[quote]You can't have a REAL loot-based shooter when all the loot is mediocre and makes no difference.[/quote] Well said.

[quote] think the crucible has its place but what has hurt Destiny is the push for PVP to become an ultra-competitive experience (E-Sport). [/quote] ...and the Sandbox team's determination to force PVP play into a very specific and very narrow mold. Luke Smith---in his recent Kotaku interview----speaks to that determination directly.

[quote][quote] think the crucible has its place but what has hurt Destiny is the push for PVP to become an ultra-competitive experience (E-Sport). [/quote] ...and the Sandbox team's determination to force PVP play into a very specific and very narrow mold. Luke Smith---in his recent Kotaku interview----speaks to that determination directly.[/quote] Exactly. I know you think they've thought outside the box to try to resolve some of D1's issues, but I can't help but feel like they actually went deeper INTO the box - back to what they've done before. If the game is going to be a Halo knockoff, it just doesn't excite me because I'd rather play the original than a cheap knockoff.

Oh, I'm certainly willing to admit that the Sandbox team can still -blam!- this up. ...and there is about a 50/50 chance that I'll play the new CRucible and not like it. All I'm saying is that the changes have created the **opportunity** for PVE and PVP to get along better, because the Sandbox team is no longer trying to use weapon tuning to force a style of play onto the Crucible that is incompatible with its design. Which is what they've spent the last two years in Destiny 1 doing.

Yeah. Too many if's, could's, but's, and should's in there for me to really feel confident about it though, especially when I consider the current sandbox team's history of disasters. I get your point that this new format simply provides them the opportunity to try to get it right, and the point is well taken, but I can't help but feel like "getting it right" by going this direction means taking too many fun things away from PVE for the sake of PVP. IMO, I just see the game going more towards the FPS side of the spectrum. And really, it NEEDS to be that way if competitive PVP is the goal. You can't have competitive PVP in the way Bungie envisions if you have too many different abilities, weapon perks, etc. So they're trying to get around it by having all the supers be extremely similar. But you still have RNG-influenced loadouts which may give certain players an advantage, which again, cuts against a competitive PVP experience. To avoid that, they'll have to water down the perks, which again, harms PVE. PVP and PVE are simply two different animals and you can't have a fun, fulfilling experience in BOTH modes when you continue to treat them the same way. One side or the other will have to win out, and Bungie has shown their hand - they clearly side with PVP. History shows that under these circumstances, you can only expect the PVE experience to be watered down and eroded.