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Edited by Reebzy85: 6/22/2014 6:34:55 PM
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9 Very Specific Criticisms of Destiny Alpha's GUI, Races, Item Details, Emotes, and Death Penalty [Warning: Long & with images!]

Bear with me on this one, there is no TL;DR! Thanks in advance for reading guys and girls. These are super detailed criticisms, and are a by-product of level-capping all Destiny classes and about 23h+ of Alpha playtime. 1. [b]**Item Type**[/b] - I've picked up an Assault Rifle. I've picked up a Sniper. I've picked up a Scout. Which one is Primary? Which one is Secondary? Ok, it's easy enough to remember now, BUT as Bungie adds new items to the game, it could be a VERY expensive mistake for someone buying a Vendor item for the wrong slot (especially when considering Crucible token purchases). - Example: Check out this image - http://i.imgur.com/j2iYPaB.png 2. [b]**Item Level**[/b] - Item levels help us understand min/max of random number generation. Have I hit the max Attack for a level 8 weapon? Should I keep trying to farm an area? Should I keep trying to buy those UnId items hoping for a better roll? I don't know because we can't track that data once it's lost. - Example: Refer to image in #1. 3. [b]**Impact of Item Stats**[/b] - Are the stat bars linear? Exponential? Does the maximum value shift as I level up? It's hard to tell what my trade-off is in weapon choice just by looking at those bars. It feels vague. - Example: Refer to image in #1. 4. [b]**Negative Item Stats (Gear Only)**[/b] - This one is quirky! ItemA has Intellect. ItemB does NOT have Intellect. The current UI will only display positive increases to stats, not negatives if the new gear does not have that same stat. This doesn't' appear to impact weapon items. - Example: Look at this image - http://i.imgur.com/mIKlFGU.png 5. [b]**Item Pickup Quantity vs. Total Quantity**[/b] - Picking up an should show both how many you just collected, and the total in your inventory without stopping, opening menu, scrolling to inventory, then hunting for that item. Pretend I'm farming Spinmetal for Crucible rep (or whatever). I'm doing Open World missions to kill the time between farming. I want to know when I hit multiples of 20 without slowing down my farm. - Example: Sorry for poor quality image, best I could find. But it shows what I mean: http://i.imgur.com/Dk1NhMT.png 6. [b]**Utility Emotes and DPad Usage**[/b] - Give me "Follow <target>", "Go, Go, Go!", or "Take The Point <target>", "Help! Help!", or "Thank you!". While I would LOVE everyone to use their mic's, it's not reality. That said, don't get rid of "Dance" and "Wave", just make it X+D-Up, or X+D-Down, etc. 7. [b]**Racial Bonuses**[/b] - Controversial topic, but I want some more impact to my racial choice. It could be minor, but it should still matter. Maybe it's a simple as Humans get +2% discipline, Exo get +2% strength, and Awoken get +2% intelligence. VERY ROUGH examples, but you guys get the point. 8. [b]**Death Penalty**[/b] - Very controversial topic, but I did not feel impacted by dying. Dying should be a bigger deal. Now, I'm not talking about a monetary penalty (that's boring), but hell, if I die 5 times in 5 minutes in Devil's Lair Legendary, I feel like the game should signal to me "Hey buddy, I think it's time you go back and try something your speed" with a "Res Sickness" (50% reduction in stats) or similar mechanic for 3 minutes. 9. [b]**Character Personality**[/b] - I'm the guy who spends 2h in character creation. Let me take my helmet off ALL THE TIME Bungie, please? (or at least, allow clear visor helmets?). Also, can I pick the Armor color when I start my new character? They could be a small choice of 3 colors, and they could be crappy colors, but just give us a little extra taste in the customization department. It also lets newbies know that more Armor colors can be unlocked somewhere in the game in future. Thanks again for reading! I loved the Alpha, but with some small tweaks this game can hit 11/10.

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  • *cough cough* there must be a necrobug around here somewhere.

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  • looking at your profile you haven't level capped a single class, care to explain?

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    • Edited by Majik12: 8/8/2014 1:26:14 AM
      agree with all of this. And i have said most of the same stuff before. I made a simliar topic, and have voiced that they need a better UI, and menus. like as you said leaving the weapons level requirment listed even when you go past that level as wel as numbers next to the bars. In my topic I also added. 1.In crucible make the blue teams bar brighter, its really dark and ussually against a dark gun or environment,so it is hard to read most of the time. 2.Let us dismantle weapons from within the vault, even if you hit "option" to go to your character inventory from the vault, you still cant dismanlel items. You have to first grab the item from the vault. Then exit the vault, then when outside, re enter your inventory, find the item again, and then dismantle. very tedious for multiple items, and no reason. 3. brighter vertical beams of light on ammo and loot on the ground. So you can see them under water or hidden in grass, etc. they are there now, but just super subtle. 4. Comma Rose sort of like BF4. with preset commands. basically like what you have said. though there should also be a "looking for fireteam" command. And i think it should be in the ghost menu. So along with "go to orbit", "spawn sparow", there should be text commands assigned to the d pad there. That pop up text on the screen just like the emotes now.

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    • Some really good thoughts here

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    • No

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    • Still agree with all of this

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      • 1. I got use to the weapons rather quickly. That said. I admit. It would be nice if we could designate/have Merchants sort/catagorize weapons by: Primary, Secondary, & heavy. 2. No. I have grown to absolutely HATE Item Levels with the hatred of 10,000 demons. All items levels cause in the end is create a divide amongst the playerbase. Now if you simply mean, the items keep there level visible. Then sure. I disliked having my armor tell me "Requires lvl 7" then at 7 it just was wearable. No level at all. But item levels. No. Sadly I have yet to see a single community use them properly. All you'll start seeing is folks screaming stuff like: "LFM for _____ Strike. Must have ilvl _!" The game already checks your gear and shows you if its effective & if you can enter while in Orbit. If you aren't geared enough it denies or warns you. Bungie seems to be trying to keep the player skill factor & fun first mentality as there main goal. 3. Agreed. 4. Meh...I feel that adds an extra lvl of complexity not really needed. I know some folks enjoy that stuff but considering we won't have the traditional "Trinity" system. It feels a little unnecessary. 5. Meh. The inventory is easy enough to check. 6. Agreed. I have no idea how they expect folks to make friends when we can't even talk. I know they want to avoid it but Prox chat is needs to be added. But it should be PTT and perhaps limited/restricted in cities/sanctuaries. Predetermined phrases would do wonders too. 7. Hell no. Not only will this create a min/max effect. It'll also create nothing but balance patches, & player ire. Guilds/Clans will be like: "You're not an Exo Titan so you are flawed. Get lost." Players will end up picking race to better there class. 8. Well they can always use EXP Debt. EQ2 used that for awhile & it was brutal. The only time debt did not become an issue was at the lvl cap. 9. I want dozens of faces, hair, features, and etc for all the races. My biggest disappointment was that we have no Alien race. We have Humans, Evolved Humans, Robots, and no Aliens...almost every Sci-Fi Trope was met. I refuse to believe Humanity had a "Golden Age" & made NO friends.

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      • I would really like the option to turn the HUD off completely to save my TV from further HUDs burned into it's corners. White and Yellow burn very easily too. At least a size slider for the HUD.

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        • I don't agree with the helmet thing even though the traveler terra formed things stuff like the moon still doesn't have any atmosphere. Only place I could see you having no helmet is old Russia and I'm pretty sure missing a vital piece of gear that protects you head isn't worth it.

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        • 0
          1) it took all of three seconds to learn which weapon is which type... Image if every weapon said "Primary: Scout Rifle" there is only one option. There will never be a "Secondary: Scout Rifle" it'll feel like like Bungie is slapping you in the face and calling you an idiot every time I'm reminded a primary weapon is a primary weapon. Most other ideas are good. Tactical emote would be nice, preferably an option to bind which ever emotes we'd like to the d pad.

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          • Edited by so much pumpkins: 7/1/2014 12:54:01 AM
            I agree on everything except for death penalty, that sounds awful because if I have just lost and got beat up so many times, I don't need to be punished even further. I don't like racial bonuses either. everyone can be smart or strong, regardless of who they are.

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          • I really think there shouldnt be too much UI and numbers on the screen. It seems to me that you want this to become diablo or WoW in fps form. Every point you mentioned is already in either of those games..... I think its rather good not to show the rolling range of a weapons stats, because a lot of players will be, -blam!- this weapon its not maxxed on x, y and q. If it doesn't show the max range players are more likely to think, hey this weapon might be usefull, let me try it out. NO RACIAL BONUSSES, NON NADA NIENTE! If i want to make a specific build for a character (and yes im a min maxer) I don't want to be locked into a certain race to get the most out of my build. I wan't to be able to create a character which I like, and not be bound to a certain race cause of stupid racials.

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          • Edited by boo its dan: 6/28/2014 12:53:00 AM
            I honestly disagree with almost all of that. Most of your early suggestions would cause way too much clutter to the UI and things like weapon level are pointless. I honestly don't see how any of that would provide any new useful information. I wouldn't mind more emotes so I can agree there. I could also see there being a reasonable penalty for dying (small loss of glimmer?), but not something that tries to push you away from the challenge like you suggested. I don't see a point in giving us a few crappy armor colors for the sake of two seconds worth of customization out of the gate. I prefer they are all earned, and as long as the final game has good variety with armor shaders then I won't complain. For me, the main concerns I have with the alpha are few major and minor things. I would like the ability to turn off the HUD for a cinematic experience. Most regular enemies have obvious weak points (head, back) and there are certain ques that bosses display when their weak point is exposed so it wouldn't make the game impossible. I would also like a tweak to the AI's pathing. Right now they stay zoned in an area which sort of makes them feel stupid. The AI behavior is ok up close, but they have a limited range for both awareness and kiting. I feel they should be given unlimited range to kite or flank the human player. Also, they tend to have poor accuracy and shoot slow so I want that toned up as well. This is what I want fixed with the game. Call me a hater, but I care about gameplay over a few numbers that display useless information.

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          • All very valid points there my friend. Would also love to change to 3rd person view...I found myself hitting L3 to change perspectives far too many times during the Alpha... and they could make it so that when you start shooting it automatically switches you back to 1rt person, that way you don't get all clogged up.

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          • Edited by ash: 6/24/2014 10:17:43 PM
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            1. Yes.* 2. Yes.* 3. Eh... Yes?* 4. Yes.* 5. Meh.* 6. More emotes would be lovely. 7. No. [i][url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YKss2uYpih8]NO.[/url][/i] 8. Nope. I think maybe a limited amount of respawns per person would be good though. Like Firefight. In Devil's Lair, you can just have one player AFK in a safe-place and use them as a spawn point... which is one way to cheese the "Don't Die" bounty. 9. /Hide-head-slot would be cool. But the character customisation isn't meant to be in depth, Joe Staten said as much during a talk at GDC. * I take it a lot of UI elements are absent to keep it free of clutter btw.

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          • Edited by Stauffe: 6/23/2014 2:19:57 PM
            Not sure if this has already been said, but if you go to the guy with bounties in the tower, he actually does offer a bounty which benefits you if you go through an event or a strike without dying, and I know those points go towards getting better gear. I'd say that's some incentive to stay alive.

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          • Edited by NiGhTcRaWlErM: 6/23/2014 8:34:20 PM
            I for one would love to be able to remove your helmet anywhere and at anytime, or at least on logical places such as Earth. I understand that it wouldn't be smart to not have a helmet during combat, but what's the point of having it on if you feel it's ugly and you don't really need it? Shouldn't you be able to make you character look how you want, armor and all? Plus, I'd like to show off my sexy face wherever I am. ^^

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            • 1) I must have put it out of mind if weapons did NOT show what slot they slotted into. 2-3) Don't they all have a base damage and the only thing that increases stats is rarity and self-type?(sorry, by self-type im trying to refer to: how a scout rifle have a slow fire rate, but you can come across a different kind of scout rifle type that has a faster fire rate but lower damage). If weapons do have a radomized based stat... i dunno, i would say they should show what you have as a base... and that goes for increases from +%'s from rarity if it also isn't a set number. 4) Not a big deal, but they could include it. From what i seen from games made for console is that the text boxes or whatever are slower... not allowing or dev's just don't allow all that much information so blind people can read everything or some crap. 5) A small display of item and number of item should display in some corner of the screen. I suppose even how many you now currently have. 6) I agree, there direction pad needs to be put to better use; since there won't be a prox voice chat (AND THANK GOD, unless it became PTT then i wouldn't mind it at all) nor a text chat system (cause omg, a keyboard would be like $10 and make things sooooo freaking easy to be social). The basic commands need to be important "Help" "Defender there(icon on map?)" "Focus this target" etc, Dance and such should be done with a held button + direction pad as you said. IMO, PUGS should be avoided like some disease, but you will have to play with them sometimes. 7) TERRIBLE. Its a neat thing to have but its just better to leave it out and nobody will miss it. The only differences about races should be their looks. Too bad we have Humans, magical smurf humans, and robots. They could have had some race that came with the Travel (or races) that escaped the Hive/darkness/bad-touches. 8) I agree, Deaths do need a penalty, so far it has: - Fights reset after everyone dies, this is a decent thing. You can't have it so people beat their heads off the wall for loot to drop. I remember when i played Halo campaign with a friend on highest difficulty. He eventually would just bull-charge into fights doing as much damage and kill as possible, then he would auto-res and repeat. It would eliminate skill and the enjoyment of the game. So far its people doing dumb crap or not paying attention, and why not since there really is no penalty. I think something more has to be done, at least for Strikes and Raids. Examples: - Buddy ressing timer x2-3 higher, cause its a serious joke that i can run in the open with a dozen enemies and res him and likely make it back alive. "Stop diving like an idiot, i rather not spend 1/2 the match ressing you bro!" - Durability, yep... you keep it up and gl finishing this place buddy(but this won't work with people being able to carry a dozen of everything). - Auto self res (30secs) increases as you die during the fight(untill boss is dead or reseted, maxed at 2mins). This is probably best along with the buddy ressing timer increased. No more bashing your head against a boss till it dies. And increases the importance of teamwork as well, cause you will probably fail for sure if you don't freaking pick up your teammates. - I would also like to see bosses heal over time so people can just cover a dozen times waiting for teammates to spawn(although they probably deserve the loot if they took 45+mins for a single boss fight, lol). - Boss or mini boss fights should require the whole team to be at a place to start the fight (everyone hold button at this place), then locking everyone within the area. I never checked if it does already, but seemed people had way to much hiding space. - A hit of few hits will break saving someone. - Bleeding out repeatably keeps scaling down the until-bleedout timer. IMO, just increasing the buddy res timer by x2-3 higher and a scaling self-res timer would be enough. Which then increases the chances for encounter resets. I think this would also push team play and the need for some form of skill, face bashing should never be an answer. People wouldn't take any kind of penalty unless you let a teammate bleed out, and not even at first. Only an ass would run into the open and die, cause I wouldn't bother if saving them took twice as long to get them up 9) I would love a great deal of customization move, just double or triple what they currently got going. One major thing is hair styles.. which is pretty damn weak from Alpha. I think helmets should stay on the field. Sorry if I answered/replied to any questions wrong.

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            • Very good post! Loved 1-3. The more understanding we have of weapons the better decision we can make for our armory.

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            • These were all great points! I hope Bungie listens and takes them into account.

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            • I agree on the death penalties...doesn't have to be much, just some disincentive associated with thoughtless play. Maybe +5 sec on the respawn timer after every 5th death (e.g. 1-5 deaths, normal time, 6-10 deaths, +5 seconds, 11-15 deaths, +10 seconds, etc. As far as racial bonuses go - first of all shouldn't they be calling them species? You can't treat races anything BUT equally without treading into unintended but ugly implications, but that's beside the point - there's no way the Exo are [i][/i]homo sapiens[i][/i], right? Anyhow, it's similarly difficult to think that a race of synthetics would have the exact same health, regeneration, and agility as two other species...unless there's some silly explanation for that much coincidence in the lore somewhere...?

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            • I really like number 9 because I'm such a creative freak when it comes to my characters in games. I'll probably take a hour to create my character when the game launches. The problem with number 8 for me is that I don't want to have to worry about my gear degrading if I happen to really stink it up one day. Could this be a option for some players? I don't see why not. Just not for me.

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            • [quote]7. **Racial Bonuses** - Controversial topic, but I want some more impact to my racial choice. It could be minor, but it should still matter. Maybe it's a simple as Humans get +2% discipline, Exo get +2% strength, and Awoken get +2% intelligence. VERY ROUGH examples, but you guys get the point. [/quote] No thx, go away with your unbalance

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              • Well, I don't like 7 and 8 for reasons others have mentioned already. Also, I think #3 should be an option, not mandatory, because I'm not one who's to nitpicky with stats and I prefer the aesthetic without too many numbers crowded into the little info boxes.

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              • I agree with most of the things. However many things was not turned on in alpha. One thing is gear are going to need repears (spelling). So the more damage you take and the more you die the more resources you need to fix your shit. Any way good post bro

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                • Don't like 7 and 8. 7 - I don't want to have to take Race A to make the best hunter or warlock, and that's what you are proposing. A RACE should not depict performance of a CLASS. - Now, I would like it if the RACE would influcence other NPCs or FACTIONs within the game and how they interacted with my toon. This may compel me to pick other RACEs with my toon to try them and see what other missions or experiences I encountered, especially if they were further modified by the Race + sex combination from certain NPCs in the game... - Same goes for SEX. If a FEMALE or a MALE received certain dialogue or Options from certain NPCs in the game and as a result received certain quests, then it means your SEX had an impact in the game and would compell you to try other MALE / FEMALE choices with your other characters. 8. DEATH PENALTY SUCKS... mainly because it SLOWS the game down for some folks. I'm not liking that idea at all. It also focuses on the negative side of the game. However, I think you would do the opposite, and we seen some of that in the alpha. - First, you could have a native buff int the game... which I think we already did see in some capacity in the bronze, silver and gold star for public events... perhaps if you get through without dieing in any story mission, patrol, strike or bounty, you get a modest buff / reward for doing so... thus, a focus on "no death" benefit or at least it's one of the metrics used in the overall glory calculation for your reward... but whose to say it isn't already? - Next, we seen that from the BOUNTY, there was a specific goal to survive a strike without dieing... not an easy task, but that bounty had a specific reward if you chose to accept it. That could further reward you for your over achieving play style and no-holds barred legendary performance... which also brings me to the brave, legendary... expert difficulties. Those could be further modifiers on the mission, bounty, strike, etc reward... (kind of like setting skulls?) so it all bases itself on how difficult you want to make it, then have the no death as a modifier in the equation when calculating your overall performance / contribution to the enemies squashed and your reward in the end. - but I am NOT in favor of a Death penalty which would slow things down...

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