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Edited by Spawn: 11/17/2018 6:15:49 PM
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Gambit Ideas - Give players more ways to affect outcome?

So, the majority of Gambit gameplay revolves around one goal: bank 75 motes and kill your Primeval first. For the time I've spent in Gambit, this has started to become a bit bland. The ability to invade and stall the enemy team's progress towards this goal is a neat wildcard, but I think it can be taken a few steps further to allow for more varied gameplay strategies and outcomes beyond the repetitive meta strategies that have developed up to this point. An idea I thought might be a good way to spice up the gameplay would be to give teams the ability to attain a variety of offensive and/or defensive buffs for themselves (both PvP and PvE related), things like: - [b][u]double invasion[/u][/b] (allow two team mates to invade at the same time) - [b][u]portal blocking[/u][/b] (block enemy portal for a time) - [b][u]invader signal flare[/u][/b] (when invaded, a signal flare shoots into the sky above invader) - [b][u]mote theft[/u][/b] (when invading, you can rob up to 15 motes from enemy's Primeval bank) - [b][u]backup motes[/u][/b] (motes aren't lost if you die, only lasts for one death) - [b][u]team overshield[/u][/b] (grants an overshield to the team) - [b][u]Primeval bank defenses[/u][/b] (bank emits arc damage for a time when enemy is detected) Those are just some of my initial ideas, though I'm sure Bungie or the community could come up with some even more creative things to implement. To activate these buffs, you'd have to deposit your motes, not into the main Primeval bank, but a separate bank located somewhere else on the map. Depending on how many buffs you want to allow for a team, there may be several of these banks scattered about the map. Once the required threshold is met, the buff would be activated. Overall, the idea here is to give teams more ways to play the game so that the strategy to quickly bank 75 and burn the boss isn't the only way to go about winning. With some of these buffs, a team that sticks to that strategy might seriously suffer from one that is splitting their efforts between banking 75 for the Primeval, and double invasions. Additionally, I've tried to think of some tradeoffs for some of these potential buffs as well, something to discourage spamming of any one buff so that the main goal of banking 75 is still in fact the MAIN objective, and choosing NOT to work towards it comes with a cost. For instance, with: - [b][u]Double Invasion[/u][/b]: Two players can invade, but doing so also spawns 2 glowing enemies for the other team. The idea here is that if the two invaders wipe the other team, then they're able to catch back up a bit by killing those glowing enemies that are worth more motes. Alternately, if the invaders fail to do much killing, then they've just given the enemy team a potential mote advantage. - [b][u]Portal Blocking[/u][/b]: Essentially blocks enemy invasions for a set time (maybe 15, 30, and 45 seconds or something like that, depending on the # of motes deposited at once). If an enemy portal is active when the buff is triggered, it'll be disabled and then return after the duration. The tradeoff here is that activating a portal block also triggers a blocker on your own Primeval bank (Phalanx, Knight, or Ogre, again depending on the motes deposited), so, again, not something you'll want to spam, but instead use strategically. - [b][u]Invader Signal Flare[/u][/b]: Flare shoots into the sky, signaling general location of enemy invader, but the invader is now invisible to radar. - [b][u]Mote Theft[/u][/b]: As an invader, you can steal up to 15 motes (however much you have room to carry) from enemy team's Primeval bank. However, this action takes 5-7 seconds to accomplish, and if you die, the motes you had aren't just lost, they are subtracted from your own Primeval bank. Enemy team is also given textual and audible cues when a robbery is taking place, so, an attempt at stealing motes without killing anyone first would be highly risky. - [b][u]Backup Motes[/u][/b]: On your next death, any motes you were carrying are returned to you. If you die from an invader, you'll lose half. I honestly don't think this one needs a tradeoff aspect to it. - [b][u]Team Overshield[/u][/b]: Grants your team an overshield that stays active until taken down by damage. This is another one I don't think needs a tradeoff. - [b][u]Primeval Bank Defenses[/u][/b]: Bank is equipped with an arc energy wave emitter that triggers when a blocker or enemy invader is detected. Lasts 30 seconds once triggered. Also one I don't feel needs a tradeoff. As you might have noticed, all the buffs that have some sort of direct effect on the enemy team (basically, the PvP-related buffs) have a tradeoff of some kind, but the ones that don't have much, if any direct effect on the enemy team (basically PvE-related), don't have tradeoffs, as they're fairly minor. All of them however, would have a limitation on the # of times they can be activated. One thing that could be an issue with this overall idea of adding buffs and more objectives to Gambit is that, if people have more things to bank motes for, then the primary goal of banking 75 and killing the Primeval is going to take longer to get to, thereby extending the total time spent playing a single round. People don't want to spend too much time playing one match, and there are already plenty of complaints about how much people hate having to play a 3rd tiebreaker round, SO, with that said, I had a couple of ideas to help alleviate that potential issue: 1) A portion of motes banked towards buffs are also deposited to the main Primeval bank. 2) Reduce Primeval bank requirement from 75 to something like 50 or 60. 3) Limitation on not only the # of times each single buff can be activated, but also the TOTAL # of buffs that can be activated. So, for example, I listed 7 buffs above - we could set a limit of 2 activations on each buff, but a total limit of 7 activations (allowing for each one to be activated once, if desired). 4) All/combination of 1-3. Anyway, I know that was a long post so that's all I have for now. If you've made it this far, I'd love to know your thoughts and/or your own ideas! Feel free to suggest tweaks to anything I've posted - I tried to come up with things I thought would be fair and reasonable but there may certainly be things I didn't consider that could cause problems. Thanks for any and all feedback! [spoiler]Moderator edit: This thread has been moved to #Feedback forum so that other Destiny players can weigh in.  [url=https://www.bungie.net/en/Forum/Post/139533839/0/0] See Cozmo's thread here[/url] for more information about the #Feedback tag and its uses. Feel free to private message the moderator who moved your post, link to topic for further clarification about why this topic was moved.[/spoiler]

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  • Not a fan of double invasion, everything is else a good start.

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  • Edited by CatMan: 11/20/2018 7:19:18 AM
    - [b][u]double invasion[/u][/b] (allow two team mates to invade at the same time) Two overshielded enemies? Oh good no - [b][u]portal blocking[/u][/b] (block enemy portal for a time) Interested - [b][u]invader signal flare[/u][/b] (when invaded, a signal flare shoots into the sky above invader) Maps would have to be way bigger.... And design better. - [b][u]mote theft[/u][/b] (when invading, you can rob up to 15 motes from enemy's Primeval bank) There's a timmer tho. If I could leave when I decided? Maybe - [b][u]backup motes[/u][/b] (motes aren't lost if you die, only lasts for one death) Cool - [b][u]team overshield[/u][/b] (grants an overshield to the team) Cool, but warlock kinda alreadyhave that. I hate when teammates don't grab it. - [b][u]Primeval bank defenses[/u][/b] (bank emits arc damage for a time when enemy is detected) I don't get this one. [u]I wish: [/u] Enemies Ai damage output was more consistent across the board. Some rounds they are ok other rounds they one shot? Wtaf Maps were bigger...and design better. Magnet motes. Sick if having to run over them twice to pick them up. Mote detection. If I'm near and I got the kill, only I should be able to get them if I'm with in range. If I'm out of range let my team get them. If I'm not holding motes the invader shouldn't see me. Ammo was more consistent. Sick of ammo droughts ....idk what else, really I'd rather have PoE back...with a solo option.

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  • bump

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  • Edited by x-MISANTHROPIC-x: 11/18/2018 5:57:20 PM
    Gambit matches take far to long. There's way to many ranks to grind through. Rewards are shit and need looked at. An exotic, Forsaken, should be awared each time you reset your rank. The game mode at present feels stale.

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  • [quote] - [b][u]double invasion[/u][/b] (allow two team mates to invade at the same time) - [b][u]portal blocking[/u][/b] (block enemy portal for a time) - [b][u]invader signal flare[/u][/b] (when invaded, a signal flare shoots into the sky above invader) - [b][u]mote theft[/u][/b] (when invading, you can rob up to 15 motes from enemy's Primeval bank) - [b][u]backup motes[/u][/b] (motes aren't lost if you die, only lasts for one death) - [b][u]team overshield[/u][/b] (grants an overshield to the team) - [b][u]Primeval bank defenses[/u][/b] (bank emits arc damage for a time when enemy is detected) [/quote] Double Invasion is a horrible idea. Even if it was restricted to a special portal that would only spawn if you were 50 motes behind the other team. One thing I’ve noticed a trend in when queuing up solo is that there are those who go in only for the PvP. These are the ones who consistently wipe the other team, camp the heavy spawn and portal, and have little to no motes banked. They are there solely for the invasions. Put in double invaders and they will intentionally wait just to double invade. Portal blocking - you would have to forfeit valuable motes just to block an invader when you could be 15 motes closer to your prime evil. Just deal with the invader. Even if I have 15 motes, when the invader shows up, I’m aggressively hunting him down. Portal blocking sounds like a crutch for those who don’t know how to deal with the PvP side of Gambit. Invader signal flare - it already blares a horn and puts a timer on your screen. Yes, their wall hack is annoying, but it adds to the thrill of the hunt for the defenders. I’m no PvP pro, but I’ve become lethal at hunting down and blindsiding the invader. Mote Thief - I like the idea. But to steal 15 motes, you cannot kill any defender. (Would be damned hard to steal with a flare being shot off over head btw - just touching on the previous point). Backup Motes - this takes away the risk of collecting motes to bank the full 15. This is Gambit. It’s supposed to be risky. Team overshield - come on. Now you are just begging for easy defense. Man up. Prime Evil bank defense - why? Mote Thief is a decent idea. He is already trying to be sneaky, and steal motes instead of killing the other team. It’s real fast to get back to the center of the map and defend, so the thief is an easy target. Why does the bank itself need a defense mechanism? Then you could ignore the invader and keep collecting motes while your bank does the work. ——— Now for other ideas posted that sounded good and some ideas I have - Ascendant Realm - I like it. Not sure the best way to implement, but it could be if you make it to round 3, it takes place in the ascendant realm. Or during round 3 a special portal opens that two guardians from each side can enter to battle each other and special enemies for additional rewards for your whole team. Revamp invading/defending - if you invade and wipe the entire team, you return with 15 motes. If you kill 2 of 4 and return without being killed, you return with 5 motes. 3 of 4 nets you 10 motes. On the other side of that coin, if you kill the invader before they can kill anyone on your team, they drop 10 motes. If they kill 1 of 4 and then you kill them, they drop 7 motes. 2 or more and they only drop the standard 3. (The point to this is to increase both the risk and reward of invading) Also, invading during Prime Evil damage phase revamp. If motes are no longer a reward or risk, as in both teams have their prime evil, the invaders kills heal the prime evil as normal, but if the invader is killed without killing anyone of the defending team, it heals the invaders prime evil by 30%. If he kills 1 before being killed, his prime evil is healed by 15%. 2 or more before being killed, no health restoration for his prime evil. The idea on my revamp is to make invading more risky and rewarding. Right now with the right setup, 3 can easily melt their prime evil while the 4th invaded to either stall and distract the other team or kill them to heal their prime evil without risk.

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    • I am not really convinced on these. I like gambit as it is, I would however introduce weekly or even daily weapon limitations, like no linear fusion rifles day, no supers day, etc. Variety could be hilarious.

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      • This is a really good post. Some good ideas and some not so good but all in all it seems like you put a lot of thought into this and thats good. My suggestion is if you're a hunter and someone invades, if you go invisible the invader should not be able to see you. The invader has too much of an advantage sometimes.

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        • 100% agree with handyandy666, mayhem gambit would be a great way to spice things up. Let's be honest even with these changes it would get old after a long time; so making it a different gamemode would help change it up. This could be a thing that gets added with curse week! Just adding to the mayhem of getting the butthole to spawn. Absolutely think this is a much needed addition, and may actually get me to step into gambit. [spoiler]also add gambit to private matches...[/spoiler]

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          • I can get on board with all of these except "double invasion". Sorry I don't want to contend with two people using sleeper...it's already hard enough to chase them down when they run away.

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            • Edited by TripleJ: 11/17/2018 5:30:01 PM
              Add a relic-like buff similar to vault of glass's that when used, reflects attacks (rockets, linear fusion shots, etc. but not grenades or melee attacks from supers) back at the invader, forcing them to change their tactics rather than relying solely on heavy.

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              • All bit that double invasion screw that already enough problems dealing with one person that has a queensbreaker or crooked gang. We don't need two.

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                • Edited by AlieN_x_HuMaN: 11/17/2018 3:21:23 PM
                  I like where youre taking this...get it... I think these are good starters for thought. Not sure if theyre practical. My initial thought. Tho I realize that pve'rs wont like this, is for a 2v2 on a 3rd map to gain a buff of some kind on kill. Maybe a mini survival 2v2 inside the Drifters grab bag. Or maybe when the teams bank 50 motes everyone goes into his ascendant realm (cause you just know hes got one..) or somewhere and has a knockout fight for buffs. I do think that an invader with a ranged linear fusion is boring. I mean i like it cause i kill 3-5 guardians nearly every invasion... but it is stale. Maybe a mechanic like crimson doubles.. Idk. Its really difficult because of the huge skill gap in gambit. With my clan teamed up we win every single game and the boss dies in less than a second. While the other team is still banking motes. Not trying to be funny. Thats the reality.

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                  • Edited by Chubbums: 11/17/2018 8:03:13 AM
                    Invasions should be high risk high reward. As it stands there is no drawback to invading unless you have a crap team that can't kill simple adds without you. Leaving your arena should strengthen damage the enemies do against your teammates, unless your side has an invader present. It should also weaken the adds when an invader come through. It would definitely balance out the game more.

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                    • I would like to see some “relics” thrown into the mix. The Aegis, Vex Craniums, Hive Swords, Siva Charges.. all that fun stuff.

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                      • These would be great additions to a mode that is already getting tired. I think they should have multiple ‘modes’ in Gambit where different changes you’ve suggested can pop up. Keep the classic Gambit mode and then add different ones with slight objective changes. Have them cycle randomly. Here are some rough ideas like: Banking motes lets you invade to bank motes into cages holding very strong enemies to unleash on the enemy that roams the map. A mode more focussed on invasion and PvP trying to steal motes against each other with enemies around. A mode where periodically a guardian from each team is teleported into a one on one fight for a mote boost. Multiple smaller banks around the map that need to be filled to unlock your main bank. Each time a small bank is filled to capacity, a lock disengages on the main bank, but that summons a mini boss that must be killed before the next small bank can be filled. Just something to add variety to Gambit as it’s already getting old. Currently it’s really just a game of who can invade best with a long range weapon.

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                        • Good ideas. Unfortunately those ideas would require coding and troubleshooting that Bungie is less than willing at times to invest the time and money to make them. Hopefully with the new season they make some changes. Once I hit 3rd reset I’m done with gambit unless there is a damn good reason.

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                          • I think the entire team should be able to invade; a rap battle or dance off would then ensue because it's hard for a guardian to get respeck up in these streets.

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                            • Edited by MrsCryptarch: 11/17/2018 11:56:27 PM
                              I like your idea of “Mote Theft”.

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                            • They should make a place where you can go find orbs that are placed randomly across the map like ascendants chests in the dreaming city. Except they can have like 20 spawns so it’s not overpowered. It can either take some health or give you a better buff

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                            • So i didnt read the whole thing but i get the idea your going for. As a sepperate playlist I do like the idea, its ghimicky but in a good way. The problem, and probably ony problem i see with something like that. Is the tone. Ghimicky powerups make modes like that varied and fun wich is awesome but how would that fit with the tone?

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                            • Enjoyed reading through this one! I’ve sent it over to the Feedback forum so our hosts can definitely take a look at some of these ideas.

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                              • How about multiple primevals and banks. Bigger maps with more than one type of enemy. Or AI enemies can attack your bank and steal motes. Gambit needs multiple strategies to force better team cohesion and can be tuned so players need to think about load outs, especially class abilities. I'd like to see old raid bosses pop up for mega matches where the stakes are higher and rewards are as well. Just a few thoughts

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                              • Also when I invade I don't want the drifter to teleport me out in 15 seconds, people run and hide to much gimme some time to sniff em out.

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                              • Mayhem gambit

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                                • Or, how about we make gambit kinetic weapons only

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                                  • Great idea

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