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Destiny

Diskutiere über alles, was mit Destiny zu tun hat.
Bearbeitet von D4rkFr4g: 10/16/2014 7:14:22 PM
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How DLC works and why Destiny's DLC is not in the main game

Here's how DLC works. A software company making a game decides what the original game is going to be and how much stuff is going to be in it. They work on the game and once all the coding is done there is still a lot of other work to be done. Voice overs, music, advertisements, dialog, packaging. It's a lot of work that they don't need the programmers to do. So for the 3-6 months that the company has until the game is actually released there are two options. They can fire all of the programmers and then rehire new ones down the road when they need to create new content. Or instead they can have them start working on DLC. The programmers can't continue stuffing content into the original game because it needs to be tested and QA'd and it takes a lot of time. Therefore they work on new content which after being tested and QA'd is usually ready shortly after release. This method works great because if anything does come up with the original game they have the original programmers there to fix it quickly. Would you prefer that they wait till after the game comes out and then start from scratch on DLC or would you rather have it shortly after release? Please note, a lot of Engineers get fired in the one scenario. Sometimes the DLC is even ready before the original game is released. This doesn't mean that it is owed to you and should be in the original game. That's not how it works. You knew that there would be DLC and you knew that it wouldn't be in the original game. Here is an Op-Ed from Ars Technica that goes into a bit more detail. It even covers on-disc dlc. The part I recommend is the last section. "They should work on the main game first!" I've also included the image from that section that includes a flow chart of game and dlc development. [url]http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2012/10/op-ed-why-on-disc-downloadable-content-isnt-a-big-deal/[/url] If you would like to suggest a more improved system of game development I would be glad to listen. If your method could improve upon what is already in place I'm sure you would be a valuable asset in the industry. Not just for video games but software in general.

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  • There seems to be this sort of nonchalance about the way publishers have been handling the video game industry lately. It's devolved into a race to the bottom for who can churn out the most “broadly appealing” title while having as many monetary nickel and diming schemes as possible, to boost revenue and hopefully turn a profit. One of the biggest and more deplorable schemes happening right now is something called disc-locked content or on-disc DLC, a method that locks finished content behind a pay-wall on a full priced retail disc, requiring additional funds to unlock said content. Recently, Ars Technica wanted to quell some of the vitriol surrounding gamers' perception of on-disc DLC or disc-locked content claiming that it's not that big of a deal. So basically, Ars Technica writer Kyle Orland wrote a somewhat middle-of-the-road piece about on-disc DLC not being as bad as people are making it out to be, following the recent fallout over Resident Evil 6's on-disc DLC discovery, which nearly had pitchforks and torches out all over the place. Orland also claims that there are justifiable reasons for disc-locked content in games, even though we've gone through several generations of gaming without it and have had games made of impeccable quality without the need for any DLC at all (i.e.,GTA: San Andreas, Baldur's Gate, Anachronox, Shadow of the Colossus, etc., etc.) But let's be real here and ask the obvious question: If you have finished content that's done and certified on the gold master disc why are you locking it away if the game is not free-to-play or budget priced? Locking away more than $110 worth of content on the Street Fighter X Tekken disc was completely unacceptable and a slap in the face to gamers. What sort of moron actually defends wanting to pay more for standard features that are common features in every other gameplay experience out there? In fact, even Namco Bandai veteran and Tekken producer Katsuhiro Harada felt disc-locked content -- especially for key features such as fighters and stages -- was wrong on many levels and opted to include as much free DLC as possible for Tekken Tag Tournament 2 to off-set the bad press fighting games had received due to the Street Fighter X Tekken fiasco. One of the common arguments on behalf of on-disc DLC or disc-locked content is that it's easier for gamers to access the goods and removes the need to download anything other than an access key. The other argument is that on-disc DLC is done by a separate team on a separate budget, thus it justifies a separate price (take note that this is just a rumor and in the cases where on-disc DLC was discovered, the guilty party has never publicly admitted or proved the content was on a separate budget.) Plain and simple: If content is finished in time for certification and ships with the master gold print for manufacturing, there's no reason why it couldn't be included with the game from the start. It's obvious it's a cash grab, even Michael Pachter admits it looks plain greedy that certified content is withheld from consumers just to make more money. If DLC is designed by a separate team on a separate budget but it's finished in time for certification does that mean gamers should also pay for out-sourced material such as art, additional sound cues and cinematics that were done on a separate budget by a separate team? Now we're getting into meta-pricing for video game costs. How much of what's not part of the original design, coding or certification should gamers be paying extra for? Most companies contract third-party studios to put together cinematics, so should those have an extra $5 price tag since it was designed separate from the main game? What about concept art or tech demos? These sometimes appear on game discs as extras...should we pay extra to even view them? Do you see how ridiculous this line of thinking gets? When you get into the disc-locked content debate, it usually boils down to why the content has to be locked in the first place. Heck, even developers admit that some games purposefully have content cut away for monetary purposes, as exposed by Paradox Interactive's senior producer Gordon Van Dyke in his interview with Rock, Paper, Shotgun... “Sometimes day-one DLC is [content that was cut from the final game],” ... “To be honest, sometimes it really is. It does happen for pre-order stuff, because sometimes you don’t have the time to make that extra content. But other times, a studio might have a completely separate team, and they’re off on their own. But the end consumer doesn’t understand that – nor should they have to.” In reality, the debate about disc-locked content or on-disc DLC is a battle between those who don't understand gaming culture and don't see it as a bad thing and those who do understand gaming culture and don't like the idea that games are being cut up piecemeal for bottom lines and profit margins. When someone like Ars' Orland writes as if on-disc DLC is not that bad a thing or has some sort of reasonable paradigm behind it other than greed, we can easily see that this isn't someone who plays games often enough to be considered a hardcore gamer. It's the very reason why the FGC had a furor when they found out about the locked characters on the Street Fighter X Tekken disc, meaning that they would have to pay extra to play as their favorites. It's also the same reason why BioWare fans threw a fit when they found out part of Javik's files were already complete and playable on the Mass Effect 3 disc save for his mission and sound files meaning that they would have to fork over cash to find out the rest of the game's lore, and it's the same reason why gamers were pissed when Deep Silver patched in a block on already accessible content in Risen 2 for content they already paid for and had access to. As mentioned, if you're not a core gamer then you won't mind that you would have to pay to reload a clip in a first-person shooter. And if you're not a real core gamer you wouldn't mind that part of a game's story is already on the disc but locked away behind a pay-wall or that specific characters in a tournament fighting game have a $20 price tag while a competing game lets you unlock fighters simply by playing the game and unlocking stuff the old fashioned way. Diluting a game with on-disc DLC just to nickel and dime doesn't grow or evolve or enhance the gaming industry, it just lines the pockets of publishers and makes gamers feel as if they've been tricked into a shady deal where they're getting less than what they thought they were paying for. It should also be noted that attackers of on-disc DLC are long-time gamers and defenders of on-disc DLC have only really gotten into gaming this gen. We're looking at content that was common in the generations before but is now being removed and re-added with a price-tag this gen. That's not to mention that technology makes it easier than ever to design content, heck even Gearbox admitted that they can pump out DLC for Borderlands 2 in a matter of hours thanks to the Unreal Engine's design hooks. Many may claim that those who haven't embraced on-disc DLC are a “vocal minority” but we're the core gamers who live, eat and breathe games. We've been playing games since they've been on tape drives and growing with our favorite titles, brands, characters and franchises as they made the transition from text to 2D and 2D to 3D, and we're vocal because we're trying to preserve what little integrity the video game industry has left.

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    6 Antworten
    • That CLEARLY SAYS HOE EA AND BIOWARE view it. Just saying.

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      1 Antworten
      • I preferred the older style. When companies and consumers weren't expecting day one, or even year one dlc. This new style of game development seems to have only changed things for the worse. Now you have consumers who aren't content with a game that comes out the first day. They are already looking for and hyping expansions/dlc. And it seems game companies use dlc as an out for their failings. Make me a game first. Let it hit the shelves and see how it does. Then work on expansions later. Many companies are big enough to shuffle engineers to other projects in the meantime. I see "dlc" as an overall bad thing. The internet connectivity as a whole could be argued as a negative for gaming. It seems to have led to more rushed products. Game companies can get away with less QA because they can more easily patch later. And they can pad out a short game and draw gamers back plus new gamers with dlc early in a games life. I MUCH prefer the full expansion releases more common to pc games. Generally speaking, those are much more worthy of spending. You end up with new features (classes, game modes, mechanics) instead of just cosmetic stuff like maps, gear, and reskins. Just my mostly uneducated opinion though. An old man shaking his fist longing for the "good old day", and little else. :p

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        2 Antworten
        • Yes, and as consumers of easily the biggest hobby in the world, it is 100% your choice to buy a game/DLC or not, If you can wait it out and see if videos live up to there trailers, buy it. No one told you to outright buy a game/DLC because "hype" that's not responsible or very smart, because that leaves room for disappointment.

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          1 Antworten
          • How DLC used to work. Oh hey we are done making our complete game with all ideas that we wanted in it are in it. Year and a half later, hey we thought of other good ideas for the past 2 years, so we decided to make an expansion pack, that is basically another game.

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            4 Antworten
            • I would suggest not promising a new ip that would start to change the way we view and play games. Instead shoot for small ideas that can be expanded on. I suggest not trying to change a game mid stream cause key personnel leave the co. I suggest promoting said concept like we are able to only deliver X day one, but over the course of a period of time, we will deliver Y an Z also. Destiny in concept (from listening to the devs talk about it) should be an industry wide changing game. In reality, for whatever reason, concepts we were led to believe would be here already aren't, or are now not happening. For whatever reason. Our hope now is that they will change things for the better but do far have not. Actually quite the opposite. They have alienated huge amounts of players, both pvp and pve. Some of which prob won't return. Which is to bad cause if bungie does see where and what they are doing wrong an fix it, this could be another bungie smash hit. With halo they caught lightning in a jar. I think they had a great concept on where to take our gaming to in terms of the next level, they just failed at executing it. I do hope they fix and add to the game to make it what I believe their idea was. Until then there are many more games that have proven records that I think most people will want to play instead.

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            • Bethesda is the company to be like when it comes to DLC.

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              13 Antworten
              • 0
                https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9UehX5LHy-A

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                4 Antworten
                • Nothing does disc locked content like Skylanders. I think altogether the first game ended up costing close to $400, for some cheap plastic figures that allowed you to access content already on the disc.

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                  3 Antworten
                  • Gonna say it now, if there's one thing Nintendo has done right, it's DLC. Some of it is free and it's all reasonably priced.

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                    • Oh no, not again. Twice in one day even. YOU'VE WOKEN THE HIVE

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                      4 Antworten
                      • Thorn

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                        3 Antworten
                        • That is not how dlc or game companies work and is most assuredly not the case in destiny. You honestly think the people that record the voice overs and work on cutscene animations have to wait for the people that make maps to get started? Come on man you can't be that naive. You stated that after people are done coding theyd be fired if they didnt work on dlc but your scenario doesnt take into account what the everyone else was doing while they were waiting for the "coders" This is just a misunderstanding of how things work and of efficiency. In reality there are different teams and everything gets worked on at the same time. Dlc is planned before the game is finished but in cases like this its on disc. The areas people glitched into arent place holder. Theyre completely rendered fleshed out chunks of the game. Whats missing? Enemies? A cutscene? We honestly dont know what we're getting when it drops but placeholder suggests something a little more rudimentary than what we see.

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                          9 Antworten
                          • Hell yea. Bump

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                          • This Bump

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                          • What your saying makes perfect sense and some people understand this but what's got everyone angry is that there was very little content in the game. You may say that there's already a lot of content but it's not where it needs to be...The story is what's has people angry. Stories are what connect people to thing because they can relate to it. People cannot relate to destiny in a way the can relate to a game like Last of us or Elder Scrolls which has a lot of story content. Without story all your left to do is enjoy the game play which equates to repetivness.

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                            14 Antworten
                            • If the original game had better story and character development, on par with halo, mass effect, etc., most people would be happy to pay for DLC , plain and simple. Problem is the story is garbage, its why everybody is complaing, why it got laughable reviews, and probably why joe staten and the other lead writer left...its not rocket science. Oh yea, and the PvP has as many gametypes as halo 5's beta...

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                            • Bump

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                            • Well said. I concur!

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                            • OP, I love you

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                            • Reading this is f*cking laughable. Before i say anything, you're defending getting d*cked in the arse. "Sometimes the DLC is even ready before the original game is released. This doesn't mean that it is owed to you and should be in the original game. That's not how it works. You knew that there would be DLC and you knew that it wouldn't be in the original game" This should never be the case with any game, because why would the developers be working on future content when the original game isnt finished? The developers time should be spent on the vanilla game, not any add ons or dlc. If it is thats just a clear sign of them lubing up their fat cock to stick in your arse. You talk about the different phases of making a game, which we all know about and you're trying to defend them saying they needed more time? Or they didnt have enough time so made dlc to make up for it? No just f*ck off you don't have 4 years to develop a game and then say "they need more time" more time for what? To jack off to sales figures? They had 4 years!! Thats a lifetime in game development. If you try and say they sell dlc to make up for costs thats absolute bullsh*t because most of the money they soent was on marketing and hyping the game up so people couldn't wait to get their hands on it. This is what sold most of the copies of destiny i guarentee destiny wouldn't have sold nearly as many units if the marketing budget would have been chopped down to 1/4 of what it was. Lets take cod 6 for example. 50 million to make 150+ million on marketing. I cannot beleive you're trying to defend bungie/activision for blatently f*cking you.

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                              12 Antworten
                              • Don't you get it? thats the problem. The DLC is already on the original game.

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                                5 Antworten
                                • I LOVE dlc I do. But I'll say it like this destiny2 comes around, don't show anything that won't be included at launch. Help my suspension of disbelief and I'm there.

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                                • I don't think people have an issue with this. We all know iPhone 7 is already developed when we buy 6... The issue with the game is that it is so limited people feel the DLC should have been in the original. If the original had more depth then there would be no issue. If the devs didn't assume they would sell DLC then I'm certain the original would have had more to it.

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                                  2 Antworten
                                  • Show me the source code fragments from where the content was ripped from the main game and I'll believe you. Otherwise I fail to see how the content is on the disk.

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                                  • I can't pretend to like it, but it's just the reality of the industry. Unless we want chunks of staff from out favorite developers to lose their jobs, then this is how things have to be done. To me though there was kind of a blurry line in the ME3 case. When I got that dlc it seemed like it was cut from the game beforehand, then developed alongside it. I'm not sure I completely trust publishers and developers to keep the original content for the game, in the game. The whole thing's kind of a slippery slope and I wish game development wasn't so expensive nowadays so we weren't in this situation.

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                                  Es ist dir nicht gestattet, diesen Inhalt zu sehen.
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