JavaScript is required to use Bungie.net

Service Warning
We will be pushing a patch live tomorrow. Players will be required to log in to Destiny again after returning to the title screen to install the patch. You should not be removed from any activities you are currently in.

Feedback

Feedback and suggestions for Destiny.

8/2/2014 5:26:43 PM
11

The Reality of Raid Matchmaking

I posted this in the regular forums, but figured it would fit better here. There are three sides to this. One side says: Raids are not something you can tackle with a group of random people. They require preparation, communication, and cooperation - things you won't get from a group of random people. People will rage-quit, drag others down, argue, and it will make for a weak experience, if it could even be called that. Just make a group to play with! The other side says: Realistically, I can't find five friends to group up with whenever I want. The people that don't want matchmaking don't have to use it; let me use it if I choose, because it isn't their problem. There is no reason it shouldn't at least be an OPTION in the game. If I want to take the harder path, let me. I know what I'm getting into, and again, it's my choice The third side is Bungie's side: Bungie has said the raids are going to be extremely difficult, more so "than anything they've ever created." Players eligible for raids are going to be people who have played Destiny for a very long time and have awesome gear. But on top of this, Raids are going to still require a lot of preparation, cooperation, and strategy by the 6-man teams. Right now, the reality is there is no matchmaking. When Bungie explains their raid(s), they say it's going to be insanely hard with a coordinated team IN MIND. To Bungie, matchmaking for raids is a bad idea; this is a fact. When they see people asking for matchmaking, to them, it COULD BE (emphasis on COULD BE) the equivalent of people asking for a Hell Mode where you start at level 1, and every enemy is level 20. But if you beat it, you get awesome loot. Impossible. If they put that mode in the game, people would be mislead into thinking it's actually beatable. Bungie would obviously never do that. The same thing can be said for Raids with matchmaking. But sure, put in a mode or option that could very potentially be of no benefit to anyone, and simultaneously taint the view of the game when it is "stupidly hard" and/or "impossible" to beat. Bungie isn't going to encourage people to play the game in a way they say isn't practical. Yeah, matchmaking for raids will give people the option to try the raid. Completing it seems to be a whole other story, and I say this because of what Bungie has said, not just my personal opinion. Matchmaking for raids may mislead people into thinking the raid is actually beatable with random people. If it really isn't, or practically isn't, they're not going to put effort into putting that feature in the game. They'll put effort into telling people to just find a group. They've already made this clear.
Add more answer options

Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post.

  • Need matchmaking
    Add more answer options

    Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post.

  • Edited by DEZARATH: 8/3/2014 9:21:46 PM
    The main reason I want Matchmaking is I am a hardcore PVE player. I will be running the Raids. And I will want to do it a lot of times whenever I can especially if there's multiple drops of differing armor and weapons on completion. That doesn't mean my friends and clan mates will be available at 3am or 1am in the morning on my whim. They like PVP and campaign and they deserve to play the game how they want without me nagging them to join up for three hours again and again till I'm tired of it. By then We'll all be a level 30s looking for end game missions in Destiny while cycling through whatever diversity it has to offer. I don't really care if I fail or some random quits six hours into the raid. I'll be at again and again. I expect to have this thing frustrate the hell out of me. I expect other players to frustrate the hell out of me. That's the down side. The upside is well worth the down side. I might just walk away with two new friends I can get along with and talk to from my region from the 1am pool of advanced players wanting to play Raids due to the other idiots screwing up the game. Both long lasting friends who share the same desire to get back to fighting the raid. That's how I met most of my friends on XBL was due to brutal LASO moments, Or Firefight Limited. L4D with a tank end capping us all and we're just laughing at the way we all got destroyed. We're back at it on the next load screen. All made possible by Match Making with randoms all congregating to play together on the same mode they enjoy.
    Add more answer options

    Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post.

    5 Replies
    • Nobody cares what you nerds have to say about "oh jeez guis I know the real reason no mm for raid it be cause my IQ is 75 and I like candy canes" Just stfu and let the men get matchmaking because we don't got time for getting a team together manually, too busy getting it on with straight dimes, super models and then still gotta hit me Julie. It's a hard life for my junk.
      Add more answer options

      Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post.

      1 Reply
      • [quote]I posted this in the regular forums, but figured it would fit better here. There are three sides to this. One side says: Raids are not something you can tackle with a group of random people. They require preparation, communication, and cooperation - things you won't get from a group of random people. People will rage-quit, drag others down, argue, and it will make for a weak experience, if it could even be called that. Just make a group to play with! The other side says: Realistically, I can't find five friends to group up with whenever I want. The people that don't want matchmaking don't have to use it; let me use it if I choose, because it isn't their problem. There is no reason it shouldn't at least be an OPTION in the game. If I want to take the harder path, let me. I know what I'm getting into, and again, it's my choice The third side is Bungie's side: Bungie has said the raids are going to be extremely difficult, more so "than anything they've ever created." Players eligible for raids are going to be people who have played Destiny for a very long time and have awesome gear. But on top of this, Raids are going to still require a lot of preparation, cooperation, and strategy by the 6-man teams. Right now, the reality is there is no matchmaking. When Bungie explains their raid(s), they say it's going to be insanely hard with a coordinated team IN MIND. To Bungie, matchmaking for raids is a bad idea; this is a fact. When they see people asking for matchmaking, to them, it COULD BE (emphasis on COULD BE) the equivalent of people asking for a Hell Mode where you start at level 1, and every enemy is level 20. But if you beat it, you get awesome loot. Impossible. If they put that mode in the game, people would be mislead into thinking it's actually beatable. Bungie would obviously never do that. The same thing can be said for Raids with matchmaking. But sure, put in a mode or option that could very potentially be of no benefit to anyone, and simultaneously taint the view of the game when it is "stupidly hard" and/or "impossible" to beat. Bungie isn't going to encourage people to play the game in a way they say isn't practical. Yeah, matchmaking for raids will give people the option to try the raid. Completing it seems to be a whole other story, and I say this because of what Bungie has said, not just my personal opinion. Matchmaking for raids may mislead people into thinking the raid is actually beatable with random people. If it really isn't, or practically isn't, they're not going to put effort into putting that feature in the game. They'll put effort into telling people to just find a group. They've already made this clear.[/quote]I say make it lvl 20 exclusive
        Add more answer options

        Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post.

      • Edited by fifthderelicte: 8/4/2014 7:44:48 PM
        You know the crazy thing about people who say raids don't work in MM is that they overlook the fact that MM has been around for over a decade. On top of trueskill and MM systems in general, Xbox (don't know about PS) adds other layers where you can provide feedback on players who quit or are detrimental to the task you all agreed upon by entering MM. Now, it is obviously very possible that matchmaking doesn't simply find you a match, but it matches you with players based on particular criteria that can put you in a similar party fairly accurately. Isn't that what MM has been doing for decades? Halo had some of the best matchmaking ever. I rarely had extremely one-sided games, and that was back in 2004. I'm sure raids are fairly complex, but come on...
        Add more answer options

        Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post.

      • Great post. So many people are begging for Raid MM that I fear Bungie will compromise in someway, diluting the experience. Hardcore content should be reserved for hardcore players. Am I missing something?
        Add more answer options

        Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post.

        3 Replies
        • I've said this before on other posts, but I think cross platform multiplayer would fit in great here. I know many people have moved on to next gen consoles and many have remained on current gen, but those players are still friends. If you need teamwork and you need friends to complete these challenges, allow players to join together on different consoles. It was said that cross platform was cut [i]deliberately[/i] in order to keep new generation players from having an advantage in PvP because of greater resolution in the graphics, [i]not[/i] because making cross platform was a technical problem. However, raids are team based activities, not PvP, essentially nullifying the argument of segregating due to better resolution. I can't think of a more enjoyable way to complete a raid than playing on my Xbox 360 with my friend on PS4. That would truly set this game apart, and if it is technically possible, why not implement it for the co-operative multiplayer aspects of this game?
          Add more answer options

          Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post.

        • They just need to give us an in game browse-able group finder/creator where you can list what you're looking for and seamlessly find other people, chat with them, and play together. This having to add to friends list thing to play together is nonsense. I want to, heck, well NEED to be able to pug a player ever now and then! Not to mention that the group finder would just be a great way to meet people in general to run better organized strikes/explore etc..
          Add more answer options

          Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post.

          2 Replies
          • You.,, I like you
            Add more answer options

            Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post.

          • Edited by Richard: 8/3/2014 6:39:14 PM
            Well it depends on what sort of matchmaking they impelment. Skill-based matchmaking where players have to complete difficult tasks before being allowed to participate in raids would mean that your team-mates are adequately skilled and prepared for the challenge ahead. Matchmaking exists in many MMOs that have raids and those raids are extremely difficult but you are able complete them with strangers. Right? If Bungie thinks their difficult raids are such an issue then simply water-down matchmaking raids to make it easier and accessible to the average gamer while leaving the friends-only raids much harder with better loot. This is not rocket-science. There are ways that Bungie could include some sort of matchmaking while not changing the friends-only experience.
            Add more answer options

            Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post.

            2 Replies
            • Edited by No Mee: 8/4/2014 1:18:18 AM
              Why not just stick with the main 3 player fireteam and only allow full fireteams to enter matchmaking for the raids. Each fireteam would have teamwork, then u only have to figure out how to match up with the other fireteam. Its better than going online to find randoms that I dont know and probly wont cooperate with like I would if my friends were playing. I get that bungie probably put a lot of thought into this & this is how they want it, but I think it's a huge mistake. Why 6 people anyway- a fireteam is 3. Unless they are expecting 1 of every subclass to play? Just make it equally impossible but with 3 instead of 6. Just have to wait and see I guess. If I hate the raids but that's where the best gear is & people take that gear to pvp and make pvp suck because I dont play raids then I won't play the game much.
              Add more answer options

              Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post.

            preload icon
            preload icon
            preload icon
            You are not allowed to view this content.