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Edited by burritosenior: 6/22/2014 5:58:36 AM
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Using games Call of Duty and The Division as an example of IPs that have timed exclusive content is ridiculous, and completely ignores the historical significance of this particular example. You'll notice people don't complain nearly as much about those games having such content, if at all. Now why do you suppose that is? Well, I'll tell you. It's because the developers for those titles didn't create a market on a particular platform. For this video to claim that the fact that Bungie developed exclusively for the Xbox is irrelevant shows a complete disregard to the historical significance of this problem as well. I don't know if this person is new to the community or what, but that is wholly disrespectful to make such a statement as that. Halo was THE Xbox game. It revolutionized the FPS genre in multiple ways, and cultivated a fanbase both around Halo and, more specifically, around Bungie. When Halo 3 released, it was on the Xbox 360. There were actually many people that followed Bungie to the console because they put out great products- not just people that followed Halo. Therefore, while switching to Playstation as a focus for their content, they are essentially forgetting about those people that followed them in the past, who developed a decade's worth of friendships and experiences on another platform largely due to Bungie. I've said this before and I'll say it again- nobody was complaining about Bungie including the Playstation with Destiny. Fans on the forums were actually PLEASED, because it meant Bungie was growing and would have a larger fanbase. The issue is that they aren't being treated equally- they're being treated BETTER. And after a decade of giving your all to Bungie as a fan of the company instead of the game, that is a very hard pill to swallow. Xbox fans were not asking for exclusive content because of their history with Bungie. Xbox fans were expecting equality. This video goes on to talk about how it is a good business decision. And from a money standpoint, it is... for Sony. And Activision. Not Bungie. And I don't understand how anybody could possibly say 'because it made them more money as a business decision, it is not a betrayal.' Excuse me? That's absolutely idiotic to say! Since when does profit determine morality? I'll tell you when: Since never. Insomniac games making games for Playstation then making an Xbone exclusive? Yeah, that sucks. But guess what? That doesn't suddenly make it acceptable or make it any less of a betrayal that a completely different company is doing nearly the same thing. Again, a really stupid thing to imply otherwise. Later, he goes on to say he would request Sunset Overdrive were only on playstation, but doesn't because he is a 'rational human being.' To which I reply... an ignorant one. This, my friends, is a classic example of somebody only hearing what they want to hear. You see, this user seems to be completely ignoring the fact that Xbox users are NOT asking that Destiny be exclusive to the Xbox One. They are NOT asking that they be given exclusive content instead. What Xbox users ARE asking for is that everybody be given the SAME content. And for this video to say that such talk is irrational? This seems like a very ignorant and close-minded person. Edit: Please note that 5 hours later, this subthread has far too many replies for me to get to everybody. Too many people are replying to random posts and Bungie.net's layout is not conductive of a large discussion. Since notifications only link me to the most recent reply, it is very likely I will miss a lot of you because the subthread is too long and too confusing to scroll through, now. Apologies to those I seemingly ignore.
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  • [quote]I was an Xbox user, you just seem incapable of being objective. [/quote]We're in a conversation over opinions. An opinion is, by its very definition, subjective. But I won't claim you seem incapable of understanding that. I wouldn't want to sound like an ass, after all. [quote] A lot of the posts regarding Xbox and Bungie come across as puerile,and whiney, they serve no purpose other than to vent the spleen. [/quote]I've presented opinions and facts and history. If anything there sounds 'whiney' to you, then that is because you are ignoring the actual substance of the words. [quote] Not petty, realist.[/quote]Not being a realist, being petty.

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  • There is a lot of irony in your last post. Is it not possible to have an objective opinion?

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  • Edited by Z3N-me: 6/22/2014 11:53:20 AM
    Your being subjective, I'm being objective, it's business, no emotional involvement on my behalf. Your seeing content in my post that isn't there, at no point did I say you were puerile and whiney. No need to get spikey dude.

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  • [quote]Two words, Sunset Overdrive.[/quote]From the very post you replied to:[quote] Insomniac games making games for Playstation then making an Xbone exclusive? Yeah, that sucks. But guess what? That doesn't suddenly make it acceptable or make it any less of a betrayal that a completely different company is doing nearly the same thing. Again, a really stupid thing to imply otherwise. Later, he goes on to say he would request Sunset Overdrive were only on playstation, but doesn't because he is a 'rational human being.' To which I reply... an ignorant one. This, my friends, is a classic example of somebody only hearing what they want to hear. You see, this user seems to be completely ignoring the fact that Xbox users are NOT asking that Destiny be exclusive to the Xbox One. They are NOT asking that they be given exclusive content instead. What Xbox users ARE asking for is that everybody be given the SAME content. And for this video to say that such talk is irrational? This seems like a very ignorant and close-minded person.[/quote]

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  • Edited by Z3N-me: 6/22/2014 6:38:46 AM
    read my edited post, i pressed post before completing. I will add this though, all these posts complaining, what will it achieve, do you think it will change what has happened? No, all you can change is your perception to it, at the moment you are living in the past, you and many like you are hurting your selves emotionally over and over again, and secretly some of you like it, because some people enjoy being a victim. Not saying you are, just putting it out theere.

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  • Can you summarize your post into something a bit smaller? Just a friendly request. I see this subthread reaching the 100's and I still don't know what the big deal is. I have re read the post multiple times and am still having trouble understanding what the overall message was.

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  • [quote]Can you summarize your post into something a bit smaller? Just a friendly request. I see this subthread reaching the 100's and I still don't know what the big deal is. I have re read the post multiple times and am still having trouble understanding what the overall message was.[/quote]My pleasure. I actually just made an edit into my first post regarding that very issue, hah. Essentially, I find a great deal wrong with the video in the first post and find it offensive that this person would say that the past interactions with their community are irrelevant to the current situation because the fact is that Bungie used to be a community oriented company which is precisely why they had the admiration of so many people here. Ignoring the past means this person is clearly new to the Bungie community because no veteran would deem the things they have done as irrelevant- this person knows nothing of the history of this place. Due to this huge focus on community interaction, it hurt all the more when many of these users were essentially turned into internet-second-class-citizens. Bungie allowed a large part of their fanbase to become ostracized in an attempt to get new people in, and essentially that just sucks.

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  • Edited by The Fiddler: 6/22/2014 6:33:12 AM
    Ok. That's better. I can see where your coming from now. I agree with you about the video. I actually kind of like Datto and think that he can be one of the more rational people in a discussion. I think that the sad part comes in with the fact that, as I've already posted, he seems to be lashing out more than anything in this video. It's very unlike him. I understand his frustration, the #Destiny forums have been a little unruly as of late, but that's hardly cause for a video like this. As for my own opinion on the matter, it's a sensitive subject. Although I think you know that already. As a Bungie fan and an xbox player I'm slightly sad that exclusive content exists. But as a seasoned gamer it is also something that I've dealt with before. Knowing the nature of this kind of content it's probably going to be something that I don't even notice is missing. Thats is just my opinion. I think that Bungie will have plenty of opportunities to let the community as a whole shine in the future and if anything we know that Bungie is aware of the outcry. As you've said. Bungie is a community focused company in many ways. The problem for them right now has to be that Destiny doesn't really have a community just yet. At least not the same community that will exist when the full game launches and we get our hands on it. I feel that Bungie's attitude THEN, after launch, will be my deciding factor on all this.

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  • Question: would you still be speaking like this if Microsoft didn't change there mind about the xbox one when it was revealed? Quick answer: no, no you wouldn't. Hate Microsoft for initially creating an entertainment console when bungei was looking to the next generation to support there new born IP. Sony stayed true to the gamer and made a console for games and entertainment second, that's why bungei is with sony. So if you feel betrayed it's not because of sony or bungei or activision it's cause microsft failed.

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  • I see your point and I agree with you but see the ps4 as the new baby in the family. They are going to get more attention and get stuff that we won't but eventually we will be treated equally just give it time.

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  • This video actually contains a lot of logic, you probably can't see it due to your personal biases. Let me explain something to you. Bungie is a business, a producer, a developer, etc. You are the consumer, buyer, customer, receiver, etc. Buying Halo games does not make you some self-entitled, "loyal" player, it makes you a consumer. I understand that you may find sentiment and warm memories within the many hours of Halo. But you have to comprehend that just because you have "stuck by Bungie's side"(as if it was ever a difficult thing to do) does not mean you are entitled to whine and moan about a mutual business deal. You are getting the same game, that has been established. Why do people like you have to exaggerate timed content into this huge act of betrayal? Just listen to how selfish and petty you sound, taking a business move personally is flat out foolish and above all else immature. TL;DR: This isn't about [b]you[/b], this is about the success of Destiny and Bungie. So stop complaining about timed content, and do something productive with your time.

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  • Edited by burritosenior: 6/22/2014 5:32:09 AM
    [quote]Bungie is a business, a producer, a developer, etc. You are the consumer, buyer, customer, receiver, etc.[/quote][quote]This video goes on to talk about how it is a good business decision. And from a money standpoint, it is... for Sony. And Activision. Not Bungie. And I don't understand how anybody could possibly say 'because it made them more money as a business decision, it is not a betrayal.' Excuse me? That's absolutely idiotic to say! Since when does profit determine morality? I'll tell you when: Since never.[/quote][quote] Buying Halo games does not make you some self-entitled, "loyal" player, it makes you a consumer.[/quote]It makes you a loyal customer. Nothing about being self-entitlement in there. [quote]But you have to comprehend that just because you have "stuck by Bungie's side"(as if it was ever a difficult thing to do) does not mean you are entitled to whine and moan about a mutual business deal. You are getting the same game, that has been established. [/quote]See two above.[quote] Why do people like you have to exaggerate timed content into this huge act of betrayal? [/quote]So basically you're arguing that you are mad about the wording, and not the actual principle of the thing? I have to be blunt here... if you're going to just argue semantics, please go somewhere else. I don't care if someone thinks the word 'betrayal' is too 'extreme.' It's a word- and that's on them. The bottom line is that this is indeed a betrayal whether you like the word or not, and not talking about it will simply encourage it to keep happening.[quote] Just listen to how selfish and petty you sound, taking a business move personally is flat out foolish and above all else immature.[/quote]Just listen to how selfish and petty you sound, taking someone's feelings and history and calling them immature is flat out foolish. And immature, come to think of it! [quote] TL;DR: This isn't about [b]you[/b], this is about the success of Destiny and Bungie. So stop complaining about timed content, and do something productive with your time.[/quote]TL;DR This isn't a thread about [b]you[/b], this is a thread about the failure of Bungie. So stop complaining about people being upset about timed content, and do something productive with your time.

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  • Laughing at your claim that Bungie has failed. Bungie has created Destiny, a game that will most likely result in huge success and unprecedented fun for those who play it. I hope you are not one of those who will.

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  • [quote] I hope you are not one of those who will.[/quote]And for those of you reading this subthread, you can see a beautifully illustrated point. You see, my glorious readers, we have yet another person ignoring everything that was written as an opposing viewpoint that jumps straight to insulting the other person directly. When confronted with this, we go immediately into "I hope you never get to play this game." Thus continuing how rude this person is- which seems to be a trend in people that are arguing with me in this thread.

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  • Props

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  • You must have missed something. I think you should watch the video again .

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  • Wow! You do realize Bungie isn't your best friend? Do you realize that they are a business? You keep saying Bungie doesn't owe you anything, but by the sounds of it, you do think that. You had Bungie long enough with Halo. Now that PS has moved in, you can't share. Get over it, seriously.

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  • Um dude you can read right? He was saying he doesn't want it all actually he WANTS to share. But sharing means 50/50 not 75/25, btw if you watched the video Datto also says that the argument that we had Halo is irrelevant which it is. And to which your get over it can be sent right back at you. This person brings up a very good point, morally if Amazon is right with their placeholder it is Morally and Business wise, WRONG. Morally for obvious reasons since this is a multi-console game. Business wise since due to the nature of Destiny the DLC is no longer a valid option to get. And which will be the same for any further Playstation Timed Exclusive content if it is not released relatively soon afterwards unless it raises levelcaps and gives areas for those levels then it is a useless piece of DLC for a player to acquire thus will not spend their money on.

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  • You know... I have watched that video multiple times and find nothing to disagree with. Have you watched it? You most likely have. Bungie is a business. They develop games for money. Businesses do not have morality. Why? Because it evolved right out of them, that's Darwinism for ya. And after re-watching the video, I'm going to take Datto's view of when he sees someone bitching about this; I'm going to laugh. HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

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  • [quote]I have watched that video multiple times and find nothing to disagree with. Have you watched it? You most likely have.[/quote]I obviously have watched it if I was able to give you a step by step problem of everything wrong with the post. And if you find nothing to disagree with, then I would imagine you either didn't actually read my post, or are confusing "I do not feel this way" with "the logic is not sound." [quote]Businesses do not have morality.[/quote]Do you know what Enron was? They stole money from their company and left families devastated. Law aside, was that OK because business do not have morals and should only be concerned with money? [quote] HAHAHAHAHAHA!!![/quote]And you don't think that makes you a bad person? Think about it. People are genuinely upset. Regardless of whether you feel the same or not, you are laughing at other people being sad- laughing at other peoples' misery. For all intents in purposes, that makes you a bad person. Just something to ponder.

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  • Edited by JWilson: 6/23/2014 5:59:49 PM
    I do find the entire video logical. Even if it is a rant. So what? He has very valid points. XBox has had way more exclusive content with previous games than PS. Bungie shouldn't be the ones giving all there loyalty to XBox gamers, the gamers should. They made you an entire franchise of one of the best video game franchises. And everyone is having a little fit over a little exclusive content? It's nothing more than some armor, 1 Strike mission, and 1 MP map. And don't listen to Amazon, saying it comes to XBox in Fall of 2015, because it hasn't been confirmed by Bungie yet. With the point of Insomnia leaving PS, they are a business, they get to do what they want. Sure I would love to play Sunset Overdrive, but I can't because I don't have a XBox nor am I getting one. But I do not have a problem with Insomnia leaving. They made many games just for PS and now they are expanding their fan base. That is exactly what Bungie is doing with PS. Enron is irrelevant because Bungie is making decisions within the legal limit. Them stealing money from their own workers is wrong and that is my morality, I'm not a business. Enron's actions were lack of morality, which is ok only if they act within the legal limits. As for me being a bad person, you don't know me, you have never met me, I am some person in a different area of the world. So me laughing at people throwing a bitch fit over a little bit of exclusive content, is me being a bad person? What about people in "misery" over a little bit of exclusive content? Really in misery? Grow up if you're in misery over exclusive content, seriously.

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  • I played ONI and been a Bungie fan longer, they owe me. GOML scrub

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  • If you would like, [url=http://www.bungie.net/7_Lack-of-Damage-Control-Methods-Vs-Outcomes--A-Theo/en/Forum/Post?id=62621067]here is a link that discuses the move from the Mac to the Xbox[/url], which maintains the same logic as Oni. In addition to the fact that Oni was a single game and the historical significance isn't present. Also that Bungie lost the rights to Oni which is why they couldn't produce it again. Also that they were bought by Microsoft which is why they developed for Microsoft.

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  • Your argument is invalid, been a fan longer so they owe me more. Prove me wrong. You can't. [spoiler]don't use my join date either lol, it means nothing[/spoiler]

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  • [quote]Your argument is invalid, been a fan longer so they owe me more. Prove me wrong. You can't.[/quote]Alright I'll bite. I can't tell if you actually want me to give you a detailed response or not.

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