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1/13/2015 10:00:22 PM
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Humanity is a theory.
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  • Theory it may be, but the life that is unexamined is not worth living.

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  • Is that why people deny Jesus? We are willing to have faith in humanity but not the man that was crucified for his faith in gods plan for humanity?

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  • Jesus Christ in the Christian interpretation of him is denied because of lack of faith in God.

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  • Edited by TidalSurge: 1/13/2015 11:28:00 PM
    This is why understanding the purpose is much more significant than knowing the all of facts.

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  • Edited by The Cellar Door: 1/13/2015 11:36:39 PM
    I completely agree. I'll give you an example with science: If I told you we can measure an electron as black or white, or, hard and soft, and then asked you to take a white electron, measure it's hardness, let's say it's soft, it doesn't matter. And then I asked you to measure it's color. If I then told you that 50% of the time you would be wrong for saying white, I would sound like a mad man. However, if we sent it through a box that measures hardness, and used mirrors to reflect to another box to measure color, without measuring the hardness, and only measuring the output after the color box, I can say with complete confidence that that electron is white 100% of the time. It doesn't make sense, but that's how nature works. And knowing the purpose behind superposition and the observer effect is the only way to understand quantum mechanics. It's a fancy way of saying, well we don't know, we can't know, and it's not human error creating this unknown factor. However, it is such a counterintuitive concept, it almost sounds idiotic. Now I'm sure a man such as yourself, who I can say is obviously pretty invested into theology from past experiences with you, can create an analogue to this with which people do not understand what the bible or it's figures [i]mean[/i] and what these things are purposed for, and so these ideas may be rejected. [spoiler]By the way, I would like to add in, even though we have our dissenting opinions, I enjoy conversations with you about these topics.[/spoiler]

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  • I see where you're going with this. Or maybe I don't. I understand that perception is everything. I believe that was the most observable point you addressed throughout your example, but please correct me if I'm wrong. The only issue is that god has made himself perceivable by conceiving his spirit in a human that would live according to this will. He is the only example I have, for this perception of god revolves around the understanding of Christ, in his fullness. You do not have to believe in god to accept Christ, but without Christ you cannot know god. 1 Timothy 2:5-7 For there is one God and one mediator between God and mankind, the man Christ Jesus, who gave himself as a ransom for all people. This has now been witnessed to at the proper time. 7And for this purpose I was appointed a herald and an apostle—I am telling the truth, I am not lying—and a true and faithful teacher of the Gentiles. Hebrew 12:4 Make every effort to live in peace with everyone and to be holy; without holiness no one will see The Lord You can know the facts, but like you said, without a mediator to subject the unknown to light, the margin of error is increased exponentially. The absence of a mediator is necessary to see how we fair through our own inspection, but with a mediator, we reveal mysteries not observed by our own natural tendencies.

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  • Yes, I think you got it very well. A quote I love: [quote]The dao that can be told is not the eternal dao[/quote] (from Daoism/Taoism) For man to say that there is not an unknown factor in reality and perception, would be them equivocating themselves to God, or to divinity. It's another reason that I have an issue with a direct creationism vs atheism argument. It simply doesn't make sense to argue that with which cannot be known. Albeit, the individuals in each group have seen different light, and both sides should acknowledge this unknown factor. For the religious, this is much easier. Maybe easier isn't the right word. But they have a source of faith that makes this unknown factor "alright" to exist. And I'm not talking about denying/impeding scientific process, that would simply be incredulous, strictly the philosophies of life and what humanity is.

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  • Edited by TidalSurge: 1/14/2015 12:52:45 AM
    I've actually had a guy tell me that "science has access to basically all information already and once we learn everything, there will be nothing left to know." Do you know how hard it is to reason with someone like this? Lol

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  • I wouldn't blame you for calling that man an idiot. Science is my passion in life, and to think that we could ever solve every question, well, it simply wouldn't be my passion anymore.

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  • My passion also lies in the abundance of mysteries surrounding what I believe. The wonder and awe is unlimited. Just acknowledging these great mysteries brings me to humility.

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