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#feedback

Edited by Lost Sols: 12/7/2015 3:08:54 AM
210

Searching for Light in the Darkness. Are we being heard? (Another post they don't want you to read.)

Yes, it's their right.

227

No, it's our forum.

826

[b]The Poll[/b] Bungie are actively removing hot-button topics (such as matchmaking) from the Trending and Highest Rated tabs. Do you believe it is their right to censor these forums to make topics they don't agree with less visible? Or do you feel that these forums are supposed to be our place to have a voice and a place where we can champion causes for change? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- [b]The questions it forces us to ask.[/b] According to DeeJ [quote]Player feedback is one of the most important components of the conversation on Bungie.net. Dedicated teams at Bungie survey the forums in search of support issues and development ideas. Specific user-created topics that [b]trend[/b] as a result of community interaction are more effective in providing us with that information than blog threads with thousands of competing replies.[/quote] If that is in fact true and their teams search TRENDING topics, it effectively squashes a thread to remove it from that tab. We've had hundreds of individual Guardian's weigh in on this topic and have about 10 of the most liked posts in #feedback, including 2 of the top 3. This is another DeeJ quote. [quote]Let me get this straight. The player is never “wrong.” I believe that down to my bones. At Bungie, I represent to the developers what you say without prejudice.[/quote] If that is the case, we've been asking for answers for a week now. Again, there are literally hundreds of stories explaining why people would like in-game matchmaking options and why LFG sites (as awesome as they can be for some) just don't work for them. If a player is never wrong, when one writes a heartfelt post that they don't want to have to use LFG or go outside the game to play the game, how can you reconcile the above quote when you answer them with "Go form your own clan"? Another Bungie quote (not sure DeeJ or another) in response to Asa's question: I love the game... But some don't. Can you shed some 'light' on your feelings toward these negative reviews and feedback? [quote]Bungie thrives on feedback. Never feel like you need to stick up for us when you see someone expressing an honest opinion about our games. We’re harder on ourselves than anyone else.[/quote] Players have been asking for in-game options to play with other Guardians since launch. With each new expansion, raid and batch of new content, that frustration grows for those who want to get on and play, but don't have friends on and don't want to go search outside sources for a team. As much as it sucks that the raid for HoW was delayed, I have to admit that part of me was completely stoked for whatever PoE was going to be because I couldn't imagine that it wasn't going to be endgame content that was finally easily available to EVERYONE and not just raiders. Joke was on any of us who thought that, huh? We are almost 9 full months into Destiny and it is more of a chore than ever to access meaningful content in this game. We've been asking for change the entire time, but have our voices been muted this entire time too? Again, let me go back to this quote from DeeJ, because this is very important: [quote]Let me get this straight. The player is never “wrong.” I believe that down to my bones. At Bungie, I represent to the developers what you say without prejudice.[/quote] DeeJ is our voice with the developers. Well, if DeeJ doesn't believe in our cause, how much faith can we really have that we are being heard? This is DeeJ from way back on November 11, 2014 in response to the call for more matchmaking: [quote]It's no secret that the highest quality teammates are the ones you choose for yourself. Anyone with a robust friends list will testify to that. We hear the feedback about matchmaking, and there are conversations about it's future. In the meantime, anyone posting to this forum has a galley of potential teammates to recruit.[/quote] This is tremendously important because it clearly shows that all the way back then, DeeJ was showing bias against matchmaking. [spoiler]If you're curious, my reply that day: [quote]Uh, no. Sorry DeeJ, but that's nowhere close to true. Some of the highest quality people you'll ever meet are in matchmade games and you all know it was ridiculous to not give us that option. Ask anyone who's played any online game how many amazing friends they've made that they met randomly online in a game. I met my wife in a random group in an online deathmatch. What you all did is indicative of the sad social practice of trying to protect us from ourselves. Is skydiving dangerous? Potentially. If I understand that risk and I'm okay with it, should I be able to jump? Yes, I should. Is there a possibility I may get grouped with an asshole in a random game online? Yup. If I am okay with that and willing to wear a headset, should I be able to talk to the 90% of people that aren't asshats? Yes, I should. As an online community manager, you should know that even though the bad seeds may be loud, the majority of people are cool and drawn together by a shared passion.[/quote][/spoiler] After HoW released, we posted yet more dismay at the unnecessary degree of difficulty just getting to run the new endgame content if friends weren't readily available. From DeeJ. seven months after having to respond to our initial calls for mm: [quote]At current, our philosophy about endgame content is that part of the challenge includes forming up a team. This is a strong community filled with players who are looking for teammates. Why not seek each other out here and band together[/quote] Well, we responded and we banded together and we have over a thousand likes over dozens of posts and instead of being heard, instead of being represented, instead of being engaged, we are left with flippant remarks, corporate-speak mantras and silence. Again, we have asked reasonable questions. We have given in depth answers as to why we feel so strongly in our beliefs. We have engaged in conversations with those who feel differently. We have searched for answers and common ground and have offered ideas for solutions. And in response, our posts have been removed from all but the "Latest" feed, which in and of itself tells us volumes about how much our opinions and experiences truly matter. I'll end this by again saying that the reason we all are here is because we love Destiny. We are all Warlocks, Hunters, Titans. We all have battled the Archon Priest, Sepkis and Rockets McD**kface together. We're not adversaries (well, outside of PvP) and we're all trying to make this game the very best it can be. So how did we get here? [spoiler]Thank you to all who believe, support, never give up and always #bumpfortruth.[/spoiler] ----------------------------------------------------------------- Edit: To all the Guardians supporting this and those who disagree too, I want to add a couple of things. First, I am saddened (and somewhat surprised) to see that Bungie have decided to remove this post from Trending and Highest Rated too, particularly when any of this community hurt could easily be healed with minimal effort on their end. Also, I want to clearly state that this is not meant as a personal attack on DeeJ. He just happens to be the Community Manager and so he is who we go to for answers. I've had it stated a couple times that we're being abusive and hating on DeeJ. That sincerely is not intended to be the case and I will re-post this here. [quote]DeeJ is our CM and I still overall think he's a good guy and wants what's best for us. I just think he dropped the ball on this one. Everyone has missteps. The intent of this isn't to attack DeeJ, but to try to repair a disconnect between the community and Bungie. I would hope DeeJ isn't the one hiding posts and I understand he is limited in what he can share. If he'd just maybe asked why LFG and clans don't work for people and guaranteed nothing more than he'd share it with the devs, he'd have been a hero. For whatever reason we got [i]sorry, it's our philosophy[/i] instead. This post is here because we want Bungie to listen, not because we want DeeJ gone.[/quote] I'm really conflicted at the moment. I am so grateful for the way the community have banded together to support each other and this community desire, but I'm also genuinely saddened at the stance that has been taken against us. This was a call to reason, not war.

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  • Bump.

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    • Its tgeir forum so they can do whatever with the posts. They do hear us if you read the las update they said yes we know you want matchmaking.

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    • Edited by ImTooHungover: 5/30/2015 3:33:31 PM
      bungie has the right to do what they want with the forums but they have to pay the consequences if its against the community. Im bummed how restrictive the social part of destiny is. ive used the multiple recruiting sites, but the process is timely and obnoxious because I KNOW theres a better way. In all honesty, the lack of ingame LFG and proper MMO style communication is what turns me away from this game. Granted there are other issues with the game but thats number 1. Take Warframe for example. I love that game but has some issues itself, but nothing too crazy. If that game had no ingame chat system for LFG and i had to recruit from another source outside the game and my console, i would not play it. the game relies on coop (which Im fine with) thus needs an easy way to recruit. Ingame LFG...if its not in the next expansion for destiny or apart of an update prior to that expansion, i will not buy it. its as simple as that. I want to be able to come home from work, get on, go to the chat board, post "LFG for Blah," and be invited directly to a fireteam. None of this third party lfgs or search name and invite to party or friends list before inviting to fireteam bullshit. Its just unnecessary, timely work.

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      • The number of nerf thorn posts have gone down so I'm not too concerned.

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        • It's there right to do as they wish with the forums that they own, now does it make it ethically right? No but it's still a right that they possess, just be happy they haven't decided to turn all the text into saying you love bungie every time you bash em.

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          • Agree. We need a matchmaking system since the beginning. Also a chatbox on the social places like the Tower and Reef.

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            • I dont understand how others think you are being rude but heres a well earned bump

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              • Its their right to look like pricks.

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              • ╔══╗ ♪ ٩(×̯×)۶ ║██║ ♪♫ ║ ( ● ) ♫ ҍմʍԹ ╚══╝♪ ♪

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                • I agree. I have played destiny since the demo. I've never once posted a negative comment. Not when everyone was complaining about the purple engrams, not when atheon was glitchy as all get out. Not when Crota expansion dropped the ball and had us all re-leveling all our gear. But after the initial excitement of House of Wolves has worn off, it's time. Bungie, it's time to stop hiding all the best end game content behind the "pre-made team only" wall. Here's the part where players who this isn't effecting go, "Join a clan, use LFG, etc, etc." Well I've been part of a clan since the beginning. They all stalled out after a few Crota wins and most have gone to xbox One. I've been in 3 different clans since then. The organization and wait to do anything is just as bad as getting together randoms from LFG. I don't have infinite time to play. I can't waste 45 mins to an hour just getting a group together. The teams you get from LFG are no different than what you would get from having matchmaking in game, it just takes WAY longer. BUNGIE, address this now. The amount of grinding to get up to new levels, level up old weapons and get those damn keys is more than time consuming enough without having to waste so much time and energy just trying to actually access the content that is nigh inaccessible if you don't have a lot of online friends that can just pick up and play anytime. It's time for across the game matchmaking before guys like me are just done. Bungie, your excuses are lame and your arguments irrelevant. Give the people what they want and deserve, add matchmaking now.

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                  • Edited by II Stargazer x: 5/30/2015 9:04:14 PM
                    this is how i think it should be set out for optional Matchmaking: Private = solo (make it a challenge) Match made = random's with random's, you can bring your own team (you understand you may fail) Pre-made = chose your own team, it can also be solo (you want victory no matter what or a greater challenge) Strikes: Private and Match made fireteams Crucible: Pre-made and Match made (custom matches come under Pre-made) Iron Banner: Match made (no private) ToO: unlocks at character lv33, Pre-made fireteams of 3 only PoE lv28: unlocks with character lv28, Private, Pre-made and Match made PoE lv32: unlocks with character lv32 and clear of lv28, Private, Pre-made and Match made PoE lv34: unlocks with character lv34 and clear of lv32, Private, Pre-made and Match made PoE lv35: unlocks with character lv34 and clear of lv34, Private, Pre-made fireteams only VoG normal: unlocks with character lv26, Pre-made and Match made VoG Hard: unlocks with character lv30 and full clear of normal, Pre-made and Match made CE normal: unlocks with character lv30, Pre-made and Match made CE Hard: unlocks with character lv32 and full clear of normal, Pre-made and Match made with all Matchmaking, you will be grouped with players of the same rank or above for that activity, those who drop below the minimum required rank will be kicked and returned to orbit (yes that includes changing gear) with a penalty (maybe 1 hour without matchmaking access) and this is one I made up, player's can vote out Afk'ers/trolls/useless gamers by simply muting them (requires only 3), it also means you wont be paired up with them again unless they ask you to unmute them (they also receive a harsher penalty of 2 hour no matchmaking access). please tell me what you think?

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                    • That was one of the most beautiful things ive ever read.

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                      • [b]We Need Optional MM! the Darkness is trying to Consume it! Guardians!!....Light Up!!![/b]

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                        • Honestly, Bungie not only has lost all credibility with me because of Destiny, but has no love from me either. 343 is way more like Bungie than Bungie is at this point. It's sad and funny.

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                          • Bump! Bungie is really hurting their reputation here. They will hopefully soon realize.

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                            • I was thinking about this. I don't think they are removing anything from the trending topics, I just think there are too many similar and individual posts that are eating at the numbers required for something to trend. Think about it. If a subject matter is trending, that is a sign of what everyone is talking about, but if everyone is talking about pita bread, then no specific post about pita bread is going to get the traction to be a trending post. It is like recruitment. If people would stop creating yet another nightfall post and use one of the posts that are there to organize things, those organizational posts trend. Same thing here. Everyone needs to stop posting similar posts and just hit on the ones that they will be repeating anyway.

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                              • Bump

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                              • [quote][b]The Poll[/b] Bungie are actively removing hot-button topics (such as matchmaking) from the Trending and Highest Rated tabs. Do you believe it is their right to censor these forums to make topics they don't agree with less visible? Or do you feel that these forums are supposed to be our place to have a voice and a place where we can champion causes for change? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- [b]The questions it forces us to ask.[/b] According to DeeJ [quote]Player feedback is one of the most important components of the conversation on Bungie.net. Dedicated teams at Bungie survey the forums in search of support issues and development ideas. Specific user-created topics that [b]trend[/b] as a result of community interaction are more effective in providing us with that information than blog threads with thousands of competing replies.[/quote] If that is in fact true and their teams search TRENDING topics, it effectively squashes a thread to remove it from that tab. We've had hundreds of individual Guardian's weigh in on this topic and have about 10 of the most liked posts in #feedback, including 2 of the top 3. This is another DeeJ quote. [quote]Let me get this straight. The player is never “wrong.” I believe that down to my bones. At Bungie, I represent to the developers what you say without prejudice.[/quote] If that is the case, we've been asking for answers for a week now. Again, there are literally hundreds of stories explaining why people would like in-game matchmaking options and why LFG sites (as awesome as they can be for some) just don't work for them. If a player is never wrong, when one writes a heartfelt post that they don't want to have to use LFG or go outside the game to play the game, how can you reconcile the above quote when you answer them with "Go form your own clan"? Another Bungie quote (not sure DeeJ or another) in response to Asa's question: I love the game... But some don't. Can you shed some 'light' on your feelings toward these negative reviews and feedback? [quote]Bungie thrives on feedback. Never feel like you need to stick up for us when you see someone expressing an honest opinion about our games. We’re harder on ourselves than anyone else.[/quote] Players have been asking for in-game options to play with other Guardians since launch. With each new expansion, raid and batch of new content, that frustration grows for those who want to get on and play, but don't have friends on and don't want to go search outside sources for a team. As much as it sucks that the raid for HoW was delayed, I have to admit that part of me was completely stoked for whatever PoE was going to be because I couldn't imagine that it wasn't going to be endgame content that was finally easily available to EVERYONE and not just raiders. Joke was on any of us who thought that, huh? We are almost 9 full months into Destiny and it is more of a chore than ever to access meaningful content in this game. We've been asking for change the entire time, but have our voices been muted this entire time too? Again, let me go back to this quote from DeeJ, because this is very important: [quote]Let me get this straight. The player is never “wrong.” I believe that down to my bones. At Bungie, I represent to the developers what you say without prejudice.[/quote] DeeJ is our voice with the developers. Well, if DeeJ doesn't believe in our cause, how much faith can we really have that we are being heard? This is DeeJ from way back on November 11, 2014 in response to the call for more matchmaking: [quote]It's no secret that the highest quality teammates are the ones you choose for yourself. Anyone with a robust friends list will testify to that. We hear the feedback about matchmaking, and there are conversations about it's future. In the meantime, anyone posting to this forum has a galley of potential teammates to recruit.[/quote] This is tremendously important because it clearly shows that all the way back then, DeeJ was showing bias against matchmaking. [spoiler]If you're curious, my reply that day: [quote]Uh, no. Sorry DeeJ, but that's nowhere close to true. Some of the highest quality people you'll ever meet are in matchmade games and you all know it was ridiculous to not give us that option. Ask anyone who's played any online game how many amazing friends they've made that they met randomly online in a game. I met my wife in a random group in an online deathmatch. What you all did is indicative of the sad social practice of trying to protect us from ourselves. Is skydiving dangerous? Potentially. If I understand that risk and I'm okay with it, should I be able to jump? Yes, I should. Is there a possibility I may get grouped with an asshole in a random game online? Yup. If I am okay with that and willing to wear a headset, should I be able to talk to the 90% of people that aren't asshats? Yes, I should. As an online community manager, you should know that even though the bad seeds may be loud, the majority of people are cool and drawn together by a shared passion.[/quote][/spoiler] After HoW released, we posted yet more dismay at the unnecessary degree of difficulty just getting to run the new endgame content if friends weren't readily available. From DeeJ. seven months after having to respond to our initial calls for mm: [quote]At current, our philosophy about endgame content is that part of the challenge includes forming up a team. This is a strong community filled with players who are looking for teammates. Why not seek each other out here and band together[/quote] Well, we responded and we banded together and we have over a thousand likes over dozens of posts and instead of being heard, instead of being represented, instead of being engaged, we are left with flippant remarks, corporate-speak mantras and silence. Again, we have asked reasonable questions. We have given in depth answers as to why we feel so strongly in our beliefs. We have engaged in conversations with those who feel differently. We have searched for answers and common ground and have offered ideas for solutions. And in response, our posts have been removed from all but the "Latest" feed, which in and of itself tells us volumes about how much our opinions and experiences truly matter. I'll end this by again saying that the reason we all are here is because we love Destiny. We are all Warlocks, Hunters, Titans. We all have battled the Archon Priest, Sepkis and Rockets McD**kface together. We're not adversaries (well, outside of PvP) and we're all trying to make this game the very best it can be. So how did we get here? [spoiler]Thank you to all who believe, support, never give up and always #bumpfortruth.[/spoiler] ----------------------------------------------------------------- Edit: To all the Guardians supporting this and those who disagree too, I want to add a couple of things. First, I am saddened (and somewhat surprised) to see that Bungie have decided to remove this post from Trending and Highest Rated too, particularly when any of this community hurt could easily be healed with minimal effort on their end. Also, I want to clearly state that this is not meant as a personal attack on DeeJ. He just happens to be the Community Manager and so he is who we go to for answers. I've had it stated a couple times that we're being abusive and hating on DeeJ. That sincerely is not intended to be the case and I will re-post this here. [quote]DeeJ is our CM and I still overall think he's a good guy and wants what's best for us. I just think he dropped the ball on this one. Everyone has missteps. The intent of this isn't to attack DeeJ, but to try to repair a disconnect between the community and Bungie. I would hope DeeJ isn't the one hiding posts and I understand he is limited in what he can share. If he'd just maybe asked why LFG and clans don't work for people and guaranteed nothing more than he'd share it with the devs, he'd have been a hero. For whatever reason we got [i]sorry, it's our philosophy[/i] instead. This post is here because we want Bungie to listen, not because we want DeeJ gone.[/quote] I'm really conflicted at the moment. I am so grateful for the way the community have banded together to support each other and this community desire, but I'm also genuinely saddened at the stance that has been taken against us. This was a call to reason, not war.[/quote]

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                              • Bump

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                              • Bump :)

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                              • Bump

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                                • No offense, but we have #recruitment for optional matchmaking.

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                                  • we are being heard. they just don't care.and i doubt they ever will.

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                                    • [b]Bump. The Darkness is trying to Consume it! Guardians!!!....Light Up!![/b]

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                                      • Bump

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                                      • It's already gone wow

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