[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] SpreadBridge74 Halo 4 looks like it's an assortment of gimmicks. When will they realize the previous Halo games were fine the way they were?[/quote] H4 was only done to fill the void between reach and the title comming for the xBox8 (infinity, 720, whatever). To leave the base with the toxic reach would have killed the game. ([i]which was bungies plan, make room for its new title[/i]) Only problem is that 343 cant do much with the massive dump that was bungies reach engine. They can try to tune it, but there is only so much you can do without a major investment ... so will be interesting to see how they handle this within the community. At lest they acknowledge the need to return to the true halo game. Will LOL when bungie do pull their finger out far enough to release their next title ... in the same week Microsoft release the new console (and sony sack even more workers and re-release old ps2 stock to keep afloat). Guess they may be able to port it to the wii - lol bungie.

Halo 4 looks like it's an assortment of gimmicks. When will they realize the previous Halo games were fine the way they were?

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] MR E0S A SERVER BROWSER! [/quote] Xbox 360 can't have server browsers, and a matchmaking system is always better. Why? -Lets take TF2 and its server system for the Xbox as an example. First, maps cannot be edited, as their is no master server and all maps are client based. That allows for exploits. Lots of exploits. Instead of an optimized match for skill and fun, you get mostly one-sided matches full of spawnkilling and ragequits. TF2 for Xbox actually has more problems with a server browser, but these two are universal among all games on the Xbox platform, and would be extremely apparent in Halo_. Quite simply, the Xbox is far too restrictive for a server browser for Halo_.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] MR E0S[/quote] Why do you keep trying so hard?

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Neutralism The way I see it everyone's opinions should be treated equally, the only problem is that my opinion is more equal than yours is.[/quote] i lol'd neut going huge [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] boomdeyadah Ruckus going huge.[/quote] This too. I agree with everything he typed up. Most of us didn't doom Reach to fail (even though the story is about it falling) and went in expecting a good Halo game to follow Halo 3. It was anything but, and the evidence is all right there. Many people will call me a Halo 4 fanboy, but it's far from the truth, as there are things in that game I'm very worried about and I hope 343 doesn't drop the ball. At this point though, I just want to play a damn Halo game with an active population and a sustain team that actually fixes things. If that fails and Halo 4 bombs, I'm probably done at this point. Halo hasn't been bread and butter for me since Halo 2 anyway. [Edited on 10.19.2012 2:05 PM PDT]

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Mikelp_1 After all of that, bloom would still be an inconsistent factor anyways; not as luck-based, but still luck based. In competitive gameplay (based upon two men entering and the better man winning), consistency is key. Is luck consistent? No. Why create a bloom system to stop the gun from cross-mapping people and to keep the gun in a range of maximum effectiveness when there are so many other ways that you can keep the gun in those same limits without completely trampling its consistency? You could easily make the gun have no bloom, but have a max rate of fire that is the slow and steady speed that bloom promotes, while the bullets are affected by distance, keeping competitive consistency in touch. [/quote] Most games in Halo are 4v4, not 1v1. How is it inconsistent if I know this information: Bloom has a slight bit of randomness that can screw me over if I continually keep 1v1 opponents. If I instead attempt to avoid combat until such a time as I can gain a 2v1 advantage against the enemy instead, bloom is typically not a factor. The only inconsistency is in the people who cry like this: "How can I go +30 and still lose...." Because you might be a badass who can aim, but you have no concept of teamwork. While your taking advantage of spawns, there were a few dedicated players on the other team actually going to work on the rest of your team. But you wouldn't know anything about that, because you're to busy flipping over spawns for easy kills. I've had plenty of teammates that have what I like to call "Tunnel-Vision". I'll watch their backs all day long, but the moment I come under fire their to busy running off on their "Rambo Rampage". Bloom was an attempt to get you mother -blam!-s to settle the -blam!- down and quit running around like chickens with your heads cut off and play the game in a more tactical format. You said... -blam!- tactical games. We'd rather run around like chickens with our heads cut off doing 1v1 in every corner of the map instead. Which is why every complaint you have against bloom involves 1v1 encounters. The first person who claims that they can consistently lose a 2v1 encounter because of bloom. Will be the only person who can talk. And you know what my response will be. YOU -blam!- SUCK! Nevermind the fact that you are all still complaining about 1 single weapon out of all the offensive tools available to you throught the game. Yet because this 1 weapon had bloom.... HOLY -blam!- -blam!-! Utility weapon indeed. Sprint is now considered utility. Jetpack will be soon to follow. Next thing you know you'll be playing Tribes:Ascension or Section 8:Prejudice But Tribes and S8:P will have something you won't. A SERVER BROWSER! Let me save you all some time. You want to play Halo 6? Go get Section 8:Prejudice. God knows it could use a boost in community population. [Edited on 10.19.2012 2:07 PM PDT]

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] kkrotz If you can't adapt to change, then you're a bad gamer.[/quote] 0/10 Try harder

Let's be honest here, Reach is still fun. Not as competitive as Halo 3, but fun nonetheless. If you can't adapt to change, then you're a bad gamer.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Neutralism People like you are the ones that ruin halo for everyone else. Reach is awful and Halo 4 is going to be awful. [/quote]

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] SuperCrack Oh please , you CALL ME a kid?[/quote] Yes. You make a point and become a massive snob when people don't agree with you. A big part of growing up includes being able to understand that people have views that don't match up with your own. [quote]Of course I am gonna reply on 10% of each post when 15 posters are only posting "you are a retard/retart logic detected/you suck".[/quote] Lol. There have been many posts that have not done such a thing, and yet there is still a general consensus that you're completely wrong and have no clue what you're talking about, yet that means nothing to you. Even if they do post "you are a retard" to rustle your jimmies, they still make points that correspond with the general consensus of mainly logical people. Of the arguments that are fully thought out and well-constructed, you just let it go straight over your head and go, "....er...no" if you don't ignore it entirely. Side note: this forum calls people retards because the same arguments have been proposed and shot down/disproven hundreds of thousands of times; people get tired of repeating themselves and find it easier to deal with people that have no clue what they're spewing through their keyboards by simply calling them a retard and sending them on their way. [quote]If you think that is how arguments take place in a forum ,YOU are the kid clearly and you are proving again that you are unable to form a sentence without a derogatory word in it. Simply because otherwise , your saying holds no weight.[/quote] If you look back at all of the first few posts that I've made on different forums, they're normally somewhat calm and collected disagreements and then they get more and more condescending as you prove to me how little you know, and how little your proposals/arguments are worth listening to. [quote]Good thing you have a bunch of followers to support you by making sentences in which half of the words are "retard" and "dumb". Freaking educated![/quote] As explained above. I made an argument that you could only respond to 10% at a time, normally spending the bulk of that response getting butthurt because I act condescending...or better yet, confident when I say that you really have no clue what you're talking about and no credibility. [quote]I don't know how a skill gap looks like? Oh no your point is so strong...! NO U! ....DUH[/quote] I would have responded with a better argument, but you would have ignored it. Nonetheless, you're bad at Halo, butthurt about it, and think you should be able to talk about the core mechanics affecting competitive play when you have no experience with it: the people that play with those mechanics at an extremely advanced level and the people that programmed every detail of those mechanics do... [quote]When I mentioned Counter Strike you didn't have to throw the "they are different games " argument. That is obvious.[/quote] Apparently I did have to, because controlling spammed triggers doesn't matter as much where every hit leaves a permanent scar (disregarding health kits) on the opponent and the kill-times are much faster... [quote]As far as the randomness of bloom goes tho , we can of course compare the two games. Counter strike random ?Not at all.For you to spam and get away with it you need to be a foot away from your opponent. In reach you can spam the DMR mid range, sometimes landing a 5sk sometimes NOT. So yeah if bloom was increased and tweaked it would be fine. The game without bloom would be way too simple.[/quote] Now the problem with more bloom in Halo is that Halo's health system operates on landing shots with little time in between, otherwise, the opponent's health regenerates... If bloom was increased, the weapon's kill-time would also go up drastically (and effective range would go down), leaving the weapon useless in the sandbox unless all other weapons were also nerfed in the same way to compensate, which would also mean that the shield-recharge time would need to go up drastically so that recharging doesn't happen mid-fight, which would make the gameplay much slower to an unplayable degree. After all of that, bloom would still be an inconsistent factor anyways; not as luck-based, but still luck based. In competitive gameplay (based upon two men entering and the better man winning), consistency is key. Is luck consistent? No. Why create a bloom system to stop the gun from cross-mapping people and to keep the gun in a range of maximum effectiveness when there are so many other ways that you can keep the gun in those same limits without completely trampling its consistency? You could easily make the gun have no bloom, but have a max rate of fire that is the slow and steady speed that bloom promotes, while the bullets are affected by distance, keeping competitive consistency in touch.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] CBWade16 You good sir speak the truth.Its a Shane people are calling you retarded and saying your completely wrong.[/quote] I really want to hear how adding a negative to a negative will result in a positive. I seriously want to hear how you can pull that off.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] SuperCrack The hating on Halo Reach by players and video game joirnalists is sad and funny. It is a trend on most videos I see for people to be praising Halo 4 and mocking Reach. The thing is that as amazing as Halo 4 seems , multiplayer wise is just a very extensively remastered version of Reach. The only new thing it brought is primary, secondary categories of weapons and perks.The rest are simply remastered Reach stuff and new weapons. The reason Reach receives the hate is because it was the one to try big changes first.Like bloom and armor abilities.So it acted like the frontline and now that people have accepted the change , Halo 4 gets to enjoy the praise. But I do hate on Bungie for gettin everything nice and perfect , even attempting to make all the sandbox good(hey plasma pistol that can kill again) AND THEN screwing it all up by listening to Beta people , buffing the DMR , givin DMR ONLY game types and makin HALO reach a monotonous one weapon , who shot first game AGAIN. Peace , love reach , wish bungie kept on making halo , now the people finally see and accept change , the next halo would be amazing.[/quote] You good sir speak the truth.Its a Shane people are calling you retarded and saying your completely wrong.

I don't understand why it matters to you that they hate it? I mean if you like it you can play it anytime you want to. People shouldn't be forced to love it just because you enjoy it. Same the other way around. People shouldn't be forced to hate it or think it is the worst Halo game just because you hate it. I thought the video game journalists liked Reach since it was praised and got high scores. Every game is going to be hated on by players, fans, etc. no matter what.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Umpalumpalump63 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Apocalypse Also, Halo 4 is awful too. [/quote] Even if you do somehow think Halo 4 is going to be bad, you should at least recognize it's going to be much better than Reach. Oops forgot you can't link Halo 4 related info.[/quote] lol, sad thing is its not going to be better than Reach. Its worse and I didn't think that was possible unless you seriously tried to get that as an outcome.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] SuperCrack [url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AHGItn8JCz0[/url] watch [/quote] This is what you present as evidence for your "more bloom = more consistency" ? I hope it's not. Now. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] SuperCrack you can spam the DMR mid range, sometimes landing a 5sk sometimes NOT[/quote] This little part is all that is needed to bring your hole argument down. The entire concept of being able to land a 5sk by spamming the trigger is what renders bloom "broken" and "inconsistent". Bloom is was designed to punish spammers and bloom as a hole, can, and often does, reward the spammer. With the video you linked, you see how bloom works in Reach and how it should of worked. The faster you spam, the bigger your hitting area becomes. In no shape or form, is the possibility of landing that lucky 5sk removed. Thinking "let,s add more bloom!" will only augment the area where your bullets can land. In no shape or form is the possibility of landing a lucky 5sk removed. Bloom would still be able to reward a spammer. Also, I want to focus a little bit on this. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] SuperCrack The game without bloom would be way too simple. [/quote] Removing bloom, such as what MLG has done, simply puts the player with the better shot above the other. Bloom wouldn't of received half the hate it gets if it had actually been properly implemented but sad reality is that it was. Trying to defend it doesn't make any sense. Well, it makes no sense if you're the type of player that bloom rewarded for being terrible.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Mikelp_1 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] SuperCrack You all call ME the troll YET you are the ones always quoting out of context and replying to only the parts you seem to like. None brought down my arguments you are just being immature and rude. Says enough about you. [/quote] Says the kid that argues about 10% of the content in each post directed at him and simply spits on the rest, pretending to be better than it as an excuse. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] SuperCrack I said that A LOT of bloom (more than in the final game) would add to skill gap. [/quote] You don't know what a skill gap looks like. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] SuperCrack What do you think of Bloom in CountetStrike series , does it take skill to master that ?[/quote] Did you know that Halo is a completely different game that has a health system based upon requiring multiple shots to die in rapid succession before the health bar replenishes itself? Did you also know that the bloom in CounterStrike is still inconsistent nonetheless? Spamming bullets with bloom, no matter how much higher it is than default Reach's, it still gives players a chance that they will get lucky/rewarded for spamming the trigger, which is the act that is supposed to be punished.[/quote] Oh please , you CALL ME a kid? Of course I am gonna reply on 10% of each post when 15 posters are only posting "you are a retard/retart logic detected/you suck". If you think that is how arguments take place in a forum ,YOU are the kid clearly and you are proving again that you are unable to form a sentence without a derogatory word in it. Simply because otherwise , your saying holds no weight. Good thing you have a bunch of followers to support you by making sentences in which half of the words are "retard" and "dumb". Freaking educated! I don't know how a skill gap looks like? Oh no your point is so strong...! NO U! ....DUH When I mentioned Counter Strike you didn't have to throw the "they are different games " argument. That is obvious. As far as the randomness of bloom goes tho , we can of course compare the two games. Counter strike random ?Not at all.For you to spam and get away with it you need to be a foot away from your opponent. In reach you can spam the DMR mid range, sometimes landing a 5sk sometimes NOT. So yeah if bloom was increased and tweaked it would be fine. The game without bloom would be way too simple. [url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AHGItn8JCz0[/url] watch

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] SuperCrack You all call ME the troll YET you are the ones always quoting out of context and replying to only the parts you seem to like. None brought down my arguments you are just being immature and rude. Says enough about you. [/quote] Says the kid that argues about 10% of the content in each post directed at him and simply spits on the rest, pretending to be better than it as an excuse. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] SuperCrack I said that A LOT of bloom (more than in the final game) would add to skill gap. [/quote] You don't know what a skill gap looks like. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] SuperCrack What do you think of Bloom in CountetStrike series , does it take skill to master that ?[/quote] Did you know that Halo is a completely different game that has a health system based upon requiring multiple shots to die in rapid succession before the health bar replenishes itself? Did you also know that the bloom in CounterStrike is still inconsistent nonetheless? Spamming bullets with bloom, no matter how much higher it is than default Reach's, it still gives players a chance that they will get lucky/rewarded for spamming the trigger, which is the act that is supposed to be punished. [Edited on 10.16.2012 10:51 AM PDT]

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Apocalypse Also, Halo 4 is awful too. [/quote] Even if you do somehow think Halo 4 is going to be bad, you should at least recognize it's going to be much better than Reach. Oops forgot you can't link Halo 4 related info. [Edited on 10.15.2012 8:23 PM PDT]

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Apocalypse Reach was hated on since the beta and all through its lifespan, it didn't "just" start getting hated on because of Halo 4, it always has been. Also, Halo 4 is awful too. [/quote] Agree. I also wish people would stop pulling the "the beta was better" card. Disagree. You can't say a game IS awful when it isn't even out yet.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] SuperCrack I said that A LOT of bloom (more than in the final game) would add to skill gap. [/quote] And I call you retarded. Adding more bloom will simply add more randomness than there already is. Mastering an insane amount of bloom would be the equivalent of mastering a dice roll. Done in 10 seconds and any retard with that lacks oposable thumbs can do it. I quote what I want because everything else is pointless text since it holds no credibility. Also, let's not forget to add that bloom in Reach was very poorly implemented. Again, do your homework and get your "facts" straighten out. Bloom is random. More bloom is more random. Period. [Edited on 10.15.2012 7:06 PM PDT]

I said that A LOT of bloom (more than in the final game) would add to skill gap. You all call ME the troll YET you are the ones always quoting out of context and replying to only the parts you seem to like. None brought down my arguments you are just being immature and rude. Says enough about you. What do you think of Bloom in CountetStrike series , does it take skill to master that ?

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Apocalypse Reach was hated on since the beta and all through its lifespan, it didn't "just" start getting hated on because of Halo 4, it always has been.[/quote] Agree. But some people gotta have something to blame, other than the truth. It obvious that bungie just lost heart with reach and the whole halo series ... perhaps even tried to kill it off rather than have to compete against it later - after they got dumped by Microsoft. Guess you cant blame them ... anyone getting sacked aint going to put a great final days work in.

Reach was hated on since the beta and all through its lifespan, it didn't "just" start getting hated on because of Halo 4, it always has been. Also, Halo 4 is awful too.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] boomdeyadah [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] AK FROST [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Johns Couch [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Neutralism People like you are the ones that ruin halo for everyone else. Reach is awful and Halo 4 is going to be awful. [/quote][/quote] It makes you guys really look intelligent then. Hey guys this game sucks but I will still play thousands of games though. The logic here.[/quote]Reach is better than lots of games out there, when you start comparing it to it's predecessors, it's bad.[/quote] I'm surprised b.net users still don't understand that concept.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] AK FROST [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Johns Couch [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Neutralism People like you are the ones that ruin halo for everyone else. Reach is awful and Halo 4 is going to be awful. [/quote][/quote] It makes you guys really look intelligent then. Hey guys this game sucks but I will still play thousands of games though. The logic here.[/quote]Reach is better than lots of games out there, when you start comparing it to it's predecessors, it's bad.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Johns Couch [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Neutralism People like you are the ones that ruin halo for everyone else. Reach is awful and Halo 4 is going to be awful. [/quote][/quote] It makes you guys really look intelligent then. Hey guys this game sucks but I will still play thousands of games though. The logic here. [Edited on 10.15.2012 12:17 AM PDT]