could have disabled fan fire during ads and fixed last word perk so it would not proc whilst aiming down sights. Thorn Reduced RoF buffed impact and reduce DoT on poison so it was more of a sheild eater then light drainer. Personally I have no idea how Hawkmoon worked prepatch (since I'm on Xbox) so those are my ideas on pre TTK exotic hand canons.
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1 ReplyI'm not afraid to say that I think they need a slight range increase 'as well as' an accuracy increase.
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The issue is they don't want hand cannon to compete at range with Scouts and high range pulse rifles. What they should do to keep that idea in mind is reduce stability in place of reducing accuracy. so you CAN hit things, but firing quickly becomes less effective the further your target it. They've even said, time and time again that Hand Cannons are supposed to reward accuracy, and that they want them to be a weapon where it makes you pace your shots. But currently it isn't like that at all.
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Bump Hand cannons need: -to have some range back (a primary needs to be able to hold the midrange) -no more phantom bullets (buff accuracy) -remove nerf to fast fire accuracy -remove initial shot accuracy nerf -buff reserve and magazine ammo size Reward accuracy
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4 RepliesThis was especially irritating when doing the Imprecation quest since most of the time I felt like none of my shots were even hitting and when having to do the task to get the 7 headshots in one game, I simply couldn't do it. Ended up having to boost in order to get those kills cause too many of the maps were long and open for the use of a handcannon to really be viable.
