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12/22/2014 8:23:29 PM
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you sir are incorect the reason they use this formula is not because weapon with higher impact has less recoil but because the lower fire rate of the higher impact auto rifles allows for the time needed to correct your aim in between shots fired, which destiny eliminate the player from having to do because the guardian corrects it for you. the lower the rate of fire of a weapon the more controlable the weapon is this can easily be tested by firing an ak-47 in both single fire and full auto modes in single fire since you are taking the time to correct for the recoil your shots will be much more accurate than when you fire the weapon in fully automatic mode because as the weapon fires at the increased fire rate you are suffering from additional recoil while still correcting from the first shot. this is the exact reason that precision rifles are not made in fully automatic variants and a battle rifle has a select fire mechanism the thompson sub-machine gun fires a .45 caliber pistol round however you will suffer much more muzzle climb with that weapon than in an ar15 assult rifle that is in semi automatic mode the issue of stability of a shot down range is a combination of all of the variables however the one that will always be true is that the higher the rate of fire the worse the stability of the weapon. there is a point when this rule no longer applies however no hand held weapon exceeds that threshold the dylan minigun for example is a nearly perfectly stable weapon however it fires at a rate of over a thousand rounds per minute and is not usable as a hand held weapon.
while you attempted to make a viable argument you missed your mark by only considering weapons firing a single round or both firing a burst of rounds fully automatically of the same shot count, plus you didnt actually do these tests you simply speculated based on the recoil from a single round. i respect your attempt but your argument is incorrect.
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This would have been so much more readable with capitalization. Or punctuation. Either one, really. You make so many valid points, yet it is a chore to read through them.
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He makes valid points? Oh, that one where he dismantles my argument by comparing the Thompson submachine gun to a semi-automatic AR-15? Oh, maybe the one where he says I [i]didn't[/i] consider firing the Socom-14 and AR-15 in full auto, when [i]that was the entire purpose of my post[/i]. If the Recoil is worse on the Socom than the AR-15, then it follows that it would be worse in full auto than the AR-15. The only [i]valid[/i] point he has in his rambling is the astute observation that we don't have handheld mini-guns because [i]they wouldn't be practical[/i]. What a genius it must have taken to realize that.
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Edited by Dog_Of_War_1138: 12/24/2014 6:49:34 AMThe points specifically? That a higher caliber firearm needs a lower ROF to be controllable, and it is perfectly feasible to build a large-caliber, heavy rifle with a low ROF that is more controllable in sustained fire than a lightweight, light caliber rifle with a high rate of fire. The small-caliber weapon would be more controllable at the same rate of fire with all other factors being equal, of course, but since there is no data on weapon weight, etc., just what we have to look at in the pictures, we are left to rationalize the world of Destiny if we are determined to make it make real-world sense. Let's compare the hand cannons with the auto rifles for a moment. Apples and oranges? Exactly. Scout rifles to pulse rifles? The same. We can't compare between classes any more than we can between a SOCOM and an M-16, unless it's to say the SOCOM is the Scout Rifle equivalent, while the M-16 is an auto rifle. And that's not a bad starting point. Within the class of the M-16 action, we have sub-types; mainly the M-4 and the base-line M-16. Suppose we take the M-4, lighten the bolt so the action is faster (on an already light carbine), and what do we have? A buzzsaw. Add an extended mag and you have high ROF, but inaccurate due to the recoil against the light frame. Compare it to the original rifle, which will have a lower ROF but put the rounds on target more easily. (I know in real life that's hard to do, but hey, they have magikarp tech powers.) Now chamber the M-16 for the 6.5mm round. We now have, on one hand, a Dr. Nope, and on the other a Vanquisher VII. This comparison can hold for many assault rifles, since different manufacturers modify them for different purposes. The original StG-44 fired a heavy round to a short range, just like the AK-47 which it inspired. HK uses the roller-lock delayed blowback action to keep their rate of fire low and their rifles more accurate than most, even on full auto (until the HK-416, another M-4gery). I didn't say [i]every word[/i] of the reply was a gem, I said valid points were made. Nor did I say or imply that your OP was without merit. I did start off by stating that it was hard for me to tell exactly how many points he did make, because the author's punctuation or lack thereof is atrocious. It boils down, in game terms, to this: An auto rifle with high Impact, high ROF, and high Stability, or probably even 2 out of 3, will be a game-breaker in PvP. Those that have one high stat and one in the mid-range are dominators. The best you are going to get is one high, one about 35%, and one very low. This goes for all weapons, not just auto rifles; Scouts make up for their higher Impact with a lower ROF. I believe, actually, that there is a stat distribution across all the statistics, including Reload, and the total is split up to be more or less even for every gun. It gets weighted more toward Legendary and Exotics, maybe they get more points to spread out; and of course sniper rifles get that big headshot multiplier; but it's all to enforce balance in the Crucible. And I honestly don't have a problem with that. I have rationalized it away as best I can with the above explanation, take it for what it's worth. And yes, I do believe someone at Bungie has fired a gun. Law of averages says so, what with us being 'Mericans. Oh, P.S.- Since you mention the Hard Light- once I put the Stability and Fitted Stock perks on mine, I became able to dump nearly the entire mag into a Fallen Captain's head. So, controllability isn't an issue once it's levelled up.
