Sway will ruin snipers.
PvP is not the only game mode in this game. Snipers are raid DPS. Adding sway will be a huge detriment to PvE.
English
-
The problem in PvP is that the primary weapon TTK is too long. See the video above. Guy fights through multiple headshots to deliver a headshot kill to the guy whose perspective we're seeing from That's ridiculous. But its what you allow good players to do when every primary weapon in the game takes forever to kill anyone in the Crucible.
-
Bearbeitet von Hektik: 1/11/2016 7:39:34 PMI see your point about time to kill. If they want specials to act as primaries then primaries need to have TTK cut down. If specials aren't supposed to be used as much as primaries then ammo needs to be reduced.
-
Cut down primary weapon TTK and give shotguns and fusion rifles their AVERAGE range back. You won't have to touch special ammo availability. DYING....ALOT...will make running around with a special weapon as a primary look a LOT less attractive.
-
Maybe. I know I wouldnt wanna grab a capture point if TTK was any faster. No time to react.
-
no. every single thing you need to DPS in PvE has a HUGE critical area, some sway will have no effect on PvE. Dont use the PvE blanket excuse to avoid addressing the real issue. Thanks.
-
Not true. Not all PvE play is the fricking raid. Especially with the nerfs to rocket launchers, and the rarity with which ones with tracking are obtainable in Year Two... Sniper rifles play a HUGE role in dealing with Tier Two shielded enemies (Hive and Taken) Wizards, (Fallen and Taken) Captains, and (Cabal and Taken) Centurions. The Wizards especially are very small, very mobile targets....and you often find yourself having to try to hit them while either dodging spammed fire from the Wizards themselves.....or hords of charging Thrall. There is NOTHING wrong with snipers in PvP that can't be fixed by going back to the primary weapon TTK of vanilla Destiny, and undoing the nerfs to shotguns and fusion rifles. IN the video above---with a faster TTK----that sniper would have either been forced to disengage and seek cover.....or die. Instead he stood his ground because he believed (rightly) that he could fight through the camera shake faster then the scout rifle user could finish him off. He was right.
-
There is more to pve than KF.
-
name a situation in ANY PvE activity were you need to keep shooting sniper rounds into a target the size of a guardians head? there might be, but so few and so rare that a little sway to snipers will have no impact.
-
Omnigul strike. Cerebrus Vae strike. Undying Mind Strike. Restorative Mind Strike. ....need I go on?
-
Strike bosses, for example, have a much smaller crit spot than the raid bosses you mention. Regular AI have guardian sized crit spots. Shotguns and fusion rifles are already useless in pve. Adding sway will completely wreck the special weapon catagory in PvE. Snipers are not over powered in crucible, special ammo is just too plentiful.
-
Bearbeitet von TheArtist: 1/11/2016 7:45:18 PMDisagree. The problem isn't how often they're used. Its how the meta ALLOWS them to be used. Like I said to the guy above, I came ready to argue about his analysis of what is wrong with sniper rifles in PVP....but I gotta give the guy his due. He stone-cold nailed it. The video shows: 1. A sniper brazenly striding into a mid-range firefight without a shred of caution or fear. 2. He starts taking headshots from one of the best scout rifles in mid-range combat, and one of the best anti-sniper primary weapons in the game. To the point where you can see on two or three occasions the snipers head snapping back from the impact of the high-caliber rounds. 3. The sniper fight through the camera shake and delivers a killing headshot before the poster's MIDA multi-tool can manage to finish him off. ...and this is from one o the DOMINANT weapons in the meta from mid-range right now. Had the poster been using anything else, he'd have died even FASTER. Shotguns have been broken....and primary weapon TTK is now so long that sniper simply have NOTHING to fear from mind-range enagements. If they carry TLW as a primary...they don't even have anything to fear from CLOSE combat anymore.
-
I'll have to watch the video to see whether he was standing still as he challenged the sniper. Currently not near WiFi. I've killed a few Midas as a sniper. Two things factored, I was lucky I fired when the flinch reset and the challenger stood still when I had already acquired their head. I've challenged many snipers with Midas, Tllaloc(sp), hung jury, and have won. Straffing made quite the difference. I see your Primary ttk arguement and agree with it as long as special weapons are ment to be just another primary weapon. If special is ment to be a streak power weapon then I still believe ammo is too plentiful.
-
The sniper was strafing in this case, and it helped in causing the poster to miss at least one shot. But the larger point is that the poster DID connect on three very obviously solid headshots...and yet his target fought through it. Which is pretty ridiculous if you ask me. Especially considering that he'd have had even LESS camera shake to deal with from any other weapon. So he'd have killed the poster even faster.
-
I've not seen this camera shake phenom you keep mentioning about Mida.
-
Bearbeitet von TheArtist: 1/11/2016 9:07:59 PMIf you've played as a sniper in PVP or used MIDA as a primary, you have. You just might not have realized what it was. MIDA had a hidden perk which is basically a souped up High Caliber Rounds. But it only really procs in the hands of some one good enough to string together headshots with it. Against some using another primary, you can practically stagger lock them. Which makes it hard for them to aim their own weapon or disengage and run away. Which is a big problem in ranged engagements using other scout rifles. Against a sniper it will induce enough camera shake to make it almost impossible to get off any kind of aim shot. The disorienting effect increases the more you're struck at an angle, and the more zoom in your scope. Which is why it was so shocking for me to see that guy get drag scoped despite landing three solid head shots with MIDA. As advertised, it really did demonstrate everything wrong with snipers AND the current Crucible meta. I don't play much sniper in PVP, but I can still recognize very quickly when I'm getting shot by a MIDA.
-
Skipped around in that video as thoroughly as I could. I saw nothing but fallout 4 footage... No where did I see a Mida loosing to a sniper. In the past month I've been playing on an of, crucible only, I've not had a situation where I felt stagger locked, if I was, it didn't last long enough to notice. You're the only person I've heard talk about this.
-
Bearbeitet von TheArtist: 1/11/2016 9:33:43 PMNot the OP. Rauko linked a video on a different part of this thread. Its why I referenced it not realizing that you weren't part of that particular conversation, since he's in both. https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=gIGizomsL1E Taking a closer look at the video, the sniper actually took three headshots AND a body shot. The poster undersold the video. It not only demonstrates everything that is wrong with snipers right now, it also shows everything that is wrong with the current Crucible meta, imo.
-
I only use snipers in PVE for raids. I so just fine with primaries, shotguns and heavy.
-
I rely upon sniper rifles to strip the shields of Tier Two enemies at range. Fusion rifles at short range. Which is how the PVE game needs to be played now since there is only one elemental primary in the game right now.
-
I use special/heavy for shielded, majors, ultras.
-
Yeah it seems my sway suggestion is the main thing people are focusing on. Honestly sway was kind of an afterthought, originally all I was going to suggest was the second point about the animation to scope in taking longer, as to eliminate people running around using them in close quarters. Although I disagree with the idea that adding a minor sway would somehow ruin snipers I clearly see that it would definitely upset far too many people. Thanks for adding to the discussion!
-
The only way that you're going to get these guys to stop doing that is give them something to fear. As long as all the other special weapons are broken...and he has time to shake off THREE head shots and still accurately aim and fire his own weapon..... ...you'll never get these guys to back off. The only way you'll do that is to reverse the base damage nerfs on primary weapons so that they kill faster, and undo the range nerfs to shotguns and fusion rifles. Because I guarantee you that sniper would have closed to such a brazen distance if he had to worry about getting one-shotted by a fusion rifle.
-
Have you played battle field? I think you'd be happier with a more realistic shooter rather than a sci-fi shooter.