Auto are still good in pvp it’s just people we’re tired of the auto meta which was ridiculously long and boring.

Not sure about this. I religiously use auto rifles, seriously, I do. Halfdan-d is the auto rifle for the crucible. It is a high tier(by my extensive testing) and easily capable for raids, high score night falls. Use mine as an example. Look specifically at mine and what its strong point is. Hmmm... put that with a certain exotic armor... ultimate PvE weapon. 24000+ kills with it. Working on an age-old bond, to substitute. For now, it is my greatest weapon, I know it and the crucible knows it. With enough skill(like me) it can be used at a scout rifle's range. Misfit- PvE and it should stay that way. Use mine as an example. Mine can be used at a pulse rifle's range, but not reliable in the crucible because of ttk alone. Tigerspite is an all-rounder but more for PvE. Hazard has not been common to me, only have one, and not the best roll. Further specimens are needed to draw a conclusion. Ether doctor- this is one that needs work, in fact 600 rpms are the worst. They try too hard to be good at everything and end up failing everything. They are still good... in PvE. All bullets need to be precision in PvP for any chance to kill.

Agree with the pve buff. Not pvp. If they buff autos it will be an auto meta in a day. Mid fire rate pulses need a range nerf. Bygones needs nerfed directly in pvp i dont know what it is with that gun but it aint right. Hella op. Autos are good where they are. Maybe they could stand to take one or two less bullets to kill in pvp … maybe.

So many good auto rifles. Can't use 90% of them in the Crucible. It irritates the crap out of me that they can never balance these weapons.

Autos and Scouts both. D2Y1 had its 450 Auto meta, but Autos got left in the dust when Pulses were tuned up during the damage rework. I used to be in the anti-Auto camp, but with the lower TTK and upward trend in damage output there's no reason Autos should be [i]worse[/i] than they were pre-2.0. Since they don't require the timing of individual trigger pulls I still think they should have [u]some[/u] skill curve, and recoil is a necessary element to keep them from being TOO hot (again looking at the 450 meta), but they could definitely use some minor tweaks to stability, accuracy, and a slight AA bump to keep them pointing in the right direction. I haven't been running Autos much lately, but decided to get my Titan back into aggressive CQ play for PvE and took Suros Regime (with the slow higher-damage perk) out for a run in some Strikes and a few Gambit matches yesterday...that gun was one of my favourite D1 Exotics, but in D2 I have a hard time even running minor mid-range crowd control with it. (I don't even bother with Misfit or Ether Doctor, and recently scrapped my Hazard of the Cast - I have a decent Tigerspite, but rarely find a reason to use it over a similarly-rolled Duke for clearing ads.) Of course, much of that is range - since PvP and PvE adjustments are tied to each other, Autos in PvE are operating on PvP-tuned values (just as Pulses in PvP are operating on PvE-tuned values). A simple scaling factor to account for Crucible maps being smaller than Strike arenas or Patrol areas would do a lot to both bring up Autos in PvE and tame certain Pulse archetypes in PvP without affecting the weapons' overall effectiveness. (This would also allow Scouts to take their rightful spot as the kings of ranged play, take some of the bite out of long-range Ace shots or Shotgun spam in Crucible, and if done correctly even reduce the AoE from Nova Warp enough to keep it viable in PvE without continuing to be the team-wiping free pass it is now - a lot of things in this game would be better if Bungie could figure out how to apply an 0.5x modifier to pretty much everything in PvP.) Scouts are a whole separate can of worms - as a heavy D1 Scout main, ranged precision weapons only work for crowd control if they can reliably one-crit infantry-class ads, and right now most of them require 2 crits for Tier 2 Infantry (red-bar Vandals, Acolytes, Goblins/Hobgoblins, etc.) in the absence of an active damage-buff perk. Especially with Goblins and Hobgoblins, which cover their crit spots or go invulnerable after the first shot, having to waste bullets or time negates the entire point of ranged precision play - instead of taking out 4 Hobgoblin snipers with 4 shots, I end up shooting the first one, waiting 3 seconds, then finishing it off while the other 3 continue to shoot at my teammates (or me, bouncing my reticle all over the place). In D1 running a Scout meant aiming for the head, squeezing the trigger, and acquiring the next target before the hit even registered - in D2, that process now involves staying on the first target twice as long and hoping it doesn't duck behind cover or go into a crit-less state that requires 3-5 body shots to finish it off, burning through a mag on a half-dozen trash mobs. The problem with the current meta is that it did things backwards - Pulses have replaced Autos as a burst-fire [i]ranged[/i] weapon, and HCs have replaced Scouts as a [i]CQ[/i] precision weapon, which has virtually eliminated both fast-paced run-and-gun Auto-style play and long-range precision play in favor of mashing everything into mid-ranged engagements where only certain weapons consistently perform well (too close for Scouts, too far for Autos, but it's just right for Bygones and Luna). I'm all for different weapons getting a chance to shine, but Destiny metas always seem to do so at the expense of pushing every other weapon type into the background.

I think the problem is partly that autos are too bad, but also partly that pulses are too good. Specifically, range. Pulses are not medium range weapons, they're medium to long range. They eat the range at which scouts are supposed to be effective.

600 rpm aren’t too bad, and suros regime with spinning up is pretty solid. They aren’t the best but they’re definitely not he worst

You're absolutely right. Right now the only and most effective Auto Rifle (In my opinion) is Ghost Primus. It's reliable enough that I even use it religiously on Raids and High-End PvE content.

Yes I want my red Spectre back

The biggest reason they are so bad is because their body shot damage is terrible compared to D1

Ehh It's a slippery slope